Just a reminder to everyone: Please refrain from posting any personal information regarding a player's mental health. This includes making assumptions, drawing your own conclusions, or sharing unverified rumours; even if you believe them to be true.

19 hours ago, Jaded No More said:

Players who choose to leave because the coach has left, were never really invested in the club anyway. Coaches come and go. Ask Tmac how many he’s played under.

That's a pretty cynical take. Players aren't robots, no matter how much supporters want them to be. For the older players in the group, those who probably only have a year or two left in them (hello Melksham), then the thought of having to start from scratch with a new coach and build a relationship with, for the sake of another year or two may be something that encourages them to retire now. Melksham has already said he's 50/50 because of increasing outside interests and won't make decision on going around again until the end of the year - I wouldn't be suprised at all if he decides to retire. Having said that, the irony is that if they're as close to another premiership as some believe, then they'll hold out for one last tilt. As for Koz, he won't leave, he didn't sign on expecting Goodwin to be coaching for the next 9 years, but starting up from with a new coach is going to be destabilising. Time will tell how much it is for him - and others.

1 minute ago, Adina88 said:

That's a pretty cynical take. Players aren't robots, no matter how much supporters want them to be. For the older players in the group, those who probably only have a year or two left in them (hello Melksham), then the thought of having to start from scratch with a new coach and build a relationship with, for the sake of another year or two may be something that encourages them to retire now. Melksham has already said he's 50/50 because of increasing outside interests and won't make decision on going around again until the end of the year - I wouldn't be suprised at all if he decides to retire. Having said that, the irony is that if they're as close to another premiership as some believe, then they'll hold out for one last tilt. As for Koz, he won't leave, he didn't sign on expecting Goodwin to be coaching for the next 9 years, but starting up from with a new coach is going to be destabilising. Time will tell how much it is for him - and others.

I wasn't talking about the likes of Melksham or Tmac who are on the fence re: retirement, and may well have retired had Goody stayed or not.

I am talking about senior players who still have a long career ahead of them, especially those we screamed and yelled about the club getting better.

Players have to take responsibility for what has happened as well. Sure a senior coach is responsible for results, but so are his players. Our highly paid premiership players, with the sole exception of Gawn, have put up some truly garbage performances over the last 18 months. Where we find ourselves now is on them as much as it is on the coaches, including Goody.

Any change is scary. The reality is that almost every player on our list loved Goody, because he is a really good person who cared deeply about the players. And when you lose a boss that you love, no matter how poorly the company is performing under them, you are scared because what if the next boss isn't nice?

But players who are committed to the cause will understand that the club is trying to get better results, and those close to the end of their career should see this as an opportunity to steal another flag. Something that was unlikely to happen under Goody in the short term. I wonder how Pendelbury and Sidebottom felt when Buckley left... I bet they never believed they'd win another flag so soon under a new coach.

As for Kos, no matter who coaches us next there is no doubt in my mind that they will see him as one of our most valuable assets. He is by far our best and most important player heading into the future. And we still have Matty Whelan doing a brilliant job in supporting not just Kosi but all of our indigenous players. That won't change under a new coach, unless our board has a mental breakdown.

I wonder if Oliver and Petracca wanting out had to do with the fact that Goodwin saw the team as being in a rebuild phase, and then not wanting to play what should be their best years of footy down the bottom.

4 hours ago, titan_uranus said:

According to Jon Ralph (yes, yes, I know):

“Christian Petracca doesn’t want to leave and the club is adamant it is not letting him go. They want to set him up for a superstar return to form, he’s not quite there this year. They also want to help him off the field to set himself up for life, if he hasn’t already.

Ralph said the “big one” to watch is Oliver, who nearly left for Geelong last year, suggesting the only way the four-time best and fairest could move is if he took a pay cut and Melbourne contributed towards his salary elsewhere.

“If he accepted a massive, massive pay cut — let’s call it $400,000 — and Melbourne paid out — let’s call it $300,000 — he’s still on that $800,000-$900,000 a year. I just don’t think there’s any takers for him,” he said.

“But if I was a fresh coach coming into this situation, would I want Oliver always in my midfield? I think I’d probably want him to move on. But it’s just so hard to factor a market where there’s enough money off the books to pay him.

“I think if you’re paying over $1 million for him, Petracca and Kysaiah Pickett, that’s too much of a handcuff. Especially if they’re not going to win a premiership in the next couple of years.

“I think it's a big decision ahead on Clayton. If I was them I’d move heaven and earth to move on Clayton.”

Fox Sports

‘Diametrically opposed’: Inside Goodwin’s axing, $1.2m pa...

‘Was he deluded?’ Inside story of $1.2m Dees axe... and trade watch set to re-ignite

Someone will pay 800k for Oliver that ain't a heap of money in the current game.

20 minutes ago, KozzyCan said:

Someone will pay 800k for Oliver that ain't a heap of money in the current game.

Wonder how many agents would recommend an an annual $400,000 pay cut to their clients.

5 minutes ago, Demonland said:

Article summary: Dees may or may not trade players

Just now, adonski said:

Article summary: Dees may or may not trade players

Well it is that time of the year.

1 minute ago, Demonland said:

Well it is that time of the year.

Another 'JON' have a bob each way

10 hours ago, titan_uranus said:

According to Jon Ralph (yes, yes, I know):

“Christian Petracca doesn’t want to leave and the club is adamant it is not letting him go. They want to set him up for a superstar return to form, he’s not quite there this year. They also want to help him off the field to set himself up for life, if he hasn’t already.

Ralph said the “big one” to watch is Oliver, who nearly left for Geelong last year, suggesting the only way the four-time best and fairest could move is if he took a pay cut and Melbourne contributed towards his salary elsewhere.

“If he accepted a massive, massive pay cut — let’s call it $400,000 — and Melbourne paid out — let’s call it $300,000 — he’s still on that $800,000-$900,000 a year. I just don’t think there’s any takers for him,” he said.

“But if I was a fresh coach coming into this situation, would I want Oliver always in my midfield? I think I’d probably want him to move on. But it’s just so hard to factor a market where there’s enough money off the books to pay him.

“I think if you’re paying over $1 million for him, Petracca and Kysaiah Pickett, that’s too much of a handcuff. Especially if they’re not going to win a premiership in the next couple of years.

“I think it's a big decision ahead on Clayton. If I was them I’d move heaven and earth to move on Clayton.”

Fox Sports

‘Diametrically opposed’: Inside Goodwin’s axing, $1.2m pa...

‘Was he deluded?’ Inside story of $1.2m Dees axe... and trade watch set to re-ignite

Interesting article.

In my view the board doesn't make the call about the list needing a revamp without doing its due diligence. Which suggests to me that either some leaders within the playing group, or some in the coaching group felt, or both, felt we were heading in the wrong direction.

Interesting that Goodwin felt we would be contending again next year. Of course he would say that though: final year of his contract with no extension in sight.

Which then begs ANOTHER question: had Goodwin presented to the board that we need a list revamp and rebuild, would he have been kept?

Just fascinating that one of the triggers for his sacking was that he felt we'd be contending in 12 months.

I think we have the pieces to play finals and should be playing finals. It just really does seem like a big delusion somewhere.

5 hours ago, roy11 said:

Wonder how many agents would recommend an an annual $400,000 pay cut to their clients.

They wouldn't. Oliver would have to ask his manager to find a trade and they would come back with the best offers.

I dont want players that don't want to be at the club.

Pay what we must to get rid of them.

It's bad for and brings negativity.

I think it's been part of our downfall.

Against the trend here but I want Clarry and Trac to stay. We have committed the money which as caps increase will not seem as huge. In Clarry I see a player who only has one thing he does and footy is his life. Say what you want but he always busts his guts with endeavour and despite not achieving previous heights still had a serviceable year. I don’t see any likely replacements. He may have issues but I like his somewhat innocent, enthusiastic nature. As for Trac I think his recovery from that injury will naturally take more time, I anticipate him being even better next year after having a very serviceable 2025. Again, who will come in that is better.

I would rather see a turnover of the likes of May, TMac and Melky as the start of a new generation. Melky, a possible one more year proposition to lead the young forward line.

Just my thoughts and probably based on emotion but a positive gelling within the club is an emotion driven thing anyway. I always look back on the lack of respect shown to Junior - getting rid of him didn’t improve our club.

I'm feeling more and more that the likely outcome is these two being at MFC next year.

The one important day that I am looking forward to:

The day the new coach has their first formal conversation with one Christian Petracca and one Clayton Oliver.

Cards on the table, vision and plans for these guys how they fit going forward. If they buy in then the challenge is for the coach getting them back to somewhere near their best.

5 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Ok, that’s having a narrative and ‘finding data’ to back it up. But whatever

11 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Laying into Langford? They really are scooping the bottom of the barrel. Suspect they have money on another rising star nominee.

4 minutes ago, GS_1905 said:

Laying into Langford? They really are scooping the bottom of the barrel. Suspect they have money on another rising star nominee.

Well they weren't..

49 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Preface this with only commenting on what I see on match day and not during the week.

Trac has been doing this kind of thing for ages. Can't remember the last time I saw him be super encouraging and calm as a leader. Looks really unhappy at the club atm

I'm becoming less and less fussed about keeping Petracca and/or Oliver. The fact is they are superstars of an era in the past.

They would barely scrape in as top 50 players now. Look at some of the young talent us and the Dogs had on the weekend. Ed Richards, Freijha, Sanders and Langford are all young talent from the draft who'd I'd rather have or (keep in the case of Langford) over Trac or Oliver. I think we're just getting blinded by sentiment on these guys and not considering some of the talent we may get through the door instead.

1 minute ago, At the break of Gawn said:

I'm becoming less and less fussed about keeping Petracca and/or Oliver. The fact is they are superstars of an era in the past.

They would barely scrape in as top 50 players now. Look at some of the young talent us and the Dogs had on the weekend. Ed Richards, Freijha, Sanders and Langford are all young talent from the draft who'd I'd rather have or (keep in the case of Langford) over Trac or Oliver. I think we're just getting blinded by sentiment on these guys and not considering some of the talent we may get through the door instead.

Sanders is very ordinary

1 hour ago, dazzledavey36 said:

People won't like it cause it's Cornes saying it but I think there's a really valid point made about how the senior players gained way too much power within the club and it's probably one of the biggest reasons Goodwin needed to go.

33 minutes ago, At the break of Gawn said:

I'm becoming less and less fussed about keeping Petracca and/or Oliver. The fact is they are superstars of an era in the past.

They would barely scrape in as top 50 players now. Look at some of the young talent us and the Dogs had on the weekend. Ed Richards, Freijha, Sanders and Langford are all young talent from the draft who'd I'd rather have or (keep in the case of Langford) over Trac or Oliver. I think we're just getting blinded by sentiment on these guys and not considering some of the talent we may get through the door instead.

I’d lean towards the opposite being true. I think stars who have dropped off get judged more harshly than rising stars. Ed Richards aside who is already the real deal, the remaining names on that list don’t come close to Petracca and Oliver’s current output but raise excitement because of potential that may or may not be realised. I’d suggest outside Richards, it’s unlikely more than 1 of the others are in the top 50 players in the comp at any point in their career (I’m hopeful Langford will be).

Imagine if Oliver or Petracca were first or second year players at their current output. Everyone would be drooling. They’ve had a year or two from hell and aren’t exactly old. I’ll back them to get closer to their best rather than hoping to get new talent (second round picks?) that may or may not be starters let alone very good players at the level.

1 hour ago, rpfc said:

Ok, that’s having a narrative and ‘finding data’ to back it up. But whatever

Plenty of that around here too.. Stats files/podcast?