TEAMS: Rd 08 vs Brisbane

[Mel Bourne 4,537]

On 7/23/2020 at 6:40 PM, No Plan B said:

I don't understand how Lockhart seems to be an automatic selection. He doesn't get involved much and has given away goals every week with his mistakes. Am I missing something here? Give me Jetta any day.

I hope you’re not including the goal where he should’ve been awarded a HTB free for his tackle in the goal square. 

[Deemania since 56 6,763]

19 hours ago, D4Life said:

Jones skills, loyalty and many years of leading the way, deserves an opportunity.
 

Hopefully we will see him chase opposition players, as his running has been poor the last few years, admittedly injury would have impacted him at times. Critical that all of our team commit to running and pressuring the Lions, as happened last week against the Hawks.

Jonesy is gonna kick a surprising 4 goals and assist with another 3 (Kozzie and the Weed). Hannan will get his three and the Melk will feed two or three more to others - most probably Fritta. Tracc, well ... he's going to rip Brisbane apart whilst landing a best-effort 5 goals - don't say it ain't going to happen, just sit back and watch it happen. Ours, this game, by a healthy margin.

 

[binman 44,533]

1 hour ago, Mental Demons said:

I hope picking Jackson ahead of TMac on a wet track does not hurt us. 

Good chance it won't be wet as i reckon the rain might well have cleared by game time.

Forecast for gold coast is for only 0-6 mm rainfall and showers most likely in the morning and afternoon, with a chance of a thunderstorm.

Could be perfect just about because with a 6pm start and cloud about it won't be dewy.

[Adam The God 30,614]

Loving the Lockhart commentary in this thread everyone. Very enlightening. His development isn't that dissimilar from Nev's. Started up forward, but then moved back. Didn't get a heap of it, but was solid.

Thought he struggled with the tempo against Richmond (or was it Geelong?), but since then he hasn't seemed to have coughed the ball up. Seems like a good coaching move to me. 

Edited July 25, 2020 by A F

[JTR 2,884]

"The Ds particularly the players criticised responded with a solid win against the Suns. Changes were made to the structure by bringing in McDonald (the younger) and Weideman, pace was introduced with Jetta and Bennell; and VandenBerg got through a second game"

 

This is not the first time I've seen an opposition supporter say this. Are the confusing Nev with Lewis?

[D4Life 2,579]

26 minutes ago, Deemania since 56 said:

Jonesy is gonna kick a surprising 4 goals and assist with another 3 (Kozzie and the Weed). Hannan will get his three and the Melk will feed two or three more to others - most probably Fritta. Tracc, well ... he's going to rip Brisbane apart whilst landing a best-effort 5 goals - don't say it ain't going to happen, just sit back and watch it happen. Ours, this game, by a healthy margin.

 

I’m a half glass full person, but I hope you’re right, and your glass is overflowing on Sunday afternoon!

[deelusions from afar 1,870]

3 hours ago, JTR said:

"The Ds particularly the players criticised responded with a solid win against the Suns. Changes were made to the structure by bringing in McDonald (the younger) and Weideman, pace was introduced with Jetta and Bennell; and VandenBerg got through a second game"

 

This is not the first time I've seen an opposition supporter say this. Are the confusing Nev with Lewis?

I think a lot of people just assume that small forwards / small defenders especially if they are indigenous are quick.  Probably most of the time it is correct but in Nev's case it is his reading of the play, strength esp at his size, his ability to win one on ones and tidy (although usually conservative) disposal that has made him such a great defender

[grazman 7,512]

4 hours ago, A F said:

Loving the Lockhart commentary in this thread everyone. Very enlightening. His development isn't that dissimilar from Nev's. Started up forward, but then moved back. Didn't get a heap of it, but was solid.

Happy to stand corrected, but I think Jay may have been recruited as a half-back flanker though, whereas Nev was pretty much a forward when he was drafted.

[Demon trucker 1,800]

10 hours ago, Cheesy D. Pun said:

Nothing wrong with his positional play - he suits the wing position.

His effort against Richmond was awful - he quite simply didn't commit his body to the contest.

Blaming it on position is letting him off the hook. 

He was in and out of the GWS side and I suspect things will be no different with us. He needs to provide consistent effort.

Well that's worse then playing in the wrong position, paying big money on a fringe player.

[Mental Demons 136]

18 hours ago, binman said:

Forecast for gold coast is for only 0-6 mm rainfall and showers most likely in the morning and afternoon, with a chance of a thunderstorm.

It has been raining for the last day or two. It will be a very wet track. I think Jackson was the wrong choice over TMac. We know TMac can take a mark and kick a goal. He is also more mobile and can play back, forward or in the ruck. We don't need two specialist rucks on a wet ground. I Have changed my tip and think the lions will win now. 

[dazzledavey36 55,892]

1 minute ago, Mental Demons said:

It has been raining for the last day or two. It will be a very wet track. I think Jackson was the wrong choice over TMac. We know TMac can take a mark and kick a goal. He is also more mobile and can play back, forward or in the ruck. We don't need two specialist rucks on a wet ground. I Have changed my tip and think the lions will win now. 

No way is Tmac more mobile. You must be watching the wrong person.

Tmac has a worse turning circle of Chris Dawes. Jackson is far more mobile and agile around the ground.

[Mental Demons 136]

1 minute ago, dazzledavey36 said:

No way is Tmac more mobile. You must be watching the wrong person.

Tmac has a worse turning circle of Chris Dawes. Jackson is far more mobile and agile around the ground.

A wet track is a big equaliser. Agility is not as much of a factor. I am sure Tmac would beat Jackson in a sprint and with endurance. On a wet ground Jackson will reduce our mobility and I think that is a bigger issue. The Lions have run to burn. Jackson is yet to kick a goal from a mark. The more Jackson has to run the slower he gets, more so in the wet. Jackson won't be more agile if he can't get to contests.

[Lil_red_fire_engine 11,299]

11 minutes ago, Mental Demons said:

It has been raining for the last day or two. It will be a very wet track. I think Jackson was the wrong choice over TMac. We know TMac can take a mark and kick a goal. He is also more mobile and can play back, forward or in the ruck. We don't need two specialist rucks on a wet ground. I Have changed my tip and think the lions will win now. 

Tmac has struggled to take a mark in the dry this year granted it looked like he may have just been turning the form corner before his injury. Other than body strength, LJ has it over him in mobility and most importantly if wet, ground ball ability and defensive pressure when the ball hits the ground. He will also provide a better ruck inside 50 and as a chop out for Max.   

[Mental Demons 136]

7 minutes ago, big_red_fire_engine said:

He will also provide a better ruck inside 50 and as a chop out for Max. 

We don't need 2 rucks, the Lions are going in with one part time ruck. Jackson is quick for a big guy, he is not quick and there is questions over his endurance. Jackson has only proved he is a ruck. TMac has taken a mark and kicked a goal this year, Jackson is yet to do that. I doubt Jackson will be quick enough to get a tackle today. In few hours we will know. Win or lose Jackson will not be a factor. Tmac has better form at being a game breaker.

[dazzledavey36 55,892]

52 minutes ago, Mental Demons said:

A wet track is a big equaliser. Agility is not as much of a factor. I am sure Tmac would beat Jackson in a sprint and with endurance. On a wet ground Jackson will reduce our mobility and I think that is a bigger issue. The Lions have run to burn. Jackson is yet to kick a goal from a mark. The more Jackson has to run the slower he gets, more so in the wet. Jackson won't be more agile if he can't get to contests.

You're really overrating Tmac here. He is quite slow and terrible when it comes agility and speed. Yes he has big insurance, cool. But when it comes to mobility and speed, Jackson has him covered easily. This is a big reason why the club think he can potentially become a midfielder because of how agile he is for a big bloke, and the way he moves around the ground and getting to contest like an extra midfielder.

He was averaging 25 plus disposals as a ruckman in the 2nd half of his colts year last year. That to me shows he is more then capable of having a huge impact around the ground.

Tmac has been hopeless this year. Jackson had more of an impact last week then Tmac has all year. In fact if anything he needs to lose a bit of weight as he is far too top heavy and this has slowed him down significantly this year.

[dazzledavey36 55,892]

37 minutes ago, Mental Demons said:

We don't need 2 rucks, the Lions are going in with one part time ruck. Jackson is quick for a big guy, he is not quick and there is questions over his endurance. Jackson has only proved he is a ruck. TMac has taken a mark and kicked a goal this year, Jackson is yet to do that. I doubt Jackson will be quick enough to get a tackle today. In few hours we will know. Win or lose Jackson will not be a factor. Tmac has better form at being a game breaker.

No, they are going in with 2 rucks MD.

Archie Smith at NEAFL is their genuine number 1 ruckman. He'll come in today and shoulder either start as a ruck or up forward. Same as Oscar Mcinninerny who I personally think will shoulder majority of the ruck role today.

 

[Mental Demons 136]

42 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

You're really overrating Tmac

TMac has form and experience. I can't pick out one Lions player who we could expect Jackson to beat or a position he could win. I don't think we will win today because we can't afford to wait and see if Jackson can play in the wet. TMac has played good wet weather football. If we are picking players on their colt form we will lose. I am happy to wait and see but I think the Lions will win today.

Edited July 26, 2020 by Mental Demons

[dazzledavey36 55,892]

3 minutes ago, Mental Demons said:

TMac has form and experience. I can't pick out one Lions player who we could expect Jackson to beat or a position he could win. I don't think we will win today because we can'r afford to wait and see if Jackson can play in the wet. TMac has played good wet weather football. If we are picking players on their colt form we will lose. I am happy to wait and see but I think the Lions will win today.

When??

[Mental Demons 136]

7 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

When??

When has TMac failed in the wet? When has Jackson dominated an AFL game on a wet or dry ground? I get you are a Jackson fan but he is a project player and does not offer much at the moment. 

[dazzledavey36 55,892]

12 minutes ago, Mental Demons said:

When has TMac failed in the wet? When has Jackson dominated an AFL game on a wet or dry ground? I get you are a Jackson fan but he is a project player and does not offer much at the moment. 

Didn't answer the question MD.....

[Mental Demons 136]

Just now, dazzledavey36 said:

Didn't answer the question MD.....

Nor did you. 

[Lil_red_fire_engine 11,299]

12 minutes ago, Mental Demons said:

When has TMac failed in the wet? When has Jackson dominated an AFL game on a wet or dry ground? I get you are a Jackson fan but he is a project player and does not offer much at the moment. 

Tmacs exposed form is better than LJ’s. The problem here is that form is over a year ago. LJ had more impact on our ability to score last week than Tmac has shown at any point this year. It doesn’t matter who marks and who goals its about how the forward line operates, It operated very well last week and it operated in a way that should also work if its a touch wet.. 

[dazzledavey36 55,892]

3 minutes ago, Mental Demons said:

Nor did you. 

You made the statement first with no evidence to back it up. So you made it up to suit your narrative.

In fairness Mental, I still have great faith in Tmac and do feel that hopefully we'll see his best again. But on form, he's been poor this year. 

Anyway, I'll leave it at that.

Go Dees.

Edited July 26, 2020 by dazzledavey36

[binman 44,533]

2 hours ago, Mental Demons said:

It has been raining for the last day or two. It will be a very wet track. I think Jackson was the wrong choice over TMac. We know TMac can take a mark and kick a goal. He is also more mobile and can play back, forward or in the ruck. We don't need two specialist rucks on a wet ground. I Have changed my tip and think the lions will win now. 

The has been a huge amount of rain up there but only 0 - 6mm is predicted today.

AFL grounds these days all drain super well as it is turf on a base of sand (or sand and concrete at docklands!). So if it stops raining an hour or so before the game it might be a little wet and maybe a touch choppy, but it will be fine.

Yesterday's blues- roos game was at metricon and it had bucketed down all day Friday and more rain sat morning. But before the rain came in the second half, conditions looked perfect.

All that aside, how did you arrive at the conclusion tmac is more mobile than jackson? Or for that matter marks and kicks goals?

To say tmac is lumbering would actually be a compliment. This year, Tmc has been slower than the ponies I usually back. To stretch the racing analogy tmac is a dour steeple chaser and Jackson's a two year old colt lining up in the Golden Slipper.

And Tmac has barely taken a mark or kicked a goal this season. 

So wet weather would make him slower and mean his struggles marking a dry ball and kicking goals would be exacerbated.

And to top it off he is nowhere near as good a ruck man as Jackson so Goody chose him ahead of Jackson he would have less tactical option in terms of how he can use Maxy  .

No doubt, in my mind at least, Goody pulled the right rein.
 

[Macca 17,113]

The MC effectively made it very difficult for T-Mac by playing him as the only tall in rounds 2 & 3.  Double-teamed etc and then he got an injured eye.

And a lot of key forwards have struggled to impact this season.  But they are still needed for structure.  2 KPF's but 3 is a stretch

Jackson got his chance and deserves another crack at it.  However, Tom could come in against Port as Jackson needs to be managed properly.

Rotate them around will win out (out of necessity)  Not every player will be able to back-up with the condensed fixture.

Our 'immediate' depth will be tested as it will be for all the teams. 

The other thing to consider is that Gawn also needs to be managed properly.  And Jackson goes alright in the ruck.