List Changes

[Rogue 585]

rarely do people work better under intense pressure or being forced to play/coach for their jobs.

id rather DB was coaching for the long term interests of MFC as opposed to guarding his own back and trying to win games short term by not blooding players.

If he deviated from his and the Club's own plan he'd be throwing away his job...

[Rogue 585]

Its interesting. I guess if I was Bailey I would want to know what has changed from 3 years ago when you appointed me for 3 years and now you offer me less than that. Given the difficult road Bailey has taken and there is no doubt he has sacrificed his WL record for list development with the knowledge and acceptance of the Board I dont think the issue of the wooden spoons and the ladder placings should be significantly relevant. If it is then I think the Club does not have fiath in Bailey and he will be operating with one eye looking over his shoulder all the time.

That didn't really answer the question. Can I assume you've decided that you/Bailey would in fact take the two year extension, as I suggested?

Let me flip this around. If DB thinks that he can coach and he's building a good list, why would he be worried about coming out of contract after five years in the role?

The side should be starting to show some real progress, and if that was the case it's unlikely the Club would want the upheaval associated with bringing in a new senior coach. However, if the side wasn't showing progress after five years, questions would be asked about DB's abilities as senior coach (and rightly so).

[old55 21,356]

We'll be able to find out if Bailey can't coach in the next 3-4 years if we're not playing and winning some finals in that time.

Unfortunately we probably wont find out if he can coach until we really become contenders in 5-8 years and need to win flags.

[Keyser Söze 0]

That didn't really answer the question. Can I assume you've decided that you/Bailey would in fact take the two year extension, as I suggested?

Let me flip this around. If DB thinks that he can coach and he's building a good list, why would he be worried about coming out of contract after five years in the role?

The side should be starting to show some real progress, and if that was the case it's unlikely the Club would want the upheaval associated with bringing in a new senior coach. However, if the side wasn't showing progress after five years, questions would be asked about DB's abilities as senior coach (and rightly so).

This is exactly how it should play out... but the timing is everything and the media is fickle... lucky for Bailey's sake I am confident that the club is not.

[old55 21,356]

Quick scan of BF ladder predictions has us 13th, 14th or 15th - no-one has us last and one had us 12th.

[Range Rover 1,935]

I can't believe all of these ringing endorsements for a bloke who has coached a club to two successive wooden spoons!

Yes, granted Bailey has stuck to the club's recent strategy but I am far from convinced he's the right man to lead this talented group in the long term.

He's got this year to really show the club and the Dees faithful he's got the coaching talent and mental toughness to warrant a contract extension.

This means 7 or 8 wins at a minimum and being highly competitive in most of the other games.

No more thumping 12+ goal losses and no more using injuries as excuses.

2010 is now or never for Dean Bailey and I suspect he knows it.

Edited December 5, 2009 by ScullyToWatts!

[H_T 2,941]

I can't believe all of these rining endorsements for a bloke who has coached a club to two successive wooden spoons! Yes, granted Bailey has stuck to the club's recent strategy but I am far from convinced he's the right man to lead this talented group in the long term.

Let's think about what was left for Bailey when he took on the coaching job, let us also think about what the clubs intentions were regarding the list.

[Guest hellter skelter]

I can't believe all of these ringing endorsements for a bloke who has coached a club to two successive wooden spoons!

Yes, granted Bailey has stuck to the club's recent strategy but I am far from convinced he's the right man to lead this talented group in the long term.

He's got this year to really show the club and the Dees faithful he's got the coaching talent and mental toughness to warrant a contract extension.

This means 7 or 8 wins at a minimum and being highly competitive in most of the other games.

No more thumping 12+ goal losses and no more using injuries as excuses.

2010 is now or never for Dean Bailey and I suspect he knows it.

agreed hes won 7 out of 44games, some people want to grant him a 2 to 3yr extension, cant see that happening nxt week.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

agreed hes won 7 out of 44games, some people want to grant him a 2 to 3yr extension, cant see that happening nxt week.

No they dont. It might pay to actually understanding another view before slagging it.

[LITTLE STINGA 1]

Getting out of the bottom 4 would be a pass, anything less and he will struggle to get a new contract.

[dee-luded 2,958]

We'll be able to find out if Bailey can't coach in the next 3-4 years if we're not playing and winning some finals in that time.

Unfortunately we probably wont find out if he can coach until we really become contenders in 5-8 years and need to win flags.

Do you mean, "find out if he's a good 'Teaching Coach', or a finishing coach (Premiership type coach), or both?

[dee-luded 2,958]

Let's think about what was left for Bailey when he took on the coaching job, let us also think about what the clubs intentions were regarding the list.

Lets also think about our "coaching team", Bailey, Wellman, Mahoney, West, Williams, O'donnell, etc, & see if we're coming along as a young side, or if we're just Richmonding.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Getting out of the bottom 4 would be a pass, anything less and he will struggle to get a new contract.

Based on the past six years you could easily get between 8 and 9.5 wins and finish 13th.

With such a young inexperienced list still in development, that would be a terrific result and should command a significant new contract.

[rpfc 27,497]

I can't believe all of these ringing endorsements for a bloke who has coached a club to two successive wooden spoons!

Yes, granted Bailey has stuck to the club's recent strategy but I am far from convinced he's the right man to lead this talented group in the long term.

He's got this year to really show the club and the Dees faithful he's got the coaching talent and mental toughness to warrant a contract extension.

This means 7 or 8 wins at a minimum and being highly competitive in most of the other games.

No more thumping 12+ goal losses and no more using injuries as excuses.

2010 is now or never for Dean Bailey and I suspect he knows it.

That's more like it Melbourne supporters!

Reducing complex issues into a simplistic truth which leads to a snap decision without all the facts.

[Range Rover 1,935]

That's more like it Melbourne supporters!

Reducing complex issues into a simplistic truth which leads to a snap decision without all the facts.

You can make it as complex as you want and draw up a thousand different variables to try and gloss over the reality, which is that so far under Bailey we've collected two wooden spoons and put on more than a handful of totally inept performances.

7 or 8 wins and out of the bottom 4 or he should be shown the door.

[Goodvibes 3,596]

You can make it as complex as you want and draw up a thousand different variables to try and gloss over the reality, which is that so far under Bailey we've collected two wooden spoons and put on more than a handful of totally inept performances.

7 or 8 wins and out of the bottom 4 or he should be shown the door.

Says the man with a username that celebrates the bright future Bailey's so-called "inept performances" help bring to the club. Can't have it both ways mate.

[Range Rover 1,935]

Says the man with a username that celebrates the bright future Bailey's so-called "inept performances" help bring to the club. Can't have it both ways mate.

What a stupid comment. I'm rightfully excited about the young talent we've got down at the club.

What I'm not excited about is being the laughing stock of the competition for yet another year and paying membership fees to see blokes fumble, turn over the footy and mentally pack it in when the going gets tough.

It's Bailey's job to address those problems and from where I've been sitting he so far hasn't been able to.

The problem with Melbourne FC is people like you who accept and make excuses for mediocrity.

[45HG 1,539]

How many of these unacceptable 12+ goal losses did we have this year ScullytoWatts?

[Keyser Söze 0]

What a stupid comment. I'm rightfully excited about the young talent we've got down at the club.

What I'm not excited about is being the laughing stock of the competition for yet another year and paying membership fees to see blokes fumble, turn over the footy and mentally pack it in when the going gets tough.

It's Bailey's job to address those problems and from where I've been sitting he so far hasn't been able to.

The problem with Melbourne FC is people like you who accept and make excuses for mediocrity.

Great. Another moron who completely misunderstands the concept of 'accepting mediocrity'. Brilliant.

[Goodvibes 3,596]

What a stupid comment. I'm rightfully excited about the young talent we've got down at the club.

What I'm not excited about is being the laughing stock of the competition for yet another year and paying membership fees to see blokes fumble, turn over the footy and mentally pack it in when the going gets tough.

It's Bailey's job to address those problems and from where I've been sitting he so far hasn't been able to.

The problem with Melbourne FC is people like you who accept and make excuses for mediocrity.

Well I'm certainly accepting mediocrity right now as I type in response to your previous post.

I went on record as saying that I was uncomfortable with the way in which we finished the season and the obvious, almost embarrassing way in which we went about engineering losses. I'm trying very hard to accept that these were the actions of a ruthless club willing to exploit any rule or opportunity in a bid to fill the team with further draft talent. I've seen enough improvement in players like Frawley, Jamar, Garland, Morton and Jones to have a little faith in the ability of our coach to develop players. All of these guys were at the club before Bailey and all of them have improved in his time at the MFC.

So who are the players who've fumbled and turned over the footy who you think the coach has failed to develop properly? What should he have been doing? Who would you have replaced these players with?

The point in my previous post was simple. Celebrating the arrival of Scully and Watts is completely understandable but then having the temerity to turn around and question the means in which we went about gaining this young talent is naive. Don't tell me you're from the school of thought that suggests we didn't tank. How else can you single Bailey out for blame?

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Great. Another moron who completely misunderstands the concept of 'accepting mediocrity'. Brilliant.

Mr Scully to Watts is taking a little holiday.

[Guest hellter skelter]

Says the man with a username that celebrates the bright future Bailey's so-called "inept performances" help bring to the club. Can't have it both ways mate.

i hope baily retains his job, but you do have realise hes going for 3wooden spoons in a row.

[Curry & Beer 5,444]

What a stupid comment. I'm rightfully excited about the young talent we've got down at the club.

What I'm not excited about is being the laughing stock of the competition for yet another year and paying membership fees to see blokes fumble, turn over the footy and mentally pack it in when the going gets tough.

It's Bailey's job to address those problems and from where I've been sitting he so far hasn't been able to.

The problem with Melbourne FC is people like you who accept and make excuses for mediocrity.

you are a fool, I don't know if you actually saw any of season 2009 because your perception of what is happening at the club is warped

I just watched the rd 20 match against Freo and we absolutely belted them despite missing half our side. we lost 5 matches by 3 goals or less this year and most of the time were missing several key players. We also 'list managed'. We are far from the worst side in the comp, and thanks to Bailey, we have the absolute best group of under 21s in the league, by far. The only way is up and Bailey is not going anywhere

[Ho Chi Dee 0]

Now is the most crucial time for our list in terms of development, and game-day tactics are less critical. From the outside, Bailey strikes me as a great teacher and developmental coach, which is what we need at this stage of our premiership cycle. In 3 seasons we may well be ready to challenge for a flag, and by then I think we'll know whether Bailey is the right tactical coach to take us there.

If Watts, Scully, Noah, Grimes and Morton develop to the heights we hope they are capable of, I think many will be surprised at how tactically apt Bailey will appear on matchdays. As has been discussed previously on here, the key to success is having an elite top half dozen players - if this happens the rest of a team suddenly looks much better. If you have the quality at the top layer, coaching is made to look pretty easy.

I'm not all that worried about Bailey's performace in 3-4 years. If our recrutiment team has made the most of the opportunities the club has sacrificed for over the last 2 years, the most important factor for future success should already be present. What Baliey's performance over the last 2 seasons has indicated to me is that he's a good choice for job that needs to be done now - development, and he has the fortitude to see success achieved.

Redleg's observation in the OP is an important one as well. The list changes have been significant and what we have now is a very inexperienced list that needs plenty of time to come through together. Those putting pressure on Bailey to see amazing onfield turnarounds next year aren't really taking this into account. Yes it should be better next year, but it most likely be slow progress and development should be the measuring stick, not constrained limits of wins.

Its worth remembering that its taken 7-8 years for the players St Kilda picked up when they were hopeless to be able to lead them to a position of serious challenger.

[52k2 0]

DB deserves more time, most people over the last 2 years have been screaming for him to produce loss after loss. He has done that with not a little class and cunning. Now people are screaming[ once again] but now he has to produce wins or he is out, give the man a break!

I believe at times DB has shown us some of the future, the game against essendon in the third qtr he put Jurrah and Watts across the half forward line by themselves and we didnt look half bad going forward in an otherwise bad game. i think between them they kicked 4 and we looked like a team. But having seen that for nearly a qtr he quickly changed it all round and we never saw that again. I believe he saw what he wanted and didnt want anyother team to notice.

Also the game against carlton, Jamah kicked 5, thats proberly half of his total goals. ND believed resting ruckman should sit the pine, DB [i think] likes them on the ground. Over the past couple of years resting ruckmen in their forward line [ particulary last qtrs ] have cost us games.

A different coach, a different style of game and certainly a different class of cattle.

Lets hold on tight and see how far we go.

ONE TOWN ONE TEAM ONE WIN EVERY WEEK