Whats Happened to Melbourne?

[bush demon 1,984]

I thought true demon tragics may like this one.

From AROUND THE PACKS by Jack Dunn of the Melbourne Sun, June 1966:

What's happened to Melbourne - the most dominant League club in the past 20 years?

Is its present position at the bottom of the League ladder an omen for another rise to a "golden era?"

Melbourne leaders think so.

Melbourne Cricket Club's latest Newsletter is an article headed, "Fickle Football Fortunes," draws attention to a large training list of 52 players, with 29 new boys, this year. The newsletter goes on:

'The pattern is not dissimilar to 1953. In that year, when we finished second last, the new talent included Frank Adams, Johnson, Clive Laidlaw, Laurie Mithen and Ian Ridley and so the side that was to dominate football for the following decade was moulded. It is not unreasonable to suggest that this year is in many respects a parallel to 1953 although we do not expect to finish as lowly as 11th. Norm Smith, coach of Melbourne for the second season in 1953, said yesterday the club tried 17 new players that year. 'In 1952 we won nine and lost nine games to finish sixth, but in 1953 we won only three games and drew one,' he said. Smith went on, 'But the following season Melbourne was runnerup, and then premier for the next three years.' He added: 'All-round today, it is similar. If we can gauge as many players in the next 12 rounds as we have in the first six, we will know where we are going.'

The Demons have used 13 new players in six rounds this season. Melburne secretary Jim Cardwell said: '1966 has many features that applied in 1953.

The positions vacant in the senior side by retirements and players unavailable means reruits have more chances of breaking into the team. I expect we will win more than 3 1/2 games this season,'

Mr Cardwell said. He pointed out that the Demons brought in only one new player in 1962 and four in 1964. 'As a team becomes more successful selectors are loath to bring in new players,' he added. He said,

'There is a resemblance between 1953 and today, brought about by vacancies. But supporters will be happy if the team continues with a replica of the 1953 era.'

How about Ron Barassi - the footballer who was the Demons' most dynamic star in the recovery from 1953? Barassi, now playing coach of Carlton, said: 'I don't think I should comment.'

[iv'a worn smith 1,979]

Great get BD. Made me tear up a bit actually. In short the prophetic warnings of Norm Smith were never taken on board by the tweed jacket and corduroy brigade. The game changed quickly and forever. The MCG was no longer our sole domain and money paid to players (although obviously nowhere near as big as today) started to speak more loudly.

We were hoisted well and truly on the petard of the old school tie.

[Guest]

Interesting how even back then club officials were looking 2-3 years ahead instead of thinking about how we could be the best we could at that very moment. It sounds like the old 'we've got a bunch of kids that will be great in 5 years time but as for now, forget it'.

The more things change, the more they stay the same. I'm amazed the older Demons haven't quit by now.

[biggestred 4,740]

Seems familiar.

[old dee 23,420]

Interesting how even back then club officials were looking 2-3 years ahead instead of thinking about how we could be the best we could at that very moment. It sounds like the old 'we've got a bunch of kids that will be great in 5 years time but as for now, forget it'.

The more things change, the more they stay the same. I'm amazed the older Demons haven't quit by now.

Your amazed CBF Monthly for 7 years I have wondered as well.

[DemonFrog 1,347]

Interesting how even back then club officials were looking 2-3 years ahead instead of thinking about how we could be the best we could at that very moment. It sounds like the old 'we've got a bunch of kids that will be great in 5 years time but as for now, forget it'.

The more things change, the more they stay the same. I'm amazed the older Demons haven't quit by now.

They just love the pain and suffering. There is a name for this condition!

Edited October 2, 2013 by TheBigFrog

[Whispering_Jack 28,856]

Great get BD. Made me tear up a bit actually. In short the prophetic warnings of Norm Smith were never taken on board by the tweed jacket and corduroy brigade. The game changed quickly and forever. The MCG was no longer our sole domain and money paid to players (although obviously nowhere near as big as today) started to speak more loudly.

We were hoisted well and truly on the petard of the old school tie.

Sadly, we remain hoisted to this day almost 50 years later. The old school tie, the hushed tones and plotting in the gentlemens clubs and the born to rule attitudes that won't accept others in control of the place.

I was once told by someone who was close to the club at the time that Norm Smith was sacked because "they" didn't like the way he ate his peas and potatoes with his fork. At the time, I was incredulous. Today, I'm a believer.

[Je Roos Salem 661]

Yeah, but the difference now is that the Beatles aren't in their peak.

[Guest]

Sadly, we remain hoisted to this day almost 50 years later. The old school tie, the hushed tones and plotting in the gentlemens clubs and the born to rule attitudes that won't accept others in control of the place.

I was once told by someone who was close to the club at the time that Norm Smith was sacked because "they" didn't like the way he ate his peas and potatoes with his fork. At the time, I was incredulous. Today, I'm a believer.

It's the same reason why Stockers was so gung ho against PJ and Bartlett taking over the club (though he claims he could have worked with PJ). And to a lesser extent, why the club got rid of Gutnick (his problem was his response to the whiteanting).

I understand what dee-luded talks about when he goes on one of his rants against the people in the 'Northern stands'. I don't think their problem is that they have made the club genteel. Their problem is that they have made the club exclusionary.

[Biffen 12,764]

That was then, this is now.

Melbourne is no longer an upper-crust, private boys club.

One look at the grammatical errors and the phrasing from some of our contributors shows that there are many people with state school education or worse, tech school, getting around in Melbourne colours.

The question is how did these plebs ever get a membership and why weren't they blackballed?

The gradual relaxation means that now even a factory worker can get a Melbourne membership and we have lost our appeal to the would-be social climbing downhill skiing set.

Where once we had doctors playing for us in the ruck, I have noticed several people in the stands who were possibly not even born in Australia, let alone South Yarra, our recruitment zone.

If we are going to run down the path of acceptance, eventually we will have to accept a lower class of member, perhaps even New Zealanders.

It is part of the inevitable push to professionalism and we must begin to embrace it in the next fifty or so years as we consider the change.

I am as appalled as all of you that the most important thing in the world, tradition is being compromised by that terrible quest for success that the aspirational lust after so vulgarly.

We must put a stop to it and simply do nothing, as we have always done.

[Bitter but optimistic 22,017]

Good show Biffen! Do you know I've actually seen a tattoo in the members! However, I suspect it was a Collingwood or Richmond low life who had stolen a pass.

[Guest]

That was then, this is now.

Melbourne is no longer an upper-crust, private boys club.

One look at the grammatical errors and the phrasing from some of our contributors shows that there are many people with state school education or worse, tech school, getting around in Melbourne colours.

The question is how did these plebs ever get a membership and why weren't they blackballed?

The gradual relaxation means that now even a factory worker can get a Melbourne membership and we have lost our appeal to the would-be social climbing downhill skiing set.

Where once we had doctors playing for us in the ruck, I have noticed several people in the stands who were possibly not even born in Australia, let alone South Yarra, our recruitment zone.

If we are going to run down the path of acceptance, eventually we will have to accept a lower class of member, perhaps even New Zealanders.

It is part of the inevitable push to professionalism and we must begin to embrace it in the next fifty or so years as we consider the change.

I am as appalled as all of you that the most important thing in the world, tradition is being compromised by that terrible quest for success that the aspirational lust after so vulgarly.

We must put a stop to it and simply do nothing, as we have always done.

I don't think the issue is that the riff raff are getting memberships Biff. The issue is that the riff raff never really get a say in how the club is run. I appreciate that the man on the street will never run for president but it seemed for a while there that if you didn't attend an elite private school, weren't a member of the Melbourne Club, weren't protestant, a Mason or a Liberal, you had no chance of getting on the board.

[Biffen 12,764]

I don't think the issue is that the riff raff are getting memberships Biff. The issue is that the riff raff never really get a say in how the club is run. I appreciate that the man on the street will never run for president but it seemed for a while there that if you didn't attend an elite private school, weren't a member of the Melbourne Club, weren't protestant, a Mason or a Liberal, you had no chance of getting on the board.

Terrible shame Colin.

Anyway, I'm due for my Elevenses at the club and I will discuss this further behind closed doors.

As long as the boys hit the track by early February we will muddle our way through another season and do the best we can.

Cheery pip old egg!

[Guest]

Terrible shame Colin.

Anyway, I'm due for my Elevenses at the club and I will discuss this further behind closed doors.

As long as the boys hit the track by early February we will muddle our way through another season and do the best we can.

Cheery pip old egg!

You call yourself a blueblood (albeit one that lives at the Gatwick)?

Here's hows yez does it!

[dee-luded 2,958]

It's the same reason why Stockers was so gung ho against PJ and Bartlett taking over the club (though he claims he could have worked with PJ). And to a lesser extent, why the club got rid of Gutnick (his problem was his response to the whiteanting).

I understand what dee-luded talks about when he goes on one of his rants against the people in the 'Northern stands'. I don't think their problem is that they have made the club genteel. Their problem is that they have made the club exclusionary.

your getting close, but those attitudes hold a myriad of behaviors associated with them, that bring our players down... its interwoven into what our Culture is, & has become yet again.

.... its a part of the nature of the desire to exclude... this inturn infects our players attitudes, & turns them off from the combat, for easier ways of earning a buck & the status desired.

why do you think I'm anti-stat us ! sack cloth & all

The root cause of exclusion is Fear. these attitudes are born from & grow from fear. to protect what we already have, & to not lose anything.... instead of combat, & to take what we desire,, or that which we do not have.

... you can also see the similarities in old Test Cricket, where the main Objective was to not Lose... A Draw being seen as adequate, rather than the risk of a loss whilst chasing a Win !!! so it was safer to draw Test Matches, just don't lose anything.

Footy..... its just not cricket

[Biffen 12,764]

Good show Biffen! Do you know I've actually seen a tattoo in the members! However, I suspect it was a Collingwood or Richmond low life who had stolen a pass.

My entire regiment got Tattoos while on leave in Siam BBO.

I'm not proud of it, but Captain Phillip, my personal guru on matters of taste got one in his days with the Navy.

Old ma'am loves it apparently (and the tattoo).

[chookrat 4,145]

That was then, this is now.

Melbourne is no longer an upper-crust, private boys club.

One look at the grammatical errors and the phrasing from some of our contributors shows that there are many people with state school education or worse, tech school, getting around in Melbourne colours.

The question is how did these plebs ever get a membership and why weren't they blackballed?

The gradual relaxation means that now even a factory worker can get a Melbourne membership and we have lost our appeal to the would-be social climbing downhill skiing set.

Where once we had doctors playing for us in the ruck, I have noticed several people in the stands who were possibly not even born in Australia, let alone South Yarra, our recruitment zone.

If we are going to run down the path of acceptance, eventually we will have to accept a lower class of member, perhaps even New Zealanders.

It is part of the inevitable push to professionalism and we must begin to embrace it in the next fifty or so years as we consider the change.

I am as appalled as all of you that the most important thing in the world, tradition is being compromised by that terrible quest for success that the aspirational lust after so vulgarly.

We must put a stop to it and simply do nothing, as we have always done.

Hear, Hear!

[monoccular 17,253]

I don't think the issue is that the riff raff are getting memberships Biff. The issue is that the riff raff never really get a say in how the club is run. I appreciate that the man on the street will never run for president but it seemed for a while there that if you didn't attend an elite private school, weren't a member of the Melbourne Club, weren't protestant, a Mason or a Liberal, you had no chance of getting on the board.

Joe Gutnick says hi !!

[Whispering_Jack 28,856]

My entire regiment got Tattoos while on leave in Siam BBO.

I'm not proud of it, but Captain Phillip, my personal guru on matters of taste got one in his days with the Navy.

Old ma'am loves it apparently (and the tattoo).

It's a lamentable fact I know, but there are Melbourne supporters around these days who not only don't possess a humidor, but they're not even house trained.

[Biffen 12,764]

It's a lamentable fact I know, but there are Melbourne supporters around these days who not only don't possess a humidor, but they're not even house trained.

Some men will smoke a dry cigar AND miss the pot .

Alas, Brent had to leave the officers tent for just such a thing.

[Guest]

Joe Gutnick says hi !!

And what happened to him once the club got his money? He was a-holed out. Stockers wrote a two page article squealing like a pig rejecting the argument that he was turfed because he wasn't one of the boys. I think the lady doth protested too much.

If you want to push that argument, I would look more at Jim Stynes and even then I would say that the club accepts these blokes while they are useful but the aristocracy view running the club as their god given right. However, as I've said before, they have lost all moral authority to do so.

Edited October 5, 2013 by Guest

[Sir Why You Little 36,459]

And what happened to him once the club got his money? He was a-holed out. Stockers wrote a two page article squealing like a pig rejecting the argument that he was turfed because he wasn't one of the boys. I think the lady doth protested too much.

If you want to push that argument, I would look more at Jim Stynes and even then I would say that the club accepts these blokes while they are useful but they view running the club as their god given right. However, as I've said before, they have lost all moral authority to do so.

Those days of the gentry seem to be over (hope) We have cost the AFL too much $$$.

The powerbase has shifted. The new CEO is plotting the new course.

The top end of town can line up & buy a membership happily, but the powerbase has shifted.

[angrydee 842]

Those days of the gentry seem to be over (hope) We have cost the AFL too much $$$.

The powerbase has shifted. The new CEO is plotting the new course.

Oh no. I'll have to get the maid to microwave my membership card.

The top end of town can line up & buy a membership happily, but the powerbase has shifted.

[angrydee 842]

Woops. Phone.

[dee-luded 2,958]

It's the same reason why Stockers was so gung ho against PJ and Bartlett taking over the club (though he claims he could have worked with PJ). And to a lesser extent, why the club got rid of Gutnick (his problem was his response to the whiteanting).

I understand what dee-luded talks about when he goes on one of his rants against the people in the 'Northern stands'. I don't think their problem is that they have made the club genteel. Their problem is that they have made the club exclusionary.

just a small point on this highlighted.

I've got nothing against any people, & the people of the Northern stand I think are fine people. so just wanted to make a point about this wording.

My Ideas re the culture aren't against the people of the Northern Stand at all.

Its about a collective culture that grows from within an exclusionary clique. this IMO is where our woes have hampered us, & only for a period where Checker then Smith took over, have we ever been demons.

Edited October 5, 2013 by dee-luded