I reckon Grimes is gone for sure helped by some ok form the last few weeks . who s the carrot being offered up ? It will be either gws or goldy that we trade with , picks ? Grimes , a ruckman maybe ? Or watts ? Time will tell , imagine what we could get for Hogan

I don't understand what Grimes has to do to please some people here?

He wasn't picked for Round 1, forced his way back into the side had some ok games. Forced his way back in again until injured. Made to play back at Casey again for a couple of weeks. Made his way back into the team and has had good games since while having good possession numbers. He has even been picked as sub a few times which is a terrible decision by Roos, when he came on he has made an impact and deserved to be playing the full game.

I reckon Grimes is gone for sure helped by some ok form the last few weeks . who s the carrot being offered up ? It will be either gws or goldy that we trade with , picks ? Grimes , a ruckman maybe ? Or watts ? Time will tell , imagine what we could get for Hogan

Why would you bother?

I agree with with Barra. Grimes is a spare parts player. I doubt you would get much for him. He remains useful for Melbourne's depth. I look forward to the day when we have a better backup backman but for now who would you put in the side if Salem or Jetta were injured? Terlich? ummmm...

Roos has mentioned effort many, many times over the past few years.

His responses last night were nothing we haven't heard before. The only difference is that there's a lot of non-answers in between those damning answers so you all forget it. Many times last year he noted the lack of effort, and he has a few times this year as well

yep, its the players who throw they're hands up when under the pump, should be the first out. the ones who back down when things are against them. skiils or not, these ones are the first to let down the team.

have to be goers first, to earn the jumper; then class starts to take over from there, but not if you don't have the 'ticka' for the fight.

Grimes has some flaws yes, but he isn't the first who should go.

The only reason i would lose Grimes is because he does has some trade value, but clearly only if the deal is worth it.

We have only 22 players on the PL that are not Roos-era recruits.

That number will fall again for 2016 (to approx. 14 or 15) and by the year after might only be made up of 8 or 9 players. With Kent, Viney, Hogan, and Toumpas arriving the year before Roos came included in that 8 or 9. N Jones, Dunn, McDonald, Watts, and Gawn being the only pre-2012 recruits that look like staying through the Roos-era.

That is a complete teardown rebuild in 3 years.

It is hard to get your head around but it tells me how far back we are coming from compared to other teams doing a similar rebuild.

Roos flags more changes?

I'm shocked.

We have only 22 players on the PL that are not Roos-era recruits.

That number will fall again for 2016 (to approx. 14 or 15) and by the year after might only be made up of 8 or 9 players. With Kent, Viney, Hogan, and Toumpas arriving the year before Roos came included in that 8 or 9. N Jones, Dunn, McDonald, Watts, and Gawn being the only pre-2012 recruits that look like staying through the Roos-era.

That is a complete teardown rebuild in 3 years.

It is hard to get your head around but it tells me how far back we are coming from compared to other teams doing a similar rebuild.

When Roos came on board I knew there would be a re-build but I just hadn't really considered how deep it would be and as you allude to it is another demolition job.

Basically 2007-2012 drafting a complete write-off which we all knew, but you think about how far behind we are because of this it is quite scary.

When Roos came on board I knew there would be a re-build but I just hadn't really considered how deep it would be and as you allude to it is another demolition job.

Basically 2007-2012 drafting a complete write-off which we all knew, but you think about how far behind we are because of this it is quite scary.

Yes, it's something I thought about last week with all the huff over Roos' remarks - I think he realised this before we did - the early naming of first year players above more seasoned bodies is not Roos' style at all but he gave JKH and Salem games very early last year and did the same for Brayshaw, ANB, and Stretch this year.

With the list changing so much that there is the prospect he will leave it with just 5 pre-2012 recruits, I think Roos struggles when we bring up the failure of the past decade - it's a different list and club, still struggling but not suffering from the same problems of the 2007-2013 era.

I don't think he likes the 'lumping in' of 2014-15 into 2007-13.

Edited September 1, 201510 yr by rpfc

Grimes has a knock on his disposal lets face facts . The modern game demands that you can hit a target off half back . I wouldnt be upset if he stayed and improved this area of his game . But i think he would be the carrot that may appease a gws or goldy .

Think we might see dawes, howe, garland and maybe even watts gone as trades and the delistings are obvious.

Sensational? I love the bloke, but he's gotten slower and slower as the year has gone on. Against Freo he was caught a few times in the first quarter, then once the game was won he was left to just rack up easy possessions as a loose man because Freo knew he wouldn't do any damage with his disposal. 27 uncontested disposals. Don't be seduced by the high possession count.

m8, Cross is the least of the worries. His intercept marks alone have saved us from much more embarrassment than we already received. One more year? More than happy too.

I don't understand what Grimes has to do to please some people here?

He wasn't picked for Round 1, forced his way back into the side had some ok games. Forced his way back in again until injured. Made to play back at Casey again for a couple of weeks. Made his way back into the team and has had good games since while having good possession numbers. He has even been picked as sub a few times which is a terrible decision by Roos, when he came on he has made an impact and deserved to be playing the full game.

Grimes has a knock on his disposal lets face facts . The modern game demands that you can hit a target off half back . I wouldnt be upset if he stayed and improved this area of his game . But i think he would be the carrot that may appease a gws or goldy .

He's not a leader.

He doesn't have elite disposal.

Be very surprised if another club wanted him.

Sadly he's not alone.

Our club is riddled with garbage that some rate so highly.

Please don't anyone forget some of our performances this year.

We have only 22 players on the PL that are not Roos-era recruits.

That number will fall again for 2016 (to approx. 14 or 15) and by the year after might only be made up of 8 or 9 players. With Kent, Viney, Hogan, and Toumpas arriving the year before Roos came included in that 8 or 9. N Jones, Dunn, McDonald, Watts, and Gawn being the only pre-2012 recruits that look like staying through the Roos-era.

That is a complete teardown rebuild in 3 years.

It is hard to get your head around but it tells me how far back we are coming from compared to other teams doing a similar rebuild.

Exactly.... People don't realise the enormity of virtually a complete rebuild of a footy club...

He's not a leader.

He doesn't have elite disposal.

Be very surprised if another club wanted him.

Sadly he's not alone.

Our club is riddled with garbage that some rate so highly.

Please don't anyone forget some of our performances this year.

It's unfortunate but he's another player who had talent but was poorly developed & the captaincy at a young age ... Honestly ...

Roos makes a good point we are the only league in the world were clubs have to develop players to play senior level.. Europe soccer teams have academies, U.S. had the high school & college systems....

I said it after we lost to the Giants the first time last year and will repeat it now.
The draft class of 2009 through 2011 is a write off.
Supporters have every right to ask how could we still be so woeful after all the high draft picks we have received. The whys no long matter. The facts are that we are still woeful on the playing front. We need to be like an alcoholic who is finally owning up to our problem. Acceptance is the first step.
Last year after the first Eagles loss, I think Roos realized the magnitude of the task in front of he and the coaching staff and it showed in his presser after the game. He was genuinely rattled. It was the realization that he was building from Ground Zero of a crash site.
The team of 2013 was, as much as some on the board might hate me saying Greg Denham was right, the Melbourne Bears. We were bloody lucky that GWS were in the league that year as that Melbourne team was as putrid as anything I have ever seen. It was Sydney 1992/1993 stuff.
With that realization in mind, cuts still need to be made to the list. Some of the 'future' that was sold to us in 2009 now needs to be moved on while they still have currency. A clean out of ten fringe players will just be papering over the cracks again. Time to move on some blokes who have merely been biding their time without achieving their full potential.

m8, Cross is the least of the worries. His intercept marks alone have saved us from much more embarrassment than we already received. One more year? More than happy too.

I'm not saying he's a problem, I love the bloke, but he's just getting slower and slower now, which in our team is not helpful. He's been playing as a loose backman for a while now, and I would hope that would be a role we're looking at getting rid of next year.

Think we might see dawes, howe, garland and maybe even watts gone as trades and the delistings are obvious.

Dawes would be close to untradeable the way his knee was buckling a few weeks ago, and on Watts - you're having a laugh.

Like he will be traded now. Clubs will not give up the equivalent that the club now sees in him.

He's not a leader.

He doesn't have elite disposal.

Be very surprised if another club wanted him.

Sadly he's not alone.

Our club is riddled with garbage that some rate so highly.

Please don't anyone forget some of our performances this year.

Works both ways.

m8, Cross is the least of the worries. His intercept marks alone have saved us from much more embarrassment than we already received. One more year? More than happy too.

This. He has been essential to the team this year, and remarkable for his work ethic and leadership by example. There is no way they will cut him loose, and I suspect will do everything needed to keep him at the club beyond his playing years. He is enormously respected at the club by players and coaches alike, someone who eats and breathes footy in the best possible way.

Works both ways.

Are you referring to some of us?

Exactly.... People don't realise the enormity of virtually a complete rebuild of a footy club...

And not just rebuilding the playing list. Back of house has had to be completely rebuilt, too. I've been told by a consultant who does some work for the MFC that virtually the whole list of club employees (ie, non-playing staff) has been turned over in the time since Peter Jackson started. And the coaching/development list has been thoroughly overhauled, too.

It's unfortunate but he's another player who had talent but was poorly developed & the captaincy at a young age ... Honestly ...

Roos makes a good point we are the only league in the world were clubs have to develop players to play senior level.. Europe soccer teams have academies, U.S. had the high school & college systems....

If he had raw talent we would be seeing it under the Roos/Goodwin/McCartney regime. He's not that good, time to go. And no, he's not alone. But while we continues to play them we can only expect more of the same.

The club needs to put their names on the trade table and make the results public.

- No club expressed any interest in you.

- Or pick 74 was offered.

Give them the reality check they need.

I'm sick of them, and while they remain we will remain a mess.

If he had raw talent we would be seeing it under the Roos/Goodwin/McCartney regime. He's not that good, time to go. And no, he's not alone. But while we continues to play them we can only expect more of the same.

The club needs to put their names on the trade table and make the results public.

- No club expressed any interest in you.

- Or pick 74 was offered.

Give them the reality check they need.

I'm sick of them, and while they remain we will remain a mess.

That sounds very Mark Neeldesque.

Tell the players exactly how crap they are, give them no inspiration at all to even bother after that, then destroy any ability to attract any mediocre player and get stuck with Sellar, Gillies, etc.

That sounds very Mark Neeldesque.

Tell the players exactly how crap they are, give them no inspiration at all to even bother after that, then destroy any ability to attract any mediocre player and get stuck with Sellar, Gillies, etc.

'Moneyball'.