CHANGES: Rd 22 vs Carlton

[DeeSpencer 25,723]

Have to think about moving Gus back to half back again. But then you’ve got the same issue of a slow backline that can’t kick or push aggressively up the ground and the ball sits in our backline.

Otherwise it’s Harmes for Sparrow.

Maybe JvR for Melk. Maybe.

Maybe Bowey for Riv.

[Demon Dynasty 17,109]

29 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

What's the point of bringing in guys like Chandler and JVR now..

We had genuine opportunities to give these guys a crack few weeks back when they were in form to try and get them up to scratch with our forward mix and structure, but no.. we've left it far too late in the season where wins are critical as due to potentially now missing top 4.

Goody's stubbornness once again gets the better of him.

Absolutely..... play the form players.  The opportunity was the Port game.  Missed our chance to give JVR & Chandler a  deserved chance.  Particularly Chandler who was hitting the scoreboard and bringing all the pressure / off the ball stuff that was lacking inisde 50 even back then.

The game we failed to lay any tackles inside 50 should have sent alarm bells ringing.  It must have to some degree if the Pow Wow truly did go down.

[leucopogon 1,519]

7 minutes ago, titan_uranus said:

ANB 22 pressure acts

 

Imagine if you counted the pressure acts he brought on himself due to fumbling, two grabbing at balls and not having any peripheral vision , let alone agility in traffic. The bloke runs in dead straight lines. Needs to be dropped. 

Bring in JVR, its time. Our system needs at least two genuine tall marking targets.

[dazzledavey36 55,004]

Just now, Demon Dynasty said:

Absolutely..... play the form players.  The opportunity was the Port game.  Missed our chance to give JVR & Chandler a  deserved chance.  Particularly Chandler who was hitting the scoreboard and bringing all the pressure / off the ball stuff that was lacking inisde 50 even back then.

The game we failed to lay any tackles inside 50 should have sent alarm bells ringing.  It must have to some degree if the Pow Wow truly did go down.

Even the Bulldogs game you could see our system was not standing up especially our forward half pressure.

Missed opportunity to get Chandler and JVR amongst the team.

Pretty sure we're the least team this year for players used. Sums it up really..

[titan_uranus 25,020]

12 minutes ago, Garbo said:

The fwd line didn’t get 100 points scored against them for the 2nd time in 3 weeks, this is a defensive problem. If we are needing to score 100+ to win games we have already lost.

The forward line laid 8 tackles from 65 inside 50s (compared to their 18 from 41).

Too many inside 50s rebounded.

The forward line has problems, but perhaps not the ones being discussed here.

But yes, as a general concept I agree with you that things are wrong if we're conceding 96 points (albeit this week that was contributed to in part by their good accuracy of 15.6).

[Bates Mate 4,501]

1 hour ago, chook fowler said:

Harmes and Bowza must come in

This. Brayshaw moves back to the wing/half back. We miss Bowser's ability to create and kick a 20-30 m 45 degree kick that turns defence into an offence. All our defenders kick long down the line and we just need to mix it up

[Bates Mate 4,501]

39 minutes ago, Lord Nev said:

IN: Harmes, JVR

OUT: Jordon, Hunt

 

I was on Jordons wing all night, we worked his guts out and one of our better players I thought. Actually was looking to attack most of the time

[DeeSpencer 25,723]

4 minutes ago, titan_uranus said:

The forward line laid 8 tackles from 65 inside 50s (compared to their 18 from 41).

Too many inside 50s rebounded.

The forward line has problems, but perhaps not the ones being discussed here.

But yes, as a general concept I agree with you that things are wrong if we're conceding 96 points (albeit this week that was contributed to in part by their good accuracy of 15.6).

If inside 50 speed of delivery and inside 50 numbers of defenders were measured there’s would’ve been twice as fast with half as many defenders.

There’s issues with the defensive stuff but we’re so slow to move it in there defenders are so rarely under pressure. 

[Demon Dynasty 17,109]

1 minute ago, leucopogon said:

Imagine if you counted the pressure acts he brought on himself due to fumbling, two grabbing at balls and not having any peripheral vision , let alone agility in traffic. The bloke runs in dead straight lines. Needs to be dropped. 

Bring in JVR, its time. Our system needs at least two genuine tall marking targets.

100% this.  Max proved tonight he is only a part timer (temp/resting forward) at best and can't be relied on to kick goals.

BBB was a positive and admirable all day but had no support / decoys.

Also why were so many players hell bent on taking on the tacklers tonight instead of kicking the ball to the hot spot/zone about 15/20 out from goal?

Also so many intential shanked kicks to the pocket. Maxy/JJ some of the worst offenders here.  This 'playing safe' lock the ball in our 50, in preference to kicking to the hot zone or fat side is killing this team's chances.

The one play where we did this via Clarry kicking from deep right flank to the hot zone worked, with Lingers marking and splitting the middle directly in front.

Kicking to the pocket so often is a massive win to the oppo's defenders and all it does is lift their belief & confidence as we just don't ask the question and put them under pressure often enough.  Also many of our long kicks are kicked too close to goals in an attempt to kick a 45/50 meter goal but all we do is again play into the defender's hands allowing them to thump it threw quite often.

[DeeSpencer 25,723]

1 minute ago, Bates Mate said:

I was on Jordons wing all night, we worked his guts out and one of our better players I thought. Actually was looking to attack most of the time

He played well. The only reason to drop him would be if they want to go back to Gus on the wing. Our midfield badly needs more speed, but I doubt it will be with JJ out to make it happen 

[dees189227 12,394]

Out gawn

In  the max gawn from the prelim final and from last year whose kicking was spot on & never missed goals

[Lord Nev 13,512]

2 minutes ago, Bates Mate said:

I was on Jordons wing all night, we worked his guts out and one of our better players I thought. Actually was looking to attack most of the time

Can never fault his effort or work ethic, but his lack of speed and decisiveness is hurting us atm. Wouldn't be against moving him to a different role instead of dropping him, but he's costing us on the wing IMO.

[DeeSpencer 25,723]

1 minute ago, Demon Dynasty said:

Also why were so many players hell bent on taking on the tacklers tonight instead of kicking the ball to the hot spot/zone about 15/20 out from goal?

Also so many intential shanked kicks to the pocket. Maxy/JJ some of the worst offenders here.  This 'playing safe' lock the ball in our 50, in preference to kicking to the hot zone or fat side is killing this team's chances.

Because that’s our game plan and Darcy Moore exists.

The worst ones are when we go slow, position the talls and still shank it not even getting it deep in the pocket.

Is the plan flawed? Are the personnel flawed. Hard to say which, or if plan B is better. But it’s hard to watch right now 

[Guest]

It’s clear we need another tall.

JVR has the form. He’s been made to wait. He mightn’t set the world on fire, but he’ll add an new ingredient for sure.

I’d say Nibbler sadly is my out. He has a dip, but he’s bloody frustrating with ball in hand. We have enough bad decision makers.

[DeeSpencer 25,723]

1 minute ago, Lord Nev said:

Can never fault his effort or work ethic, but his lack of speed and decisiveness is hurting us atm. Wouldn't be against moving him to a different role instead of dropping him, but he's costing us on the wing IMO.

There’s some of that, but plenty of his using it well and drawing runners. We also rarely kick or handball to him early or quickly. If we used him quickly it would encourage his next disposal to be quick too. So often he’s the last resort after inside options get shut down. Then the next kick in the change is shut down too 

[DeeSpencer 25,723]

2 minutes ago, Colin B. Flaubert said:

It’s clear we need another tall.

JVR has the form. He’s been made to wait. He mightn’t set the world on fire, but he’ll add an new ingredient for sure.

I’d say Nibbler sadly is my out. He has a dip, but he’s bloody frustrating with ball in hand. We have enough bad decision makers.

We aren’t replacing our fitness player with a teenage tall. Just not going to happen 

[Lord Nev 13,512]

1 minute ago, DeeSpencer said:

There’s some of that, but plenty of his using it well and drawing runners. We also rarely kick or handball to him early or quickly. If we used him quickly it would encourage his next disposal to be quick too. So often he’s the last resort after inside options get shut down. Then the next kick in the change is shut down too 

Not sure I agree on this. We don't tell the other 21 players to adjust to suit Jordon's weakness.

I like him, but I'm just yet to be convinced he's up to the speed and pressure of finals footy on the wing.

[Demon Dynasty 17,109]

12 minutes ago, Bates Mate said:

I was on Jordons wing all night, we worked his guts out and one of our better players I thought. Actually was looking to attack most of the time

Meh he is too much 'slow play' for mine.  Rarely rolls out to get the ball moving and his decision making/execution around the arc and inside 50 left alot to be desired.

Got caught in two minds a fair bit which threw others out around him.  I would much prefer Harmes in for JJ and Chandler and Bedford in for ANB & Sparrow.

We need some run through the middle and away from stoppages.  Was noticeably lacking after half time tonight.

Also we saw our opponent miraculously manage to swing a pair of fresh legs on to the ground through the use of their sub.  Yet we refused to pull the trigger and instead played the nice guys again...and lost in the last quarter with the oppo over running us....again.

I called for this in the match day thread at 3/4 time so this isn't hindsight.  Poor stratagem from Goody & the FD IMV and not for the first time have we been outsmarted here.  Pretty poor stuff from those in charge.

Edited August 5, 2022 by Demon Dynasty

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

We aren’t replacing our fitness player with a teenage tall. Just not going to happen 

If you can run 17kms or more a game then I commend that.

But if you are constantly running into tackles, spraying handballs in tight and not being where you need to be in pack clearances, it makes you look like a blue heeler who has run onto a country footy oval and thinks that the ball bouncing around might be fun to have a chase after.

These types of blue heelers can run all day. If they catch the ball though, it’s basically just a good lark as they have no idea what to do with it.

Thats ANB’s problem now.

Edited August 5, 2022 by Colin B. Flaubert

[Older demon 2,741]

Forward line pressure was bad. Look at Pies manic tackling and pressure. We need another marking tall up forward and someone who can lay a take 5 players with no tackles.

bring in Smith or play Tomlinson as a defensive forward. Milk not the answer nor is Spargo. Again a marking forward on the opposition kills us 4 goals from 6 kicks. No good Petty 

[Abyssal 465]

32 minutes ago, titan_uranus said:

ANB 22 pressure acts, our third-most behind Oliver and Viney.

I reckon that's going to keep him in the side.

However, ANB, Pickett, Spargo and Sparrow combined for 0 tackles inside forward 50. Bearing in mind Fritsch and Brown also laid 0 tackles inside 50, that's not going to win us games of football.

Lever only played 85% TOG. Would not at all be surprised if he's carrying an injury.

Meanwhile just as Hibberd and Hunt both regress back into the form that made us all suspect neither was best 22 this year, we've flipped Joel Smith back yet again to a forward at Casey.

IMO , stats for “Pressure Acts” are very overrated , ie.

1.2 points for “Corralling”

All players must bring more to the table than just applying pressure.

Where would ANB sit on a League table for Fumbles and/ or being caught with the ball ?

[ElDiablo14 5,000]

We got nothing to lose by bringing JVR in.

At the very least he's an unknown player and opposition defenders won't pay too much attention to him. He could potentially feast on smaller defenders and open spaces, while the tall defenders worry only about BBB and Fritta.

Perhaps the same reason Bowey worked last year in our run to finals.

 

 

[dee-tox 4,835]

I think ANB has had enough chances this year. So much momentum is lost when he finally gets the ball after fumbling. My only concern is that Chandler and Bedford has has a few opportunities and never really grabbed them. I wonder if Laurie is the best option. Seems a good kick and sure ball handler.

[DeeSpencer 25,723]

7 minutes ago, Colin B. Flaubert said:

If you can run 17kms or more a game then I commend that.

But if you are constantly running into tackles, spraying handballs in tight and not being where you need to be in pack clearances, it makes you look like a blue heeler who has run onto a country footy oval and thinks that the ball bouncing around might be fun to have a chase after.

These types of blue heelers can run all day. If they catch the ball though, it’s basically just a good lark as they have no idea what to do with it.

Thats ANB’s problem now.

Sure. But if you replace ANB with JVR you’re effectively asking Melksham to go back to playing as a half forward flanker. You’ll get all the errors Nibbler makes, maybe 1 good kick a game and none of the defensive running. 

I can see a Melk and Nibbler out, JVR and Harmes in double change. But I don’t think things are that drastic. 

[DeeSpencer 25,723]

Just now, dee-tox said:

I think ANB has had enough chances this year. So much momentum is lost when he finally gets the ball after fumbling. My only concern is that Chandler and Bedford has has a few opportunities and never really grabbed them. I wonder if Laurie is the best option. Seems a good kick and sure ball handler.

Also can’t outrun his shadow. Punxsatawny Phil ain’t the answer