Rucking Hell!

[grazman 7,432]

I had high hopes at the end of last year that MJ and PJ would take the necessary steps forward... alas, another year on, White is another year older and we still have two NQR as the support cast. I think one, maybe even both maybe on very shakey ground.

News today that Brendan Lade has re-signed with Port... given the preoccupation with many clubs to get a winning ruck combination... there maybe a few ruck options in the trade period.... talk so far centres on the following big men that maybe on the move:

Cameron Wood (possible)

Darren Jolly (probable)

Brad Moran (probable)

Mark Seaby (possible)

Jamie Charman (unlikely)

Justin Kozitskinik (unlikely)

I'd be interested in Seaby, but really have no idea what WC might want. I've always been of the belief that rather than use early picks on speculative big men that either late picks/rookie picks are a much better option. To be blunt though we are approaching something like a rucking crisis within the club.

We still have Neaves as a Rookie capable of promotion and Holland capable of pinch hitting.... so what would you do?

Personally I'd delist Jamar, trade for another top ten pick to get either Seaby or draft for McEvoy/Bellchambers. I can't comment too much on Neaves, but either way I'm keen to have five ruckman (two longer term prospects) on the list.

[Yze_Magic 3]

I would love Seaby

Make it happen

[brey9186 102]

Seaby is a big possibility, especially if Charman, Jolly and Haselby go to the preseason draft

[Bruce Almighty 0]

Nicholas Natinui will go at 1 in next years draft, wouldn't surprise me if Carlton tank again.

[WonnaJurah 5]

i read that Seaby def wants to stay at eagles , trade be unlikely, but wood or chars id go for

[grazman 7,432]

Quite aside from all this is the issue of Matthew Kreuzer... most think he will go no 1, and he may well do... but listening to Ratten on the W/E he echoed some sentiments expressed by some other very knowledgable junior talent spotters that Cotchin is a very, very good player. I wouldn't be surprised if Carlton took Cotchin at 1 and then taking either Kreuzer or Henderson at 3.

The problem with Kreuzer is he's a big boy playing against other boys....WA and SA prospects such as Luenberger can be easier to assess because they are often playing against men. I'm not saying that Kreuzer is the same as Josh Fraser, but it is easy to get carried away with the form of such players if they are more physically mature than their opponents, they find it harder to do the same thing playing against bigger bodies.

[The Fergburger 0]

Quite aside from all this is the issue of Matthew Kreuser... most think he will go no 1, and he may well do... but listening to Ratten on the W/E he echoed some sentiments expressed by some other very knowledgable junior talent spotters that Cotchin is a very, very good player. I wouldn't be surprised if Carlton took Cotchin at 1 and then taking either Kreuser or Henderson at 3.

The problem with Kreuser is he's a big boy playing against other boys....WA and SA prospects such as Leunenberger can be easier to assess because they are often playing against men. I'm not saying that Kreuser is the same as Josh Fraser, but it is easy to get carried away with the form of such players if they are more physically mature than their opponents, they find it harder to do the same thing playing against bigger bodies.

True, but, all of Carltons ruckman on their list are S%*T. they have to get Kruezer at pick.1 because if they dont he will be picked up at pick.2 by the tigers.

[Lamberto Bava 6]

From that list I'd want Seaby, Wood, Moran in that order. Don't want Jolly back as I don't think he's good enough and the other two wont leave their respective clubs IMO. From what I've heard Neaves would be good to see on the senior list but I think we should look closely at Martin. I remember from before last years draft there was an article in the Herald Sun that had him rated as a first round draft pick, then he never got drafted for some reason.2It must be hard for these two young fella's as they would rarely get a lot of game time when there is almost always one of PJ or Jamar in the Sandy firsts, both of whom are very very good at VFL level.

I'd be pretty happy with a ruck division next year consisting of Seaby/Wood, Neaves and White with Whitey and Neaves sharing second ruck, and MArtin on the rookie list at the MFC if he's good enough.

[demoniac 1,333]

White is a Follower not a Ruckman. He is 31 and the centre circle has neutered his main weapon being his leap. Is out of contract I think. Has hard hands so is a poor overhead mark. Also is just not a player of any great physicality.

The last Nm 1 Ruckman we had was Strawbs O'Dwyer, like White, Stynes was a Follower. Its been a weakness for 20 years. Simply put White and Stynes did play like extra midfiielders, the problem being that none of our actual midfielders grew 10 cms and started taking pack marks and throwing their weight around like a ruckman.

As I said White is 31 in 08 and way past his best. We have to keep Johnson and Jamar in the interim unitl other options appear. Jamar is more of a ruck at this stage. Is 4 or 5 cms taller than White, has a good leap and is physical. Ruckwork needs to improve and needs to take more of the marks he gets his hands on. Johnson is quick and agile and skillfull for his size but needs to improve his overhead marking. May be an interim replacement as FF Gorilla for Neitz rather than a Ruck. Neaves may also be an option.

Our rebuild must focus on our ruck division and our spine. Our spine is starting to come together with Newton, Frawley, Rivers, maybe Dunn but more options are required and must be drafted. The same with the Ruck. We are in rebuilding mode, we need to cut players who aren't going to help us to a flag to ensure there are spots on the senior list and rookie list to stock up on genuinely tall rucks and key position prospects.

[Nicho 1]

I would go after Seaby, Jolly or Moran....... But dont give up much....

We need to lkeep our picks and draft the kids....

It time to go for Jamar and for Neaves to be elavated for his chance on the big stage.

[Demons 32 235]

Seaby is a big possibility, especially if Charman, Jolly and Haselby go to the preseason draft

I hope that sort of talent makes the pre-season draft. Haselby still has alot left and is a superstar. Really think he needs a change.

Charman has become a really stron ruckman at Brisbane, thats why I don't think he will get to pre-season draft. Jolly could still work, I wouldn't be upset if we got him. Love to get big Seaby, he is agile, he was behind Gardiner, now Cox, will be very good once given the correct oppurtunities.

[Jerry Lundergard 420]

We seem to get our fair share of hit outs. I believe that our biggest problem is that we don't actually have the capacity to tap to advantage(our midfielders inability to win the ball around stoppages contributes to this as well). I have harped on about this many times, but i can't cop the fact that when a ruckman can get a clear tap at a contest, he is unable to actually have the thought process to try to tap down to advantage, rather than just bash it aimlessly. Port Adelaide are by far the best team when it comes to running set plays at rucking stoppages, so hopefully Bailey can help us out in that department.

[grazman 7,432]

According to the papers... we can add Meesen as a possible as well.

[deestroyers 0]

Theres a 17 year old kid, 195cms and 90kgs running around as first ruck for Calder Cannons this year. Suprised nobody has mentioned him.

Goes by the name of Shaun McKernan, yes he is the younger brother of Corey.

Not a bad pedigree id say, and would probably slip through the draft a bit as he has had an ankle injury and missed a few with concussion.

Thoughts?

[Madness 44]

Theres a 17 year old kid, 195cms and 90kgs running around as first ruck for Calder Cannons this year. Suprised nobody has mentioned him.

Goes by the name of Shaun McKernan, yes he is the younger brother of Corey.

Not a bad pedigree id say, and would probably slip through the draft a bit as he has had an ankle injury and missed a few with concussion.

Thoughts?

Think I'm over 195cm ruckman, he wouldn't grow that much...

[grazman 7,432]

Edit.

Mark Seaby (Gone)

Jamie Charman (Gone)

Justin Kositzizxccnik (Gone)

Gonna have to pay the man if we want to trade for a ruckman, gonna have to pay him twice if we want one that can actually play.

Shaun McKernan, yes he is the younger brother of Corey.

Thoughts?

Melbourne have a new proviso for their recruiting manager.... it's called the dud brother ultimatum... don't draft em! (OK that's just tongue in cheek... I've got no idea about the kid)

[beelzebub 23,350]

Think I'm over 195cm ruckman, he wouldn't grow that much...

every chance he'd make 2m plus .. ya dont stop growing as a guy til approx 23-25

[Jumping Jack Clennett 1,780]

quote 'belzebub59'

"dont stop growing as a guy til approx 23-25"

How I wish that were true, Beelzebub. Then there would be a chance the Russian and PJ could reach the necessary height for an AFL ruckman under the current rules. And Neaves might have ended up as tall as Sandilands!

It varies from person to person, but it's unusual to put on height after the age of 20.

[beelzebub 23,350]

true JJC.. they may not put much on after 21.. and as you allude will vary from person to person... but if the lad is only 17...he's still growing !!

[grazman 7,432]

I didn't grow even a cm after I turned 14... it's different for everyone... you shouldn't draft on guess work.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

quote 'belzebub59'

"dont stop growing as a guy til approx 23-25"

How I wish that were true, Beelzebub. Then there would be a chance the Russian and PJ could reach the necessary height for an AFL ruckman under the current rules. And Neaves might have ended up as tall as Sandilands!

It varies from person to person, but it's unusual to put on height after the age of 20.

I dont know about the 23- 25 level but up to 20 definitely. At 17 there is definitely room to grow.

Russian and PJ could grow and they would still carry the same deficiencies they do...Likewise with Neaves.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Melbourne have a new proviso for their recruiting manager.... it's called the dud brother ultimatum... don't draft em! (OK that's just tongue in cheek... I've got no idea about the kid)

I thought with the Cocky Collins we got around that by recruiting two dud brothers!

[deestroyers 0]

true JJC.. they may not put much on after 21.. and as you allude will vary from person to person... but if the lad is only 17...he's still growing !!

This is exactly my reasoning behind suggesting him in the first place. He would still have a good 3-4 years of growing....and considering he is already 195, theres a chance he will reach the 200cm mark which we all crave.

By no means am I saying take the kid with our 2nd rounder, but by all means if he is available come 4th round why wouldnt you consider it? If he doesnt grow to 200+ he may well just turn into a KPP, who knows? Dean Cox was a rookie list pick up, its the gamble you have to be willing to take once in a while.