I just cant believe that Caro knows more - how? what primary evidence other than hearsay can she offer? Why doesnt she spread he knowledge-gaining activities to the other clubs that can probably better afford to cop it?

I honestly don't know the answer to that.

But my mind went to perhaps a few former club coaches and players have gone into a lot of detail added to what we have already heard.

I just cant believe that Caro knows more - how? what primary evidence other than hearsay can she offer? Why doesnt she spread he knowledge-gaining activities to the other clubs that can probably better afford to cop it?

Exactly, why I suspect there is more going on behind, re someones agenda, that has driven this before it came past the Juourno's desks.

And most of it has started from Carlton contacted people?

Then the media is seen to be picking up the bits of the rumors, or the story straight from some club source.

My mind goes back to earlier this season when we had issues with a certain AFL investigator who went very quiet in the wash up of that, & since we have delisted Bennell Jurrah etc.

I just wonder if that investigator is at all connected to any of this?

Edited November 1, 201212 yr by dee-luded

Yeah, I'm sure a tin rattle never occurred to them. Good luck with that line, champ.

It's apt and should be posted after each of your offerings:

Edited November 1, 201212 yr by Ben-Hur

Roost if you could only meet Don McLardy. We have a President who absolutely loves this Club and always has. He has given up so much to take on first the Vice President position and now as President. You should not understimate what Don does for the Club. He is a man of high morals and a true friend in every sense of the word. We have a President whose only agenda is to hold the Club together and work for our future. He may not be as charismatic as Eddie or as outspoken as Kennett but he does know how business is run and AFL is a business. We need to stand firm behind Don. He is not the reason the [censored] has hit the fan

Thanks

Only evidence I've seen is a lot of mindless head banging and bellyaching on this forum.

So you do proof read your own posts

The club is keeping quiet to allow the afl to finish the investigation.

More damage will be done by coming out & swinging & Im sure the afl has told them also the same

I just feel guttered that if true our previous coaching/footy dept would agree to create a losing culture to obtain a couple of picks, thinking that this would solve our on field success..... no easy way out & early picks have yet to yield a star! very sad!

God I hate all this crap.....all we seem to do is wait for bad news,first waiting to see if Scully was leaving, then waiting out the whole Jurrah saga, then whether Suns would nominate Viney,now this,which is the worst wait of all ...will we be penalised or not?

If so ,what will they do take away pick 4? Take away points?

So over it.

It hurts because I'm such a tragic Demons man...... it feels personal.

No matter what happens....First and Forever!

Good post. I feel the same. I am 60 and have supported them all my life. My wife and kids the same. Never seen them win a flag. Copped [censored] from other clubs fans all my life but never strayed. I started the first supporters club magazine, called Demon's World. I started a supporters group called the Premier's Club. I have been a Director of the club. I have been Team Manager of the club. I brought in a new President, Wayne Reid. I am a Foundation member. I am a sponsor. I enjoy Demonland. I have given all my hope and soul to this club. I don't want anything but success for the club.

I have watched Boards fight each other. I was even part of one big fight. I nearly cried at the merger meeting when I saw the way people treated the late Tiger Ridley, a true Demon great. I have seen the club tear itself apart. This year I watched as Jim passed away, not long after two other Demon greats in Sean Wight and Stewart Spencer. I watched a sponsor stuff us up. I watched the Jurrah situation. I watched as our Coach was falsely called a racist. I watched the team get smashed week after week. I watched the media go to town on us and they still are.

It just seems so unfair. Other teams cheat and win Premierships. We are the only team to win a game that losing would have given us a priority pick and we did it twice. When we did get a pick the kid spent a year lying to us and his dying President before the AFL took him away from us. There is so much more i could go on about.

We seem to spend all of our time worrying about our club. It nearly makes you want to cry and give up. However that is just not acceptable as I have my children and grandchildren who I want to one day enjoy success that I have been denied.

Stop the fighting amongst each other and all get behind the club.

If we lose draft picks I want this club to fight all the way and I mean all the way. We owe it to those who came before and those who will come after. I don't give a rat's arse what we have to do to prevail in this situation, I just want it done. If we have to bring in every other club or destroy Demetriou or hurt the AFL I don't give a sh-t anymore. I have had enough.

Yes we may have been naughty but no different to many other clubs yet we alone once again are copping it. Our brand is being trashed and our future hampered and in fact put at real risk. We have 40 or so players who want to win for us and we need to support them. I don't care how dirty we need to be just do it.

We are seen as a weak club. NO BLOODY MORE. If we lose draft picks, we should hit the Courts, rally at the AFL and show the rest of the clubs that we are here to stay.

Sorry for the rant, I have just had a gutful.

Edited November 1, 201212 yr by Redleg

the AFL !!!

Mate you can't blame the AFL for this. You can blame them for singling us out but blaming them for clubs taking advantage of the rules or flat our breaking them is ridiculous. They put the priority pick in good faith as an equalisation measure, to claim it is entrapment or some other garbage is complete drivel.

I should add that I was glad the club did what it had to do in 2009 and would have been furious if we once again gave up a priority pick while the likes of Carlton and Collingwood were ruthless enough to do what was in the best interests of their club. Obviously I underestimated the ego's and shoddiness of our leaders who couldn't keep their mouths shut and realise what was in the long term best interests for everyone. The fact anyone had to even mention it is incredulous. No-one at Carlton talked about it because no-one had to - they all knew what had to be done and did it. No-one should have had to remind Bailey or the FD of what was at stake, it was self-evident. And if Bailey thinks he was sacked on the back of a poor record due to tanking think again. It was his coaching display in 2010-2011 that was the issue, not in 2009.

Question is; Who is fighting? Only evidence I've seen is a lot of mindless head banging and bellyaching on this forum.

If you and your other ex director friend stop posting all that will stop, we're sick of your mindless head banging and bellyaching too.

Good post. I feel the same. I am 60 and have supported them all my life. My wife and kids the same. Never seen them win a flag. Copped [censored] from other clubs fans all my life but never strayed. I started the first supporters club magazine, called Demon's World. I started a supporters group called the Premier's Club. I have been a Director of the club. I have been Team Manager of the club. I brought in a new President, Wayne Reid. I am a Foundation member. I am a sponsor. I enjoy Demonland. I have given all my hope and soul to this club. I don't want anything but success for the club.

I have watched Boards fight each other. I was even part of one big fight. I nearly cried at the merger meeting when I saw the way people treated the late Tiger Ridley, a true Demon great. I have seen the club tear itself apart. This year I watched as Jim passed away, not long after two other Demon greats in Sean Wight and Stewart Spencer. I watched a sponsor stuff us up. I watched the Jurrah situation. I watched as our Coach was falsely called a racist. I watched the team get smashed week after week. I watched the media go to town on us and they still are.

It just seems so unfair. Other teams cheat and win Premierships. We are the only team to win a game that losing would have given us a priority pick and we did it twice. When we did get a pick the kid spent a year lying to us and his dying President before the AFL took him away from us. There is so much more i could go on about.

We seem to spend all of our time worrying about our club. It nearly makes you want to cry and give up. However that is just not acceptable as I have my children and grandchildren who I want to one day enjoy success that I have been denied.

Stop the fighting amongst each other and all get behind the club.

If we lose draft picks I want this club to fight all the way and I mean all the way. We owe it to those who came before and those who will come after. I don't give a rat's arse what we have to do to prevail in this situation, I just want it done. If we have to bring in every other club or destroy Demetriou or hurt the AFL I don't give a sh-t anymore. I have had enough.

Yes we may have been naughty but no different to many other clubs yet we alone once again are copping it. Our brand is being trashed and our future hampered and in fact put at real risk. We have 40 or so players who want to win for us and we need to support them. I don't care how dirty we need to be just do it.

We are seen as a weak club. NO BLOODY MORE. If we lose draft picks, we should hit the Courts, rally at the AFL and show the rest of the clubs that we are here to stay.

Sorry for the rant, I have just had a gutful.

Great post Redleg love and share your passion, it saddens me to see the factions and ex board members trying to tear down the club because of petty jealousies and hatred at a time when we should all be united.

Premiership points and next years draft. But the rumour isnt from a particularly reputable source.

Club contact says the club isnt actually very concerned which seems surprising. And might suggest there is some substance to that rumour.

Mark Fine was quite good and echos what most rational observers would say. Too many clubs involved, dees shouldnt take the fall, if we do it will be an outrage, afl caused the problem. All the 'throw the book at them' group are holier-than-thoughs and 'chip-on-shoulders'.

Did Greg Denham crack a woodie on SEN? Rabble?

Acutually from what I heard from venom man he wasnt to bad. Said something about driving past the lexus centre where collingwood have heaps of money, won a flag a few years ago and have a great list compared to us a few 100m down the road where our team isnt great and said we have no money. Im sure he was wrong about that. We do have money. But they talked about the other clubs and said the afl now have to interview fev after what he spoke about.

Edited November 1, 201212 yr by dees189227

I cant blame the AFL ? Like f#*k i cant !!

Who created the scenarios ? Whose reward system was it ? Who make and change the rules to suit themselves ? Who works in secret without transparency ?

Go on guess !!!!

Who acts like f'n god or Caesar or both ?

You dont feed the cat...put a bowl of cream outand then smack the cat ?

Youre kidding me

They instigated this through nefarious manipulations and now they act all moralistic ?

They caused this, they can clean it up. They can call a truce and clean up their own act.

Edited November 1, 201212 yr by belzebub59

This is how it is and how it will go:

1. If push comes to shove and this drags out legally its just going to make the whole league look corrupt and more dirt will come out. Fev's already yelling about the Blues tanking to anyone who will listen and Libba wont be long before he does the same. It will be in MFC's interest to drag out the investigation ATLEAST until after this years draft for fear that we will lose pick 4 or other implications.

2. If push still comes to shove there may be a fallguy offered to satiate the AFL.

3. Draft restrictions just guarantees that the club will need more financial and draft assistance later. Hurt supporters who are already scathing with the last 18 months. Trust me by my sentiments and those of all the SEN calling demons supporters in the last week the AFL will be effectively losing all financial interest of around 40,000 supporters if they try and make an example of us knowing full well that atleast six other clubs did the same thing.

4. Unconfirmed rumour that the AFL have already told the club what the penalty will be and that it has to be seen to take the fall for what they now accept was a failure of administration rather than anything else.

Are you telling me the club must accept the AFL sword....The oldest club in the world forever a lakkie??

F#$%^k that...We Fight for the Emblem or DIE...

The AFL dangled the Carrot.

To put it mildly! I think "systematically demonstrated utter incompetence in every facet of club administration except fundraising" sums it up a bit more accurately.

Some have the ability to be balanced based on facts. Others don't & insert hyperbolic bluster. Exhibit A.

This is what an inclusive club looks like. By contrast, Gardner and his board have were completely ostracized after Jim took over.

Facts would be appreciated. Were they really ostracized or did they choose to sook about having their toys taken away?

I have no doubt that Gardner regrets his decision to let the boys club get a foot in the door.

So the inclusive club shouldn't have been inclusive? How would this make the previous board any better than what the current board is accused of? Or was it an elitist culture that let it's guard down & consequently the riff raff in?

Interesting how the exclusive boys club managed to do what the former "inclusive club" couldn't & engage with fans to the degree that $5m worth of debt was wiped out within 18 months. By what voodoo? Is this what sparked the current witch hunt?

Here's how it went:

Harris to Connolly

Connolly and Leoncelli to Stynes

Stynes to Schwab

Connolly to Viney

Clusterfcuk to Garry

Without the facts to back this up this has as much credibility as fanboi fiction.

This is a great example of the mass hypnosis on Demonland that makes me look so biased.

Paul NcNamee: "We need a big, strong power forward who will straighten up the team. Someone in his mid 20s who will provide leadership for the next few years and who the punters will want to come and watch. What about that bloke from Brisbane? We should throw everything at him."

Demonland verdict: Moron

Current admin: "We need a big, strong power forward who will straighten up the team. Someone in his mid 20s who will provide leadership for the next few years and who the punters will want to come and watch. What about that bloke from Brisbane? We should throw everything at him."

Demonland verdict: Genius

Any halfwit could see the comparisons are night & day. Luring the well settled captain of an interstate club for a swathe of money that the worst club in the land didn't have versus landing a disgruntled young man to a team presumably on the rise after rebuilding through the draft with salary cap cash to splash. Night vs day.

Schwab has earned a reputation for meddling in FD affairs too much which has earned justified ire & criticism. However, it's hard to ever recall him usurping the list manager by going down media street and announcing to the world that he would put this club on the map by landing the biggest fish.

And I love how you say "set off a chain of events". As though the Stynes/Schwab ambush just sort of happened almost by accident. Schwab wasn't hired because the AFL preferred him to McNamee. Schwab was hired because his mate Stynes had pulled off a coup with the help of his mate Connolly who acted as a mole, undermining the people who hired him.

Accident? No. Calculated putsch by the AFL & others concerned with the club's direction? Yes.

Hiring the world's most expensive part time CEO & turning profits by living off the AFL's $2m per annum CBF were factors.

Schwab was trying to get a job with the AFL commission but was advised by Demitriou & others to go for the vacant Melbourne position.

You need to face the facts. It doesn't matter what you or I think of the previous board or the one before that. They haven't been responsible for four years now. They certainly have nothing to do with the current disaster. The fact that four years later people still feel the need to blame the previous board in order to feel better about the current mob really speaks volumes.

The facts are that for all the bungling the AFL has had far more faith in the current board & it's business plan than its predessecor's. That speaks volumes.

PS. No spirited defence of the namecalling & scurrilous accusations leveled at our former president? Good move. There's a first time for everything. ;-)

Good post. I feel the same. I am 60 and have supported them all my life. My wife and kids the same. Never seen them win a flag. Copped [censored] from other clubs fans all my life but never strayed. I started the first supporters club magazine, called Demon's World. I started a supporters group called the Premier's Club. I have been a Director of the club. I have been Team Manager of the club. I brought in a new President, Wayne Reid. I am a Foundation member. I am a sponsor. I enjoy Demonland. I have given all my hope and soul to this club. I don't want anything but success for the club.

I have watched Boards fight each other. I was even part of one big fight. I nearly cried at the merger meeting when I saw the way people treated the late Tiger Ridley, a true Demon great. I have seen the club tear itself apart. This year I watched as Jim passed away, not long after two other Demon greats in Sean Wight and Stewart Spencer. I watched a sponsor stuff us up. I watched the Jurrah situation. I watched as our Coach was falsely called a racist. I watched the team get smashed week after week. I watched the media go to town on us and they still are.

It just seems so unfair. Other teams cheat and win Premierships. We are the only team to win a game that losing would have given us a priority pick and we did it twice. When we did get a pick the kid spent a year lying to us and his dying President before the AFL took him away from us. There is so much more i could go on about.

We seem to spend all of our time worrying about our club. It nearly makes you want to cry and give up. However that is just not acceptable as I have my children and grandchildren who I want to one day enjoy success that I have been denied.

Stop the fighting amongst each other and all get behind the club.

If we lose draft picks I want this club to fight all the way and I mean all the way. We owe it to those who came before and those who will come after. I don't give a rat's arse what we have to do to prevail in this situation, I just want it done. If we have to bring in every other club or destroy Demetriou or hurt the AFL I don't give a sh-t anymore. I have had enough.

Yes we may have been naughty but no different to many other clubs yet we alone once again are copping it. Our brand is being trashed and our future hampered and in fact put at real risk. We have 40 or so players who want to win for us and we need to support them. I don't care how dirty we need to be just do it.

We are seen as a weak club. NO BLOODY MORE. If we lose draft picks, we should hit the Courts, rally at the AFL and show the rest of the clubs that we are here to stay.

Sorry for the rant, I have just had a gutful.

Great post....I feel the same

the AFL !!!

i knew that bub, just joshin ya...didn't you see the lol

Good post. I feel the same. I am 60 and have supported them all my life. My wife and kids the same. Never seen them win a flag. Copped [censored] from other clubs fans all my life but never strayed. I started the first supporters club magazine, called Demon's World. I started a supporters group called the Premier's Club. I have been a Director of the club. I have been Team Manager of the club. I brought in a new President, Wayne Reid. I am a Foundation member. I am a sponsor. I enjoy Demonland. I have given all my hope and soul to this club. I don't want anything but success for the club.

I have watched Boards fight each other. I was even part of one big fight. I nearly cried at the merger meeting when I saw the way people treated the late Tiger Ridley, a true Demon great. I have seen the club tear itself apart. This year I watched as Jim passed away, not long after two other Demon greats in Sean Wight and Stewart Spencer. I watched a sponsor stuff us up. I watched the Jurrah situation. I watched as our Coach was falsely called a racist. I watched the team get smashed week after week. I watched the media go to town on us and they still are.

It just seems so unfair. Other teams cheat and win Premierships. We are the only team to win a game that losing would have given us a priority pick and we did it twice. When we did get a pick the kid spent a year lying to us and his dying President before the AFL took him away from us. There is so much more i could go on about.

We seem to spend all of our time worrying about our club. It nearly makes you want to cry and give up. However that is just not acceptable as I have my children and grandchildren who I want to one day enjoy success that I have been denied.

Stop the fighting amongst each other and all get behind the club.

If we lose draft picks I want this club to fight all the way and I mean all the way. We owe it to those who came before and those who will come after. I don't give a rat's arse what we have to do to prevail in this situation, I just want it done. If we have to bring in every other club or destroy Demetriou or hurt the AFL I don't give a sh-t anymore. I have had enough.

Yes we may have been naughty but no different to many other clubs yet we alone once again are copping it. Our brand is being trashed and our future hampered and in fact put at real risk. We have 40 or so players who want to win for us and we need to support them. I don't care how dirty we need to be just do it.

We are seen as a weak club. NO BLOODY MORE. If we lose draft picks, we should hit the Courts, rally at the AFL and show the rest of the clubs that we are here to stay.

Sorry for the rant, I have just had a gutful.

I am only 45 and have to say thankyou , a very good post , i feel very much the same way , all 5 of my kids have been given a melbourne jumper the day they born , i would love to see them watch melbourne finally win a grand final and be proud , we must all stand together and support our club and do whatever it takes and fight this if it goes against us , the afl created this system not us

Edited November 1, 201212 yr by markc

Interesting to hear what Trengove has to say about all this. Apparantely he will be on JB and Billys show tomorrow.

I cant blame the AFL ? Like f#*k i cant !!

Who created the scenarios ? Whose reward system was it ? Who make and change the rules to suit themselves ? Who works in secret without transparency ?

Go on guess !!!!

Who acts like f'n god or Caesar or both ?

You dont feed the cat...put a bowl of cream outand then smack the cat ?

Youre kidding me

They instigated this through nefarious manipulations and now they act all moralistic ?

They caused this, they can clean it up. They can call a truce and clean up their own act.

It's one thing to say "we didn't tank" or "we didn't break any rules" it's another thing entirely to say "yeah we broke the rules but its their fault for making it so appealing". If this wasn't Melbourne in the gun and it was Carlton would you say "yeah they tanked in the Kreuzer Cup but it was the AFL's fault"? Get a grip, you can deny or you can say we did what was best for the club but you can't blame your actions on others and think people will just turn a blind eye.

It's one thing to say "we didn't tank" or "we didn't break any rules" it's another thing entirely to say "yeah we broke the rules but its their fault for making it so appealing". If this wasn't Melbourne in the gun and it was Carlton would you say "yeah they tanked in the Kreuzer Cup but it was the AFL's fault"? Get a grip, you can deny or you can say we did what was best for the club but you can't blame your actions on others and think people will just turn a blind eye.

Yes...We must cop a Wack, as must other Clubs.

We then make sure the rule is rewritten....We stand up & work hard. Bloody hard.

All of us.

Edited November 1, 201212 yr by why you little

Good post. I feel the same. I am 60 and have supported them all my life. My wife and kids the same. Never seen them win a flag. Copped [censored] from other clubs fans all my life but never strayed. I started the first supporters club magazine, called Demon's World. I started a supporters group called the Premier's Club. I have been a Director of the club. I have been Team Manager of the club. I brought in a new President, Wayne Reid. I am a Foundation member. I am a sponsor. I enjoy Demonland. I have given all my hope and soul to this club. I don't want anything but success for the club.

I have watched Boards fight each other. I was even part of one big fight. I nearly cried at the merger meeting when I saw the way people treated the late Tiger Ridley, a true Demon great. I have seen the club tear itself apart. This year I watched as Jim passed away, not long after two other Demon greats in Sean Wight and Stewart Spencer. I watched a sponsor stuff us up. I watched the Jurrah situation. I watched as our Coach was falsely called a racist. I watched the team get smashed week after week. I watched the media go to town on us and they still are.

It just seems so unfair. Other teams cheat and win Premierships. We are the only team to win a game that losing would have given us a priority pick and we did it twice. When we did get a pick the kid spent a year lying to us and his dying President before the AFL took him away from us. There is so much more i could go on about.

We seem to spend all of our time worrying about our club. It nearly makes you want to cry and give up. However that is just not acceptable as I have my children and grandchildren who I want to one day enjoy success that I have been denied.

Stop the fighting amongst each other and all get behind the club.

If we lose draft picks I want this club to fight all the way and I mean all the way. We owe it to those who came before and those who will come after. I don't give a rat's arse what we have to do to prevail in this situation, I just want it done. If we have to bring in every other club or destroy Demetriou or hurt the AFL I don't give a sh-t anymore. I have had enough.

Yes we may have been naughty but no different to many other clubs yet we alone once again are copping it. Our brand is being trashed and our future hampered and in fact put at real risk. We have 40 or so players who want to win for us and we need to support them. I don't care how dirty we need to be just do it.

We are seen as a weak club. NO BLOODY MORE. If we lose draft picks, we should hit the Courts, rally at the AFL and show the rest of the clubs that we are here to stay.

Sorry for the rant, I have just had a gutful.

Hey Redleg, You are true Red and Blue. This club has the longest history. In the grand scheme of things this is nothing. We will be back.

Edited November 1, 201212 yr by america de cali

Yes...We must cop a Wack, as must other Clubs.

We then make sure the rule is rewritten....We stand up & work hard. Bloody hard.

All of us.

Just to clarify - I still don't think we've done anything wrong other than acting stupid. Every time the MFC played we played to win, no one has come out and said the players were told to lie down. I don't think we should cop anything and if we do the. As you say others should be in the gun. But you can't believe the opposite & then say its all the AFL's fault. Sure the system them had in place was flawed and sure they didn't address these issues at the time when every man and his dog knew the Blues amongst others were flagrantly tanking but there is still some personal responsibility that needs to be accounted for if you believe what we did was against the rules/against the spirit of the game.

The club is keeping quiet to allow the afl to finish the investigation.

More damage will be done by coming out & swinging & Im sure the afl has told them also the same

I just feel guttered that if true our previous coaching/footy dept would agree to create a losing culture to obtain a couple of picks, thinking that this would solve our on field success..... no easy way out & early picks have yet to yield a star! very sad!

Its not the coaching/footy dept fault . They were screwed by the Admin and perhaps the board.

I've got a feeling of dread, the MFC will be charged and penalised for tanking by the AFL to appease the kangaroo court of the media. If so, the club shouldn't stop contesting the decision until High Court dismissed all charges. The viability of our club is at stake. If this requires showing up others within the AFL for their hypocrisy and duplicity, it's the price football in general will have to pay. I solemnly believe the entity of the club didn't sanction tanking, however, some individuals might of on their own back, mistakenly made decisions that may or may not be tantamount to tanking. The individuals,not the club, should be charged and if found guilty , be duly penalised.

4. Unconfirmed rumour that the AFL have already told the club what the penalty will be and that it has to be seen to take the fall for what they now accept was a failure of administration rather than anything else.

This can't be right because we all know that Demetriou wouldn't lie and he said he hadn't even seen the report and the Investigation was still unfinished. Also we haven't had the chance to have our say and present our case and call our witnesses.

If you were right this would be a kangaroo court of the worst type. Surely not. The AFL stands for INTEGRITY.