If that is there offer it means that there is interest and that is their starting point.

The MFC boys have shown that they can negotiate with the best.

Suggest that the counter offer will be Shiel, Bugg and pick 9.

Now that would be interesting.

Yep, surely the opening stanza, otherwise some sort of joke.

20 for vince is a lot better than we have done in the past.

L. Cook 12

C. Morton 4

Gysberts first round can't remember exact number

Blease 17

Strauss 19

We could go way back

Luke Molan

Edit : I forgot Morton

pick 20 for Vince is a bit overs imo (given he will play for 3 years then probably retire).

If it allows us to get Lyons for a pittance, then it'd make it a bit easier to swallow.

pick 20 for Vince is a bit overs imo (given he will play for 3 years then probably retire).

If it allows us to get Lyons for a pittance, then it'd make it a bit easier to swallow.

It's about getting our team (and in particular the midfield) as competitive as possible for next season while helping some of our younger mids develop by not having to be relied on as our no. 2 or 3 mids. Don't worry, there will be more draft picks next year and the year after - if we get 3 solid years out of Vince, then that's a win.

It's about getting our team (and in particular the midfield) as competitive as possible for next season while helping some of our younger mids develop by not having to be relied on as our no. 2 or 3 mids. Don't worry, there will be more draft picks next year and the year after - if we get 3 solid years out of Vince, then that's a win.

Many a point there overlooked my many unfortunately. Youd have to be a wiz to nail the trade period to your absolute advantage. There will be a bit of give and take. Its really how you end up overall as a result of the player-fest.

We need a framework within which a team can develop and grow. Players like Vince and Cross help in this respect. Suddenly Jonesy , Dimitri, Michie and who ever else, get a bit of breathing room.

Vince for 20 may be a rich overs and he may only be with us for 3 years BUT he would be our 2nd best mid next year unless we see our of sight improvement from the younger guys.

All year we have lamented getting belted abs said we need to get competitive quickly for tv ratings for supporters and for our bottom line and longevity.

This trade will help us do that.

I understand we need midfielders and believe Vince would add to our team, but we should not be going after fairly average 28 year olds that cost high draft picks and command a big salary for four years IMO.

We throw in Jamar, Tapscott and Bail which makes room on our list for draft picks.

Jamar or bail is fine with me. I'd keep tapscott, still think he has something to offer and might surprise a few critics on demonland next year.

Even gun players have an off year and Bernie fell out with the administration after his naked party antics on the grog.

So you would see him as a direct replacement for Col Sylvia then ?

Pick 20 is probably just about the limit of what I'd be willing to pay for Vince.

Although he is 28 he'll come straight into the side as our second best midfielder. On the other hand, if we go to the draft with 20 and pick up a kid, he may never play a game for us and the odds that he'll make an impact in the next two or three years are slight.

Knowing that we'll have to pay overs for almost every player we are luring to the club, pick 20 is probably okay but I'd rather we work out a deal such as pick 20 and our fourth rounder for Vince and Lyons.

Bernie Vince would be close to our best midfielder if he came to our club to give up pick 20 for him isn't overs. If he was going to another club that had an established midfield then yes pick 20 may be overs but the fact is in 2013 we had only one consistent AFL standard midfielder. The best thing about 2014 this sole midfielder will have friends from who we trade in and the development of Viney/Toumpas/Trengove. If we can walk away next Friday with Vince, Michie and a couple of others we start to see a midfield that should be able to compete next year.

Vince for 20 may be a rich overs and he may only be with us for 3 years BUT he would be our 2nd best mid next year unless we see our of sight improvement from the younger guys.

All year we have lamented getting belted abs said we need to get competitive quickly for tv ratings for supporters and for our bottom line and longevity.

This trade will help us do that.

I agree that pick 20 is a bit steep for a 3 year player and yet its still worth it given our situation.

However the trade value should not be determined on how much we need him but his value as a player.

I would like Melbourne to play hardball maybe make them throw in Lyons for another late pick or get pick 30 somehow and make a straight swap for Vince.

I will understand if we trade pick 20 for him because he is what we need but I would rather we push Adelaide and make a trade equal to his true value.

Vince for 20 may be a rich overs and he may only be with us for 3 years BUT he would be our 2nd best mid next year unless we see our of sight improvement from the younger guys.

All year we have lamented getting belted abs said we need to get competitive quickly for tv ratings for supporters and for our bottom line and longevity.

This trade will help us do that.

what about Vince for the Sylvia compo pick?

Or Vince + P42 to us, for P20 ?

A bit of history of pick 20 2003-10 and the number of games for each player

Butler. 108

Polo. 77

Bower. 70

Hislop. 27

Notte. 2

Swift. 34

Fyfe. 72

Pitt. 10

With Fyfe being the standout exception, which of those players would you have starting their careers with us now rather than grabbing Vince?

Assuming Bernie averages, say 18 games a year, for the next 3 then we get 54 games from a 188cm/86kg experienced midfielder who will walk into our side as the 2nd best midfielder. Nathan Jones must be a very happy boy this afternoon.

He is exactly what we need and pick 20 is not overs

If picking up the likes of Vince, Cross, Michie, Lyons and/OR Myers means we improve sufficiently to make players coming out of contract stay because they see we are heading in the right direction, I am happy to wear the price.

This is a big plus if Frawley signs an extension next season because we are on the improve

A bit of history of pick 20 2003-10 and the number of games for each player

Butler. 108

Polo. 77

Bower. 70

Hislop. 27

Notte. 2

Swift. 34

Fyfe. 72

Pitt. 10

With Fyfe being the standout exception, which of those players would you have starting their careers with us now rather than grabbing Vince?

Assuming Bernie averages, say 18 games a year, for the next 3 then we get 54 games from a 188cm/86kg experienced midfielder who will walk into our side as the 2nd best midfielder. Nathan Jones must be a very happy boy this afternoon.

He is exactly what we need and pick 20 is not overs

100% Spot on!

Yep I think we should be pushing for Vince and Lyons for 20. IF we were definitely keeping pick 2, I would consider:

V + L + 42 for 20 + 36

For us to get a pick 30 or a pick 25 so that we pay his worth not slightly over we need to trade away a current player to a club with those picks.

Any current player who is going to fetch pick 25-30 is probably worth more to us than that pick and we wouldn't want to lose them for a stop gap mid (Vince) so that isn't going to happen.

Adelaide won't give up 42, which is their first pick in the draft as a sweetener in a deal they don't have to do. They want this pick to secure Polac from Brissy. If they have up 42 as well their first pick would be until nearly 70.

A bit of history of pick 20 2003-10 and the number of games for each player

Butler. 108

Polo. 77

Bower. 70

Hislop. 27

Notte. 2

Swift. 34

Fyfe. 72

Pitt. 10

With Fyfe being the standout exception, which of those players would you have starting their careers with us now rather than grabbing Vince?

Assuming Bernie averages, say 18 games a year, for the next 3 then we get 54 games from a 188cm/86kg experienced midfielder who will walk into our side as the 2nd best midfielder. Nathan Jones must be a very happy boy this afternoon.

He is exactly what we need and pick 20 is not overs

Why, did we get him?

If picking up the likes of Vince, Cross, Michie, Lyons and/OR Myers means we improve sufficiently to make players coming out of contract stay because they see we are heading in the right direction, I am happy to wear the price.

This is a big plus if Frawley signs an extension next season because we are on the improve

Not to mention the supporters who may not have to drown in hopeless despair watching another game over before quarter time. All I want from these types of players is to build a base next year to work off in the subsequent years/trade-draft periods. Getting some respectability back is priority number 1 next year.

A bit of history of pick 20 2003-10 and the number of games for each player

Butler. 108

Polo. 77

Bower. 70

Hislop. 27

Notte. 2

Swift. 34

Fyfe. 72

Pitt. 10

With Fyfe being the standout exception, which of those players would you have starting their careers with us now rather than grabbing Vince?

Assuming Bernie averages, say 18 games a year, for the next 3 then we get 54 games from a 188cm/86kg experienced midfielder who will walk into our side as the 2nd best midfielder. Nathan Jones must be a very happy boy this afternoon.

He is exactly what we need and pick 20 is not overs

While that does make sense....

What you'd actually need to do is go through every single pick from pick 20 and above for the last few years and then do some analysis of how many you'd pick.

Just to name a few: Bastinac, Carlisle, Mitch Duncan, Gunston, Zaka, Beams, Hannebery, Motlop, Sloane...

That's just from 2 drafts. So a pick 20 gives you the OPPORTUNITY to find one of them.

Has anyone watched his highlight video yet? Hope he shows the rest how to hit targets and stab pass like that.

I too agree with deanox & drdrake. If it gets as up and going to make a bigger impact on the season which in return retains Frawley and gives us more attraction at trade period. It ain't overs at all.

Didn't everyone say Dawes was overs? He only played half a season and will make an even bigger impact this year.

It ain't overs till it's over

While that does make sense....

What you'd actually need to do is go through every single pick from pick 20 and above for the last few years and then do some analysis of how many you'd pick.

Just to name a few: Bastinac, Carlisle, Mitch Duncan, Gunston, Zaka, Beams, Hannebery, Motlop, Sloane...

That's just from 2 drafts. So a pick 20 gives you the OPPORTUNITY to find one of them.

Except its melbourne. Were 100% guaranteed to pick the Hislops, nottes and pitts than the Sloanes Hanneberys or Zaka etc

And even if we do get the sloanes, we turn them into the pitts

Yep I think we should be pushing for Vince and Lyons for 20. IF we were definitely keeping pick 2, I would consider:

V + L + 42 for 20 + 36

Agree.

Pick 20 is overs for Vince.

People have mentioned he will be then 2nd best mid while pick 20 might not make it.

Are posters so certain with Vince? He can play but there are 2 Bernie Vinces. Ask any Crow supporter and they will tell you, he strings together some rubbish games. 28 year old too.

Pick 20, Pick 36 for Bernie Vince, Lyon and Pick 42 would be my go.

I actually like Lyon more then Vince.

Agree.

Pick 20 is overs for Vince.

People have mentioned he will be then 2nd best mid while pick 20 might not make it.

Are posters so certain with Vince? He can play but there are 2 Bernie Vinces. Ask any Crow supporter and they will tell you, he strings together some rubbish games. 28 year old too.

Pick 20, Pick 36 for Bernie Vince, Lyon and Pick 42 would be my go.

I actually like Lyon more then Vince.

Good trade proposal. Fair for both sides.

Good trade proposal. Fair for both sides.

Cheers!