CHANGES: Rd 10 vs Adelaide

[Pates 9,660]

2 hours ago, DemonLad5 said:

Does anyone think there is any possibility that this week they try ALL 4 of Jacko, TMac, BBrown + Weid and then drop one of them for the Dogs clash?

Risky, also definitely weather dependent. It has to be a very dry track and we’d need to have a good hard think about the zones each operate in. Also if we were to do this Max has to move back to being the floating player behind the ball. 

Worst case we could push TMac into the wing position to try to open the space up. 

If Weid gets dropped I just don’t see how he has a future with us. 

[Demons11 6,916]

On 5/18/2021 at 7:26 AM, Dr.D said:

Putting Nibbler and Fritsch in the same sentence as Brayshaw is a little unfair. 

Brayshaw is an inside mid who has been forced out onto the wing where all of his positive attributes don't get utilised. Further to that, all of his flaws in his game (lack of leg speed, defensive pressure and foot skills) are getting exposed. They either have to find another spot for him or look to get a 2nd rounder for him and cut our losses. He needs to do it for himself. How does one go from 3rd in the brownlow to a fringe player.

He is playing his role for the team and doing it very well. We are 9-0 and he is doing what needs to be done to continue this run.  Who gives a s..t if he is not playing inside mid and getting 30 p’s a game.  

[dl4e 5,851]

Rest Gawn. I don't think he is 100% right.

[leave it to deever 17,511]

34 minutes ago, Pates said:

Risky, also definitely weather dependent. It has to be a very dry track and we’d need to have a good hard think about the zones each operate in. Also if we were to do this Max has to move back to being the floating player behind the ball. 

Worst case we could push TMac into the wing position to try to open the space up. 

If Weid gets dropped I just don’t see how he has a future with us. 

Surely after last game bbb goes before sw.

I cant see them playing all of them unless we lose another tall defender and Tmac goes back which Goody said wont happen.

He also said that Sams future is secure at the Mfc. Barring injuries Im not sure most of us can understand how it all pans out.

Tmac is one of thee best forwards going about at the minute but I must say the times he has dropped back in defence he has been just as good and reminded us how good he used to be in that role.

Just maybe given Tommy has lost weight and gained speed it might.... just might I say  be worth a trial with Tom on the wing.

At least then we can see of they all fit and work. Thats all. Just maybe.?

[Gawndy the Great 9,011]

32 minutes ago, dl4e said:

Rest Gawn. I don't think he is 100% right.

Not the worst idea. Not sure we match up well there though. If Walker comes in with Thilthorpe we will be short in defence. Something to think about for the selectors. 

[Lil_red_fire_engine 11,115]

Jackson is a better ground ball and pressure player than Melksham who Chandler replaced, Chandler had limited score, ball or pressure impact. I think we get too caught up on height and should be more about what they do. It would be ballsy but I am not against look at Chandler for Jackson and playing LJ as a high half forward, back up ruck and roll him through midfield. He is great below his knees, mobile and adds pressure. We would need to have an approach that keeps him high and the key talls deep to derisk multiple going up in contest  but I dont think its out of the question. 

The more likely assumption will be Weid but I reckon they will be keen to look at the TMac, Weid, Jackson, Fritsch dynamic at some point and would not discount a BBB omission. You would think Brown and Weid were on level par last week so hard to agree that Brown more deserving of the slot. 

[Macca 16,923]

On 5/18/2021 at 1:21 PM, DeeSpencer said:

Apart from 2 ridiculously bad kicks he played well. 

Except that Brayshaw's first 'perceived' error where the ball went out on the full deep in the forward pocket could best be described as a default professional free kick

He'd be under instruction to kick long to that pocket if all other options aren't available ... and if you watch carefully the wind grabbed hold of the ball at the tail end of its trajectory

Goodwin wouldn't have been unhappy about Carlton receiving a free kick in those circumstances as it's the worst spot on the ground to receive a free kick (the man on the mark is actually brought into play)

They (Carlton) either switch play (which is risky especially if we've designed a set play to counteract) or be forced to kick it down the line thus opening up the opportunity for us the regain possession of the ball

All part of a set play as I viewed it. Of course, I'm not saying that we want to deliberately kick the ball out of bounds deep in our forward pocket but if the ball does go out of bounds on the full in that area of the ground it's not necessarily a bad result

Oddly enough, the ball ended up back with Brayshaw a couple of times soon after that perceived error

Edited May 19, 2021 by Macca

[DeeSpencer 25,477]

1 hour ago, big_red_fire_engine said:

Jackson is a better ground ball and pressure player than Melksham who Chandler replaced, Chandler had limited score, ball or pressure impact. I think we get too caught up on height and should be more about what they do. It would be ballsy but I am not against look at Chandler for Jackson and playing LJ as a high half forward, back up ruck and roll him through midfield. He is great below his knees, mobile and adds pressure. We would need to have an approach that keeps him high and the key talls deep to derisk multiple going up in contest  but I dont think its out of the question. 

The more likely assumption will be Weid but I reckon they will be keen to look at the TMac, Weid, Jackson, Fritsch dynamic at some point and would not discount a BBB omission. You would think Brown and Weid were on level par last week so hard to agree that Brown more deserving of the slot. 

No thanks. If Jackson is the back up ruck that means we have 3 big forwards who aren't great defenders on the field at all times (Brown, Weid, T Mc, Fritsch).

That combination would almost be better if Weid back up rucked and Jackson spent time on the wing or on ball. Which seems very unlikely.

Possibly we could borrow one of the Eagles moves and rotate a key forward like they do Oscar Allen where he's suddenly filling in at half back but why mess with the back 7 that are settled.

[DeeSpencer 25,477]

17 minutes ago, Macca said:

Except that Brayshaw's first 'perceived' error where the ball went out on the full deep in the forward pocket could best be described as a default professional free kick

He'd be under instruction to kick long to that pocket if all other options aren't available ... and if you watch carefully the wind grabbed hold of the ball at the tail end of its trajectory

Goodwin wouldn't have been unhappy about Carlton receiving a free kick in those circumstances as it's the worst spot on the ground to receive a free kick (the man on the mark is actually brought into play)

They (Carlton) either switch play (which is risky especially if we've designed a set play to counteract) or be forced to kick it down the line thus opening up the opportunity for us the regain possession of the ball

All part of a set play as I viewed it. Of course, I'm not saying that we want to deliberately kick the ball out of bounds deep in our forward pocket but if the ball does go out of bounds on the full in that area of the ground it's not necessarily a bad result

Oddly enough, the ball ended up back with Brayshaw a couple of times soon after that perceived error

Not sure you need 'perceived' there Macca. Out on the full is out on the full. We usually target quite an inboard kick at CHF these days, but yes he could've been going more boundary. It's certainly far from the worst result but it's still an unforced error. There was a little bit of a breeze but the kicks were shanks. Maybe Gus is working on some technique changes and might come through the other side kicking much better, but so far it doesn't seem that way. Otherwise he's playing pretty well.

[Macca 16,923]

59 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

Not sure you need 'perceived' there Macca. Out on the full is out on the full. We usually target quite an inboard kick at CHF these days, but yes he could've been going more boundary. It's certainly far from the worst result but it's still an unforced error. There was a little bit of a breeze but the kicks were shanks. Maybe Gus is working on some technique changes and might come through the other side kicking much better, but so far it doesn't seem that way. Otherwise he's playing pretty well.

It wasn't a shank at all in my view ... if anything, he connected too well and the ball went quite a distance (and it tailed off after being caught by the breeze)

Kicking accurately deep into that pocket (under instruction) comes with a degree of difficulty attached

And as stated previously, we go to that long option to the pocket like all the teams do these days so when a ball does go out on the full from time to time in that area of the ground it's something a MC needs to wear

It's a bit like a top level soccer team handing the ball back to the opposition purposely so as to improve their own counter-attacking game

So I don't necessarily see it as an unforced error even though the stats guru's probably see it that way

By the way, deliberately handpassing the ball 1 metre to a teammate who you know is going to be tackled improves your DE percentage.  Go figure

Related ... Onballers often have to find a way to scrub the ball forward by hand or foot because of the pressure they are under ... thus, many have less that perfect DE ratings. 

So Oliver turned it over to the opposition 11 times on Sunday yet he received the maximum coaches votes

Edited May 19, 2021 by Macca

[Macca 16,923]

If Jackson comes back in (as expected) then the default MC move could easily be last man in is first man out

And I can't see us dropping Ben Brown so Weideman would probably make way unless we decide to go super-tall

If Weideman goes out he'll get more chances as the season progresses.  It's a long season, injuries occur as well as others needing a 'rest' from time to time

[Rob Mac...... 638]

Looking forward to Jacksons return. 
After rewatching last game I still thought Brayshaws' positioning and ball winning was very good, but unfortunately he largely backed his first two horrible kicks up with a day of putrid disposal by foot and hand. 

[defuture15 898]

Weid to share ruck with Max

Max to cover defence marking 

BBB outlet mark 

TMAC forward 

Fritsch 5 goals

[Macca 16,923]

42 minutes ago, Rob Mac...... said:

Looking forward to Jacksons return. 
After rewatching last game I still thought Brayshaws' positioning and ball winning was very good, but unfortunately he largely backed his first two horrible kicks up with a day of putrid disposal by foot and hand. 

His disposal was quite good after 1 early error (the spacial awareness turnover)

The other possessions where the ball didn't directly go to a teammate was when he was under pressure and in that situation he (like anyone else) needs to dispose of the ball ... or he gets pinged for holding it.

Winning a ball in congestion and then executing perfectly (every time) is the stuff of dreams.  Won't be happening

Oliver turned the ball over to the opposition 11 times ... 10 coaches votes yet he had more 'clangers' than anyone else

Edited May 19, 2021 by Macca

[Ted Lasso 19,311]

15 minutes ago, Rob Mac...... said:

Looking forward to Jacksons return. 
After rewatching last game I still thought Brayshaws' positioning and ball winning was very good, but unfortunately he largely backed his first two horrible kicks up with a day of putrid disposal by foot and hand. 

we're a bit spoilt by Christian Salem i think, must admit i haven't been concerned by Gus at all, he's playing an extremely selfless role for us, a lot of the play is directed through Langdon's wing, Gus is brilliant at getting to the right spots at the right time. obviously not the perfect footballer, but outside one stretch in 2018 i'd say this is the best patch of football i've seen him play. 

stoked to have Jacko back 

[Tarax Club 3,889]

Generally had the impression Angus was an OK kick of the football. He can  get decent penetration downfield and has kicked some handy goals from the fifty metre arc. He is not in the same class as Christian Salem or Jake Melksham when it comes to finesse though.

But he really is making a fist of his return to the wing this season. Judging his own on field performance on the Gus and Gawnie pod-telecast. He is justifiably chuffed as being a member of ‘The Wingers Club’ with Lingers.

As the team mantra  is publicly enunciated, individual’s sacrifice the opportunity of personal glory for ultimate team success. #10 personifies the team first credo and has established a solid niche running the boundary side in a workmanlike manner. His ability to “read” the play, coupled with his defensive efforts, have advantageously filled in what appeared at the commencement of the season a positional vacancy. 

With some Choco input and a little application, Angus may be add some John Beckwith bias to his near boundary kicking. But of course the umpires may still be the spoilers.

[Macca 16,923]

6 minutes ago, Tarax Club said:

Generally had the impression Angus was an OK kick of the football. He can  get decent penetration downfield and has kicked some handy goals from the fifty metre arc. He is not in the same class as Christian Salem or Jake Melksham when it comes to finesse though.

But he really is making a fist of his return to the wing this season. Judging his own on field performance on the Gus and Gawnie pod-telecast. He is justifiably chuffed as being a member of ‘The Wingers Club’ with Lingers.

As the team mantra  is publicly enunciated, individual’s sacrifice the opportunity of personal glory for ultimate team success. #10 personifies the team first credo and has established a solid niche running the boundary side in a workmanlike manner. His ability to “read” the play, coupled with his defensive efforts, have advantageously filled in what appeared at the commencement of the season a positional vacancy. 

With some Choco input and a little application, Angus may be add some John Beckwith bias to his near boundary kicking. But of course the umpires may still be the spoilers.

Up until we put Brayshaw out on the wing he would have played all his footy on the ball ... bit like Greg Williams, Terry Wallace or Greg Wells being told to play the wing position

Not as easy as it might seem for a bloke who would have played as a centreman in days gone by

I'd prefer to see him play in his natural position (do what you do, do well) but for team purposes, he needs to be played as a wingman

So suddenly the boundary line is constantly in his vision as opposed to the vast expanses of the corridor

I reckon he's playing quite well all things considered and he should be judged on his  overall output

[Rob Mac...... 638]

15 minutes ago, Macca said:

His disposal was quite good after 1 early error (the spacial awareness turnover)

The other possessions where the ball didn't directly go to a teammate was when he was under pressure and it that situation he (like anyone else) needs to dispose of the ball ... or he gets pinged for holding it.

Winning a ball in congestion and then executing perfectly (every time) is the stuff of dreams.  Won't be happening

Oliver turned the ball over to the opposition 11 times ... 10 coaches votes yet he had more 'clangers' than anyone else

Cheers Macca, I've always really liked your posts, just a bit more concerned about Gus's disposal than you atm. Not saying he should be dropped this week though. 

14 minutes ago, Patches O’houlihan said:

 

good post P O. 

 

14 minutes ago, Tarax Club said:

Generally had the impression Angus was an OK kick of the football. 

Another fine post all round. Yes, I always thought he was a v good kick. 
 

Hey gents, it's almost 6am over here, must get more sleep, so no offense if I don't reply again soon. 

Happy about all the wins. 

[Macca 16,923]

14 minutes ago, Rob Mac...... said:

Cheers Macca, I've always really liked your posts, just a bit more concerned about Gus's disposal than you atm. Not saying he should be dropped this week though

He's being scapegoated, whipping boy, whatever you want to call it.  Coming 3rd in the Brownlow has annoyed more than a few here

Since 2018 he has mostly been played on the wing.  Not his natural position as a footballer.  So a degree of leeway needs to be applied because the same sort of output won't be forthcoming

As it stands, he's making a good fist of it (again, all things considered)

But if people were being fair in their evaluations they'd be pointing out every one of the 11 times that Oliver turned it over to the opposition on Sunday

Brayshaw is not starring but he is doing his job admirably

Edited May 19, 2021 by Macca

[Ted Lasso 19,311]

1 minute ago, Macca said:

He's being scapegoated, whipping boy, whatever you want to call it.  Coming 3rd in the Brownlow has annoyed more than a few here

If people were being fair they'd be pointing out every one of the 11 times that Oliver turned it over to the opposition on Sunday

So where's that angst?

Are you concerned about Oliver's disposal? If not, why not?

I think there is also a little bit of ignorance to Gus's role this year unfortunately as well which doesn't help when assessing his performance 

[Macca 16,923]

36 minutes ago, Patches O’houlihan said:

I think there is also a little bit of ignorance to Gus's role this year unfortunately as well which doesn't help when assessing his performance 

Yes Patches ... we have an attacking side where Langdon, Hunt & 1 or 2 others run in tandem (and it's working) Speed, good skills & execution

And on the other side Brayshaw is often at the forefront of a defensive style with the opposition being continuously stifled

It's such a vital component of our game plan where we get to play the games on our terms.

Make no mistake though, the opposition are going to come at us with a will to breaking down our game plan.  The more that it is exposed, the harder it will be to maintain

Goodwin made mention of it yesterday ... along the lines of that as the game goes on, our game plan eventually wins out

Rinse & repeat but again, we can be broken down but we've got talent on our side where as the oppisition need to find a way to hunt us down. 

We should be relishing the prospect of being the hunted

Edited May 19, 2021 by Macca

[WERRIDEE 5,445]

Drop Chandler and bring in Jackson. Play tall baby. They want to see how Weid, McDonald and Weideman play together in the forward line no beeter chance to see this than against ordinary opposition in Adelaide. Play Jackson on the wing\ruck.

[Macca 16,923]

6 minutes ago, WERRIDEE said:

Drop Chandler and bring in Jackson. Play tall baby. They want to see how Weid, McDonald and Weideman play together in the forward line no beeter chance to see this than against ordinary opposition in Adelaide. Play Jackson on the wing\ruck.

Against a team like the Crows you could play tall but would you contemplate playing that tall against the Doggies or Lions?

If not, don't bother doing it against the Crows.  Wasting your own time & losing an opportunity to continue to practice what has worked so far

I'd be very surprised if another tall doesn't make way for LJ ... probably an unlucky Weideman

[BenJamin on Deesy St 805]

On 5/18/2021 at 7:26 AM, Dr.D said:

Brayshaw is an inside mid who has been forced out onto the wing where all of his positive attributes don't get utilised. Further to that, all of his flaws in his game (lack of leg speed, defensive pressure and foot skills) are getting exposed. They either have to find another spot for him or look to get a 2nd rounder for him and cut our losses. He needs to do it for himself. How does one go from 3rd in the brownlow to a fringe player.

Dr Drivel. Brayshaw forced out of the middle? A fringe player? Cut our losses and get a second rounder? For his sake? Ummm, no.

Time for you to move on from 2018 and embrace what is actually going on at the club. 

Brayshaw as a wingman is a critical component of our team, particularly with his defensive running and brave plugging of gaps (both on the ground and in the air). And he’s only going to get better in that position the longer he’s a member of the Ed Langdon Wing Club, learning from one of the best in the business and appearing to be loving it. He ain’t goin’ anywhere. One of the first picked in the side at the moment (along with our 8 or 9 All Australians!).

[dee-tox 4,835]

9 hours ago, Winter Dan said:

I'd keep the talls as is for one more week to see if either Weid or BBB can distinguish themselves from the other. 

Jacko back in the following wk. 

This week is just as important as the following week. Four points is four points

Common sense says that one of the talls has to go. Who it is I have no idea!