watt if....we do get pp1 thats Boyd

do we keep and move watts on..... i could be seriously tempted

They'll be playing different positions, BB. Watts will play on a wing and occasionally float forward. Boyd will play deep and the highest he'll get is centre half forward.

Watts kicked 22 goals this season despite spending a lot of time in the back half and up the ground

Thats 1 more goal than he kicked in 2011 when he played the whole year forward

He has improved a lot since then and will just get better, and wail be a star under Roos

Yes he has some weaknesses that make you tear your hair out but for the 5 frustrating things he does each game he does 10 great things

Jacko used to kick a lot of goals as well... so did warwick.

They'll be playing different positions, BB. Watts will play on a wing and occasionally float forward. Boyd will play deep and the highest he'll get is centre half forward.

I like this, yes please.

I'll take a soft performance with a garnish of 4 goals, any day of the week.

4 goals is a solid return, but the fact remains is he might cost us as many if he doesn't start to apply defensive pressure. This would be the number one focus for me if I was coach. I'd stipulate to Jack which position he'd be playing and then I'd work hard on his pressure acts and one-per-centers.

Green was soft. Shirked contests all the time, waited outside packs.

He started as pretty much all round soft. Then he developed courage in the air with his marks but still liked to very much take a big chest mark and protect his ribs. Certainly never saw him attacking the ball on the ground like a Jack Viney does now or a Nathan Jones.

He went from a bit of a soft crafy forward pocket to a decent outside wingman to a full forward who hit the ball hard on a lead but didn't really do a lot else hard or otherwise. Certainly wasn't an ideal career progression for a guy with lovely skills, good reading on the play and strong hands for a guy of his size. Like Bruce he was never developed properly to maximise his strengths and minimise his weaknesses

Watts has a hell of alot of talent, if Roos can up his workrate and he comes out of his shell abit he will be our best player next year imo.

Green was soft ? Coulda sworn I saw him back into packs to mark !! must have been a bloke of another colour !!

Avoiding the pack isnt always a case of being soft. I used a style for years to come across the face of the pack to steal the ball. It still required some heft body contact at times but it did avoid the crunch lol.

You cant always avoid the contact but sometimes its not the best course. Then of course there are those that NEVER seem to go shoulder to shoulder

Green was soft. Shirked contests all the time, waited outside packs.

What a complete load of tripe, I watched him backing into oncoming packs to mark the ball all the time

What a complete load of tripe, I watched him backing into oncoming packs to mark the ball all the time

Early on in his career, and I won't damn him for it, he did similar things to Watts. He would short step to avoid a contest, he would give the ball up to avoid a tackle, etc

I don't have evidence other than my own opinion and recollection.

Green then changed my opinion in the latter half of his career where he became utterly careless of his own safety on the field.

I see it every year in my own footy team; blokes can build the confidence in their body to show a bit more carelessness for their body.

I'll take a soft performance with a garnish of 4 goals, any day of the week.

BBP if course, in rnd 23 with nothin got player for against another tin box side. What about against the Cats, Swans and Hawks in a final, he wouldn't get near it.

I've agreed with Machiavelli twice in the last five minutes! Somebody pinch me!

BBP if course, in rnd 23 with nothin got player for against another tin box side. What about against the Cats, Swans and Hawks in a final, he wouldn't get near it.

Don't rate Morris as a defender?

Don't rate Morris as a defender?

He doesn't have the speed to match Watts on a powerful hard lead. Which is how he got 3 goals. The other came from a rubbish free kick. It was certainly an open match without much pressure.

Morris still shut him down and stopped him touching it for most of the game.

What a complete load of tripe, I watched him backing into oncoming packs to mark the ball all the time

I should have clarified my post further. I was responding to JJJ who said "he was never soft". Green was soft when he started. He grew into being able to take some hits. I'd agree with the courageous marking. But he started off as soft as butter. He worked on it and improved.

Early on in his career, and I won't damn him for it, he did similar things to Watts. He would short step to avoid a contest, he would give the ball up to avoid a tackle, etc

I don't have evidence other than my own opinion and recollection.

Green then changed my opinion in the latter half of his career where he became utterly careless of his own safety on the field.

I see it every year in my own footy team; blokes can build the confidence in their body to show a bit more carelessness for their body.

Exactly.

The problem with Watts is that too often when he's in a position to contest for the ball he gives half an effort and the opposition get a clean possession. We saw it on Sunday a few times where the ball was loose in the forward line. Despite his clear advantage in speed and size he was unwilling to throw himself in there and his opponent won the ball through a superior show of desperation. This is something we see week in week out from Jack and it needs to stop. He suffers from the same issue as Jamie Bennell in that he always tries to avoid body contact and instead wants to ghost past the contest and pinch the ball on his way through. It works maybe once in ten or twenty tries, and the rest of the time the player who goes in with their whole body makes him look hopeless. I don't know if it's possible to cure him of this, but it needs to be attempted if he's ever going to be any real use.

Early on in his career, and I won't damn him for it, he did similar things to Watts. He would short step to avoid a contest, he would give the ball up to avoid a tackle, etc

I don't have evidence other than my own opinion and recollection.

Green then changed my opinion in the latter half of his career where he became utterly careless of his own safety on the field.

I see it every year in my own footy team; blokes can build the confidence in their body to show a bit more carelessness for their body.

Edit, Just read your reply and fair enough, my fault for not reading the whole conversation and taking your post out of context.

Cheers

Edited September 2, 201311 yr by Jarka

I want Watts traded for the right player or draft pick.

I had faith at one point that he would be able to change his mentality but I believe he doesn't want to for this club.

The football club has contributed to his lack of confidence and performance but a lot of it is an ingrained style of play. Lazy, soft but skilled.

If I think about the MFC and the attributes I want players to have and the type of players I want to see run through the banner, Watts is not one.

He has said he doesn't know if he wants to play for the club. That's enough for me to want to get a decent trade going and forget about player attachment.

It's time to move on as a club.

Edited September 3, 201311 yr by stevethemanjordan

I want Watts traded for the right player or draft pick.

I had faith at one point that he would be able to change his mentality but I believe he doesn't want to for this club.

The football club has contributed to his lack of confidence and performance but a lot of it is an ingrained style of play. Laconic, lazy, soft but skilled.

If I think about the MFC and the attributes I want players to have and the type of players I want to see run through the banner, Watts is not one.

He has said he doesn't know if he wants to play for the club. That's enough for me to want to get a decent trade going and forget about player attachment.

It's time to move on as a club.

One more two year performance pay contract?

Worth a shot? Given that he's never worked in an 'accountable' environment before, is there a transformation in him, around the right personnel??

One more two year performance pay contract?

Worth a shot? Given that he's never worked in an 'accountable' environment before, is there a transformation in him, around the right personnel??

Maybe. Maybe not.

This [censored] is so deep though. Look at Viney for example. It's the environment he's been brought up in that has shaped and developed the attributes that have got him to this level. Watts almost has the complete opposite. Sublime skill and a smart footy head but has no physicality, hunger or work ethic.

How does somebody re-condition a player like Watts? No coach or sports psychologist can work on such a thing if the subject is not willing to change, and that's the vibe I get from Watts. He doesn't want to change for us. Look at his level of performance. Look at his body language on field. Look at his chasing and tackling attempts. I don't want someone like that playing for the MFC. It makes me sick.

Watts has got to understand that even if he is to play at another club, his level of performance is not magically going to change. It is completely determined by his output level and his desire to want to change this ingrained style of play.

It's up to him to change.

Edited September 3, 201311 yr by stevethemanjordan

One more two year performance pay contract?

Worth a shot? Given that he's never worked in an 'accountable' environment before, is there a transformation in him, around the right personnel??

Problem with that strategy is if Mick Malthouse says here is a 3 or 4 year contract. Roos and the club have to show that they want Watts to stay and that he has value here.

A two year contract based upon performance doesn't say that... and most performance contracts would be based on numbers of games played... not 1%-ers and tackles etc.

Edited September 3, 201311 yr by Oucher

Laconic

So you don't like Watts because he's a man of few words ... ?

Apart from his four goals from five kicks yesterday, Jack also laid some good tackles and second efforts. I hope that his first year under Roos has everybody who wanted to trade him eating humble pie!

Jack Watts laid a tackle??? Nah dont believe it

If I were the new coach and watts stayed my first job would to toughen him up.

For one day every week I'd put him in the ring with Clarkey and tell him to punch the crap out of him.

One, it'll teach him to box and he'll learn how to block pretty quick.

And secondly, it'll make him realize that s%#t I'm taking a hammering but I've survived.

Yze and Robbo, handy forwards, skirted packs, didn't chase, still decent players. Just frustrating, just like Watts.