When will the "rebuilding" end?

[Nasher 33,613]

The quote, which caught my eye, in particular was: "This is a long-term project"

I think you're taking what Neale is saying far too literally. My interpretation of "this is a long term project" was "this is a long term project that kicked off in the early 00s and is now really starting to bear fruit, and while we think we're thereabouts for a tilt at the flag, we're continuing to put our longevity plan in to place so that when our old guys retire, our younger generation are ready to come through".

It's just a matter of interpretation.

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

I think you're taking what Neale is saying far too literally. My interpretation of "this is a long term project" was "this is a long term project that kicked off in the early 00s and is now really starting to bear fruit, and while we think we're thereabouts for a tilt at the flag, we're continuing to put our longevity plan in to place so that when our old guys retire, our younger generation are ready to come through".

It's just a matter of interpretation.

Fair point.

[no cigar 0]

I don't have any problem with the recruitment and rebuilding that has occurred over the last few years and as a result we can all see the potential in the current group of players. As others have said we need a key backman now to support Rivers and Carroll and give us a decent shot at the flag. In my view we already have him, it ain't going to happen but why not get the best out of Neita's last few years by putting him back at CHB. It also solves the what to do with Miller and Dunn debate, they both get a gig at CHF and FF, probably Dunn at FF given that he is a better kick for goal. As I said it ain't going to happen but it would if I was the coach!!!

[Toad33 57]

quote name='Toad33' date='Mar 8 2007, 09:44 PM' post='60491']

I believe the club, like all others, is chasing a premiership.......

There is more to the football club than the team. Gaining the ultimate team success by giving up draft picks may not be in the clubs best interest for future financial success.

Put another way. Sacrificing the mid term future for short term gain could end up in longer term pain.

I think you both make excellent points which make my question pertinent.

Would you trade 3 years at the top including one premiership for 5-8 in the bottom 6? Because that is the goal and side effect of topping up with experienced players in a tilt for the premiership.

To quote myself.......

...... I don't believe that the club is prepared to do everything it takes to get one. At the moment at least.

I believe that at some point in the future (maybe 3-4 years) during this period of stability, if the current approach doesn't work, the top up and trade approach will be adopted.

Let me pose another question.

How many years of finishing 5-8, without the ultimate success, is OK before a 'ground swell' of members demands a change to deliver premiership ?

I can cope with a couple more years of what's going on now, but after that I will be screaming for change.

Go Dees

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

In my view we already have him, it ain't going to happen but why not get the best out of Neita's last few years by putting him back at CHB. It also solves the what to do with Miller and Dunn debate, they both get a gig at CHF and FF, probably Dunn at FF given that he is a better kick for goal. As I said it ain't going to happen but it would if I was the coach!!!

Thank God you are not.

Neitz is in the twilight of his career and playing him at CHB would hasten a speedy retirement and not provide us with a CHB that could handle the pace of the game for 100 minutes.

And that leaves us with no presence at FF. And Dunn is not a KPF and neither is Miller.

[Dee*ceiving 1,674]

Agree rhino.

The thought of poor Neita being ripped a new one by J Brown or B Hall doesn't sound like a nice way to serenade one of our greatest ever players into retirement.

[no cigar 0]

Thank God you are not.

Neitz is in the twilight of his career and playing him at CHB would hasten a speedy retirement and not provide us with a CHB that could handle the pace of the game for 100 minutes.

And that leaves us with no presence at FF. And Dunn is not a KPF and neither is Miller.

Allow me to disagree - Neitz is still strong, still quick and was, of course, in case you have forgotten, once the best CHB in the competition. If he can't handle the pace for 100 minutes you could always put him back to FF for 5-10 minutes a quarter. The fact is that the man is a champion and I would back him still to do a better job at CHB than anyone else we have at present.

If neither of Dunn or Miller are KPF's, we are obviously in serious trouble right now - who are you suggesting for CHF this year?

[no cigar 0]

Agree rhino.

The thought of poor Neita being ripped a new one by J Brown or B Hall doesn't sound like a nice way to serenade one of our greatest ever players into retirement.

I hope you are kidding - Neita is precisely the sort of player that would take Brown and Hall to the cleaners! Riewoldt on the other hand would be a problem.

[Slartibartfast 17,257]

Also agree, what a great thread.

There would appear to be 2 schools of thought about Premiership success. 1. the top up theory 2. the progressive theory.

1. The top up theory.

Based on the infamous clock it would seem to suggest that when you "feel" that you are close to a premiership, then you recruit older more experienced players to get you over the line. Does it work? I can't find any evidence in the past 6 years.

Swans:

Craig Bolton 2003 PSD Pick 3

Nic Davis 2002 ND Pick 19, Sydney's first round pick

Peter Everitt. 2006 ND pick 33, Second rounder

Barry Hall, 2001 ND 13,17 and 4

Darren Jolly, 2004 ND P15

Ted Richards 2005 P19 and 51.

Since 2001 Sydney have traded their first round pick in the ND on 4 occasions for established players. They've played in the 2005 and 2006 GF. Want to bet against 2007?

West Coast:

Daniel Chick 2002 P8

Tyson Stenglein 2004 P12 and 28.

Played in the last 2 GF.

I not sure you looked very far!!

[old55 23,541]

Swans:

I not sure you looked very far!!

Exactly

Port Adelaide: Byron Pickett and Damien Hardwick ...

Brisbane: Martin Pike and Mal Michael ...

It'a amatter of getting the balance right.

ND's approach has assured us of a long period in the top half of the ladder but will we have the edge to win a flag. This is the more conservative approach.

Roos has delivered one at Sydney but has said he'll quit when his current veterans retire and IMO the bottom will drop out for Sydney. This is the high risk approach, but great if it delivers a flag - not if it fails - ask Peter Schwab and Dean Laidley.

[demonfanjezza 1]

Neitz is in the twilight of his career and playing him at CHB would hasten a speedy retirement and not provide us with a CHB that could handle the pace of the game for 100 minutes.

And that leaves us with no presence at FF. And Dunn is not a KPF and neither is Miller.

Ouch-- defnitely no good scanerio to have

[Cranky Franky 2,049]

The Backline is pretty steady IMO. Holland will go round again next year as the Gorilla minder and Riv and Carrol will be in the first 12 selected for several years to come. Wheels is the best small defender going around and Daniel Bell and Clint Bartram will improve again. No reason why Wardy can't have another good year in 2007.

The forward line is also ok for 2007 and will improve heaps with a fitter Robbo and a permanent Yze. Not to mention potentially Lynden Dunn.

Midfield is definitely the key, either we bank on Bate, Jones, Sylvia and Moloney to take the next step or inject some ready made players. it seems we are ok in the toughness department but some more pace could make a difference. 2 more players capable of breaking the lines with running bounces and long accurate kicking ala Heath Black would be the way to go for mine.

2007 is a real chance and 2008 might be the last chance before a complete rebuild.

[You font=Arial Black][Y/quote]

You must be the eternal optimist.

This will be Holland's last year. Carroll is corageous but very clumsy. Bartram will be stuffed with his ankle this year & I'm no clearer about whether Daniel Bell is up to it as I was 3 years ago.

And Whelan has barely played after round 20 since he came to the club.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Allow me to disagree - Neitz is still strong, still quick and was, of course, in case you have forgotten, once the best CHB in the competition. If he can't handle the pace for 100 minutes you could always put him back to FF for 5-10 minutes a quarter. The fact is that the man is a champion and I would back him still to do a better job at CHB than anyone else we have at present.

If neither of Dunn or Miller are KPF's, we are obviously in serious trouble right now - who are you suggesting for CHF this year?

Neitz is quick on the burst not sustained pace.Its unrealistic to expect a 32 yo to lug 100kg in a position demanding moblity for 100 minutes.

He was never the best CHB in the competition. He was rated highly by a couple of opponents when he played there in the mid to late 90s. Jakovich was a better CHB. So dont grease the point.

And I dont see the purpose in tossing the structure like a salad to facilitate a player who cant play a certain position for 100 minutes.

Our backline is not the issue. Its steady enough. Why fracture the forward line?

Neitz is critical to our forward 50. I would suggest the playing of a CHF/FF structure may be replaced by one power forward (Neitz) and five other forwards (including Dunn). We did not play a formal CHF for much of last year and I dont think we will this year. As I have said elsewhere Miller aint it. Dunn is a HFF type player not a KPF.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Exactly

Port Adelaide: Byron Pickett and Damien Hardwick ...

Brisbane: Martin Pike and Mal Michael ...

It'a amatter of getting the balance right.

ND's approach has assured us of a long period in the top half of the ladder but will we have the edge to win a flag. This is the more conservative approach.

Roos has delivered one at Sydney but has said he'll quit when his current veterans retire and IMO the bottom will drop out for Sydney. This is the high risk approach, but great if it delivers a flag - not if it fails - ask Peter Schwab and Dean Laidley.

Well put Old!