Drug cheat or hero?

Discuss.

I figured he'd be a hero for many having beaten cancer and winning 7 Tour de France. But that could all change if he is found guilty of taking performance enhancing drugs (EPO).

Hero.

  On 06/07/2012 at 00:37, Range Rover said:

Drug cheat or hero?

Discuss.

Both- as everyone has been saying for such a long time .

I think he was allowed certain steroids after his cancer treatment but I have never been able to warm to him .

Anyone who thinks he never cheated is deluding themselves-Sorry .

The one thing I've discovered as I go through life is that very little shocks me any more. There are plenty of cases of fallen idols and discredited angels, and people who I once thought were heroes being shown to be anything but.

It's very hard to accept the revelation of transgressions from people who I once considered were infallible. In Lance's case I'm prepared for anything.

Lances problem isnt that he took performance enhancing substances,I'd wager they all have at some stage (including Cadels offsider Hincapie) but that he did it so well and won so much that the embarrassment he will cause to the sport is nearly unforgivable....nearly unforgivable.Hincapie has turned rat on him and cut a deal to take 6 months suspension at seasons end....when he is going to retire anyway and he wasnt good enough to win and then 'lose' a Tour because of his cheating. I reckon he's more of a dog than Armstrong myself. "Freedom (honesty) is just another word for nothing (left) to lose"

to 'beat cancer' and compete at all would have been an astounding enough achievement without having to win le tour, let alone do it seven times. the real philosophical head scratcher is whether or not the end (by which I mean inspiration for countless people, not the actual sporting achievements) justifies the means. close call for mine, i'm inclined to say it does however it really depends on the magnitude of the outcry over what seems to be the inevitable fall from grace

I never really liked Lance Armstrong but You have to admire his achievements on and off the bike.

I don't understand why they are targeting him and not other past winners who would also have been using drugs.

The fact that he passed every drug test should be accepted as it is with all Olympic events.

Most past winners including Eddie Merkx have been pinged for drugs.Lances problem is possibly that he outperformed Merkx and is an embarrasment for the sport....not that most of tbem havnt indulged at some time or other.....Hincapie and Skys team doctor for example. They're all heros if you ask me,its the toughest sport going and that includes Rugby Union

He can be both a hero and a villain.

He's a hero for beating cancer and inspiring so many people. If he's convicted of cheating then he's a villain as well.

He has always been a polarising character, and this will just further that.

The sport is trying ultra hard to get rid of the drugs. If has taken on Contador (and won) and now Armstrong. There will always be one or two that think the risks are worth it, but that's the same with every single sport.

I'm happy with where the sport is, from where it's come from. There are very few superhuman efforts that are hard to explain, and it's making for some really interesting racing. But it will take some time to get the stigma off it.

Just thought I'd dig this one up.I put him in the same boat as sleepy Lynch.

A cheat AND a liar.

Lance Armstrong has taken more Drugs than Keith Richards....It's official.

Once the team mates start fessing up down the barrel of a camera the Game is up.

Lance didn't get done from testing only because he stayed one step or at least on level terms to his authorities...He aint stupid

But he is a cheat.

  On 06/07/2012 at 00:37, Range Rover said:

Drug cheat or hero?

Discuss.

He would have earned more respect from me if he just came out and said he did it... instead of guilt tripping and hiding behind his achievements, cancer and charity work.

Just because everyone else did it doesnt make it right.

Im surprised he could go along with it for so long - the guilt would have killed me

Heard something on the radio today which was a direct quote from Lance himself. Can't remember exactly what he said but it was along the lines of 'If I am found guilty, it will negatively impact every person out there who suffers from cancer'. Good on him for beating it but achievements aside, he is a dead set [censored].

  On 16/10/2012 at 08:27, the passenger said:

Heard something on the radio today which was a direct quote from Lance himself. Can't remember exactly what he said but it was along the lines of 'If I am found guilty, it will negatively impact every person out there who suffers from cancer'. Good on him for beating it but achievements aside, he is a dead set [censored].

Unforgiveable really. Interesting character, he has made so much from his achievements on a personal level and for his charity and cancer sufferers and built it on the back of his success' in cycling events. All on the back of (reports including the Four Corners report last night) being a drug cheat, one who went to great lengths to have team members follow suit and cheat for him.

When they do a 20-1 on the biggest cheats and scoundrels, Lance Armstrong will be a short priced favourite in being no.1.

His charity will crumble big time from what it is today.

Used to not like "bike riders" very much, I used to live not far off Beach Road and had to travel for footy Saturdays..... you know what I mean! But over the years the Tour has hooked me. As IRW said it is (aside from maybe Hawiian Iron Man) the toughest week to week sporting event in the world.

From a far I wanted to believe he was able to achieve what he did without the drugs. To be the hero above the Pantani's, the Ullirch's, the Contador's, the Riis', the Virenque's, the Zulle's..... fark it goes on and on. He wasn't and he isn't. He is a drug cheat, a liar, a bully, a yellow belly, a thief, a denier, a taker of money, a fraud. Just amazed it has taken so long for the house of cards to come crashing down.

In saying that I am still in awe of Cadel Evans but more so of Bradley Wiggins. Mr Wiggins, I hope will win a number of Tours (if Cadel can't) and will do it with and an agressive anti-drugs attitude and the worst lamb shops since Georgie Best.

^^^^^^^^ most of those guys were on it too.

  On 17/10/2012 at 12:01, Benno said:

^^^^^^^^ most of those guys were on it too.

.... ahhmmm as in a hero above, as in ALL of those guys have been caught or implicated (Riis Mr 60%)

Hero. If it wasn't for his inspirational advice to Peter LaFleur, Average Joe's Gymnasium would never have won the dodgeball tournament and the gym would have been purchased and bulldozed by White Goodman for his auxiliary parking structure.

LA had always been my hero and I feel shattered about what has happened. He has betrayed people like me and many others who admired his courage and apparent honesty. I feel like burning all of his books.

Watching him sit there and openly lie whilst under oath made me feel sick.

I hope his guilt and deceit does not tarnish all those innocent, honest competitive cyclists out there.

  On 18/10/2012 at 03:33, jane02 said:

LA had always been my hero and I feel shattered about what has happened. He has betrayed people like me and many others who admired his courage and apparent honesty. I feel like burning all of his books.

Watching him sit there and openly lie whilst under oath made me feel sick.

I hope his guilt and deceit does not tarnish all those innocent, honest competitive cyclists out there.

Cadel is looking pretty good at the moment.

Through all the accusations that dogged Lance Armstrong throughout his career, I still believed he wasn't guilty of doping. I think the evidence now is unfortunately insurmountable, and Lance will from now on be known as a fraud, cheat, liar, whatever you want to call him.

It's important to remember, though, that his charity has raised half a billion dollars for cancer research. It's because of this that I don't think I'll ever be able to hate Lance Armstrong, even though he will go down as one of the biggest cheats in sports history.

Link to the USADA report.

Lance is a fraud. Not only did he dope, he used intimidation to get others on the US Postal team to follow suit, and used bribes to cover doping up.

Lance is a scumbag, the UCI are not much better. I amembarrassed that Pat McQuaid is a fellow Irishman. I am proud of Paul Kimmage and David Walsh for fighting the good fight for all these years. Funny how SKY team dropped Dr. Leinders in recent weeks - Job done I would say. Wiggo and Froome, when will they be exposed?

  On 24/10/2012 at 10:07, Green Demon said:

Lance is a scumbag, the UCI are not much better. I amembarrassed that Pat McQuaid is a fellow Irishman. I am proud of Paul Kimmage and David Walsh for fighting the good fight for all these years. Funny how SKY team dropped Dr. Leinders in recent weeks - Job done I would say. Wiggo and Froome, when will they be exposed?

You know it wouldn't surprise me. Nothing surprises me with this sport anymore.

If there's been one word associated with cycling and drugs the past decade or more, it is "rife"

Many of you would have read and heard lots of stories about the endemic drug culture in cycling (including the 4 Corners program a few weeks back) but this recently made BBC audio docomentary on the sport is a real opener . It focuses on many things including the systematic doping that was going on during the Lance Armstrong era . It's nearly 2 hours long but if you listen to the first minute or so it will get you in , as it is quite a compelling exposé .

Some of the players involved are Lance Armstrong himself , Floyd Landis , Tyler Hamilton , David Millar , Matt De Canio , Christophe Basson and many others . There is a 2nd part to this documentary feature as well (see bottom of this post) but the first part is a must listen for cycling fans or for sporting fans in general .

It's not all doom and gloom though , as towards the end of the first doco and certainly in parts of the 2nd doco it becomes apparent that the sport is doing a lot to clean up it's act and may be starting to win the battle against performance enhancing drugs .

Here's a write up from 'The Guardian' which serves as a good introduction to the documentary

http://www.guardian....ty-truth-review

From Tyler Hamilton ...

  Quote

But it also featured day-to-day details about the secrecy ("We called it Edgar Allan Poe", he said of EPO), trying to avoid tests when drugged up and testers knock on your door ("Get down on your hands and knees and crawl around") and the dangers of blood transfusions ("My urine was black, like a rusty colour").

And here is the audio documentary ...posted on youtube ...'Peddlers: Cycling's Dirty Truth' ...

[media=]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=290NJlfoDaY

The 2nd part can be found on this site ...

http://www.bbc.co.uk...ries/5lspecials