On 13/04/2025 at 22:17, Earl Hood said:

There is a huge difference between how Heeney uses his knee to get lift for the mark, that’s the way it should be done versus the way Moore used his knee deliberately, in my mind, as a weapon to inflict damage to the opposition player in front of him and in doing so actually limited the lift he could get to spoil the ball.

Oh come on

Next youl be stating Maynards dirty ko on poor Gus was a footy act.

10 hours ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Viney like the 2023 semi final loss to Carlton completely lost his way in the dying moments. When the guy is up for grabs under immense pressure, both Viney and Oliver fail to meet their end of the bargain. They crumble under pressure and Viney is an absolute liability when it comes to close games. Oliver as well.

If i had an option between trading out one of Petracca or Oliver, then its Oliver for me.

We would be silly not to look at trading Lever as well.

Spargo will assess his options at years end.

Lucky to get anything for Salem.

So who's mentoring the next gen of defender if Lever goes? May has one more year (possibly) left and his leadership style is authoritarian and probably won't fly with younger players.

Likewise, we should not get rid of other senior players willy nilly.

Hawthorn were in the wilderness for ages because they did that, North the same, and we ourselves know what happens when we clear our senior players and replace them with younger players.

All well and good to say we want to get rid of senior players, but you then have to replace them with senior players.

Better the devil you know IMO. I don't entirely disagree with you on Clarry, but I think it's still possible he plays an important role going forward. But we need different ideas in the coaches box.

40 minutes ago, Adam The God said:

Hawthorn were in the wilderness for ages because they did that, North the same, and we ourselves know what happens when we clear our senior players and replace them with younger players.

It's helped them in recent time though, shifted Tom Mitchell's cap space and also traded O'Meara for Lloyd Meek etc. Helped kick on the bounce back.

54 minutes ago, roy11 said:

It's helped them in recent time though, shifted Tom Mitchell's cap space and also traded O'Meara for Lloyd Meek etc. Helped kick on the bounce back.

Mitchell and O'Meara are the guys they brought in to replace the senior players they jettisoned in the first place.

Edited 17 hours ago17 hr by Adam The God

Sadly, I think many are coming to the realisation that Clarry will be going and we'll be paying some of his salary....

Even more sadly we'll probably be better for it...Maybe if we carry enough of his contract we can negotiate a first rounder? 😞

Edited 15 hours ago15 hr by Dee*ceiving

31 minutes ago, Dee*ceiving said:

Sadly, I think many are coming to the realisation that Clarry will be going and we'll be paying some of his salary....

Even more sadly we'll probably be better for it...Maybe if we carry enough of his contract we can negotiate a first rounder? 😞

We know Geelong are likely still keen and probably Clarry too. I'd be hopeful of a first rounder but considering Geelong got Bowes and a first for nothing I'm not too sure where the Oliver situation sits. Guess it comes down to how much salary both sides pay or if it's even possible Clarry can sign a contract taking less to move.

Edited 15 hours ago15 hr by kurtneverdied

It's interesting revisiting this conundrum.

Some days i think both can still contribute . Other days I just wonder. You watch the 21 big dance and then watch any game since especially this season .

Neither are the player they were. Trac has ebbed and flowed somewhat since but to be brutally honest his performance since coming back from that dastardly injury hasn't been the same.

Clarry.... well.... just not as dynamically hurtful to the opposition as once.

Not blaming either. They're older .

Really starting to think it might be time for many to move on . Dees aren't playing deep into September for some years on current trend.

Dees need a big refresh.

Im not losing sleep if either or both are elsewhere in 26. Wish them both well , here ......or there.

36 minutes ago, Dee*ceiving said:

Sadly, I think many are coming to the realisation that Clarry will be going and we'll be paying some of his salary....

3 minutes ago, kurtneverdied said:

We know Geelong are likely still keen and probably Clarry too

He won't be going because there's zero interest in him from other clubs.

2 hours ago, Adam The God said:

Mitchell and O'Meara are the guys they brought in to replace the senior players they jettisoned in the first place.

This just proves more that Hawks kept making moves and identified earlier to move players on to get to the right spot.

Yes probably likely we won't get like for like output but it opens doors for cap space or picks and better contracts vs output and change is probably best for both parties.

1 minute ago, lorn said:

He won't be going because there's zero interest in him from other clubs.

Highly doubt Cats have changed stance that much. If anything his contract looks better with a year off it.

6 minutes ago, kurtneverdied said:

I'd be hopeful of a first rounder

Oliver's nowhere near the player he was so second rounders is all we'll get and we'll have to pay a big chunk of his wage. So he's become un-tradeable

Edited 15 hours ago15 hr by lorn

If Geelong end up nabbing James Worpel then there is no way they will pursue Oliver.

3 minutes ago, kurtneverdied said:

Highly doubt Cats have changed stance that much. If anything his contract looks better with a year off it.

Yeah Geelong's stance probably hasn't changed much but their stance is a second rounder and we pay a big chunk of his wage. The club won't accept that.

1 minute ago, dazzledavey36 said:

If Geelong end up nabbing James Worpel then there is no way they will pursue Oliver.

Yeah Geelong seem far more interested in other players. I think they have little interest in Oliver particularly considering he was ordinary last year and ordinary again this year. He just doesn't impact anymore and clubs have lost interest.

Edited 15 hours ago15 hr by lorn

Definitely agree we likely get a 2nd at best I'm someone wants him.

These long contracts are killing us and didn't learn from it signing Pickett on one.

14 minutes ago, kurtneverdied said:

Definitely agree we likely get a 2nd at best I'm someone wants him.

These long contracts are killing us and didn't learn from it signing Pickett on one.

Yeah expecting to get smashed here but the Pickett contract is going to be a problem down the track imo.

If he decides in 3 years that he just can't do Melbourne anymore, are we going to be expected to foot the bill for him to play somewhere else? That's why the Petracca and Oliver stuff is such a line in the sand thing I reckon. Have to stand firm and say 'if you want out, you find someone who'll pay your whole contract and compensate us fairly, or you negotiate a new contract with someone else and they compensate us fairly'. Otherwise you knuckle down and pay us back for the massive investment we've made in you.

I think that if the above is the accepted premise for the industry, then long contracts are OK. Yeah you still take the risk on injury but you just can't have a situation where players are dictating things once they've made commitments like these.

3 minutes ago, rufus said:

Yeah expecting to get smashed here but the Pickett contract is going to be a problem down the track imo.

If he decides in 3 years that he just can't do Melbourne anymore, are we going to be expected to foot the bill for him to play somewhere else? That's why the Petracca and Oliver stuff is such a line in the sand thing I reckon. Have to stand firm and say 'if you want out, you find someone who'll pay your whole contract and compensate us fairly, or you negotiate a new contract with someone else and they compensate us fairly'. Otherwise you knuckle down and pay us back for the massive investment we've made in you.

I think that if the above is the accepted premise for the industry, then long contracts are OK. Yeah you still take the risk on injury but you just can't have a situation where players are dictating things once they've made commitments like these.

I’m not sure on how this all works from a legal and trade perspective, I may be way off the mark. The first thing I thought of when the Pickett deal was announced was that Melbourne have done him a solid by guaranteeing his money if and when he moves.

I’ve got little doubt he won’t fulfill his entire contract, so if someone wants him, they have to pay him that money regardless.

I realise it’s simplistic but it’s also set Pickett up for life whether a dee or not.

1 hour ago, kurtneverdied said:

We know Geelong are likely still keen and probably Clarry too. I'd be hopeful of a first rounder but considering Geelong got Bowes and a first for nothing I'm not too sure where the Oliver situation sits. Guess it comes down to how much salary both sides pay or if it's even possible Clarry can sign a contract taking less to move.

To me its full salary for a 2nd rounder. Or pay part salary and Geelongs first this year. I just cant see it being any more than that.

Id seriously do it now for a 2nd rounder, which we could use to go after GC Suns Pick 8 or 11. Give we are carrying (or will be) Gus's salary for the next few years, id hate to stack on more of that.

What would annoy me tremendously is if Oliver went back to his old for after the trade - hard to see it, but its always a possibiliy.

Maybe we make the trade contingent on a 2nd pick that is tied to Oliver BnF finish in his first year.

2 hours ago, Dee*ceiving said:

Sadly, I think many are coming to the realisation that Clarry will be going and we'll be paying some of his salary....

Even more sadly we'll probably be better for it...Maybe if we carry enough of his contract we can negotiate a first rounder? 😞

As much as it pains me to say it I agree with you. He will land at Geelong in 2026 and u can put ur house on it!

Reckon Clarry will have to take a pay cut to be moved on

The club isn’t going to want to be paying $500,000+ a year to another club to take him, and no other club will want to pay anywhere near $1 million for him

Whether Clarry has the appetite to do this is another question, but personally I think it’s getting to the point where it would benefit both parties to shake hands and see if an agreement that works for him, ourselves and another club can be reached

12 minutes ago, picket fence said:

As much as it pains me to say it I agree with you. He will land at Geelong in 2026 and u can put ur house on it!

I hate so much that I believe this as well that he'll be out of the Dees at the end of this season.

What I'm going to hate more is that he'll probably find his motivation again getting back to his best keeping the cats in the top 4 for the next 6 years while we debate whether the P20 +/- we receive should be in our ones or twos languishing in 'no mans land' on the AFL ladder of 10-15.

Watching Bailey Smith average career highs in possessions, I50s, R50s and tackles is just an example of how much players can find the extra when needed. It does frustrate me that professional athletes getting paid a fortune aren't always 100% committed but they are human beings who do go through the motions.

Just a shame he hasn't found that with us, dropped the extra kgs and got the power back in his game.

25 minutes ago, picket fence said:

As much as it pains me to say it I agree with you. He will land at Geelong in 2026 and u can put ur house on it!

Can I put your house on it?

On 29/07/2025 at 09:32, Jaded No More said:

Has his contract stopped us getting another player or signing our own stars like Kosi?

Where did supporters get the idea that we have salary cap issues?

Was it the Houston chase? the fact we are talking to Reid's manager? that we tried luring McKay out of Carlton for 2 years?

That fact we have a midfielder on $1-1.7m give or take for the next 5 years whose output is that of a plodder that can't kick or play any other position is a salary cap issue.

57 minutes ago, Deeko2 said:

I hate so much that I believe this as well that he'll be out of the Dees at the end of this season.

What I'm going to hate more is that he'll probably find his motivation again getting back to his best keeping the cats in the top 4 for the next 6 years while we debate whether the P20 +/- we receive should be in our ones or twos languishing in 'no mans land' on the AFL ladder of 10-15.

Watching Bailey Smith average career highs in possessions, I50s, R50s and tackles is just an example of how much players can find the extra when needed. It does frustrate me that professional athletes getting paid a fortune aren't always 100% committed but they are human beings who do go through the motions.

Just a shame he hasn't found that with us, dropped the extra kgs and got the power back in his game.

Bailey Smith does seem to miss a fair few games for very vague reasons and I dont sense this will become any less.

Edited 11 hours ago11 hr by Lil_red_fire_engine

3 hours ago, kurtneverdied said:

Highly doubt Cats have changed stance that much. If anything his contract looks better with a year off it.

Better in that it has 5 years to run not six to run but no club is taking on his full contract without Dees attaching a very early pick. And a club that can take on his full contract may not be a club he wants to go to.

Its a pickle.

Maybe he takes a significant pay cut to get a trade done.