Demons Grand Plan for Yarra Park Training HQ

[george_on_the_outer 7,565]

On 11/22/2018 at 1:29 PM, McQueen said:

So, is the issue that AAMI park is too congested with the other codes teams also utilising the facilities?

Why are we the only club looking to vacate? Why can’t the other codes look to relocate?

Then we just pay extra for the increased amount of administrative buildings we use.

 

This is probably one of the answers that avoids all of the other problems of trying to put an admin/training/club building on postage sized pieces of ground in and around the MCG/Gosch's or over roads/rail/tram lines at extraordinary expense.

IF Melbourne Victory, or Rebels/Storm were to vacate to bigger and new facilities themselves, then one of the two training fields that are currently permanently set up for Rugby or Soccer is free.  Voila!..... room to build something right in Gosch's, alongside Olympic Boulevard without massive cost, tree removal or locals getting their knickers in a knot.

So where could they be convinced to go?  There is space down alongside Docklands-Marvel that we were rumoured to be interested in some time ago.  Would be more enticing to certainly the Soccer crowd, especially with games played regularly at that location.

[Mickey 4,647]

39 minutes ago, george_on_the_outer said:

This is probably one of the answers that avoids all of the other problems of trying to put an admin/training/club building on postage sized pieces of ground in and around the MCG/Gosch's or over roads/rail/tram lines at extraordinary expense.

IF Melbourne Victory, or Rebels/Storm were to vacate to bigger and new facilities themselves, then one of the two training fields that are currently permanently set up for Rugby or Soccer is free.  Voila!..... room to build something right in Gosch's, alongside Olympic Boulevard without massive cost, tree removal or locals getting their knickers in a knot.

So where could they be convinced to go?  There is space down alongside Docklands-Marvel that we were rumoured to be interested in some time ago.  Would be more enticing to certainly the Soccer crowd, especially with games played regularly at that location.

I guess the reason they aren't leaving is because AAMI Park is their home ground. They have exactly what we want, not sure they will give it up so we can stay close to our ground.

[DV8 2,271]

2 hours ago, george_on_the_outer said:

This is probably one of the answers that avoids all of the other problems of trying to put an admin/training/club building on postage sized pieces of ground in and around the MCG/Gosch's or over roads/rail/tram lines at extraordinary expense.

IF Melbourne Victory, or Rebels/Storm were to vacate to bigger and new facilities themselves, then one of the two training fields that are currently permanently set up for Rugby or Soccer is free.  Voila!..... room to build something right in Gosch's, alongside Olympic Boulevard without massive cost, tree removal or locals getting their knickers in a knot.

So where could they be convinced to go?  There is space down alongside Docklands-Marvel that we were rumoured to be interested in some time ago.  Would be more enticing to certainly the Soccer crowd, especially with games played regularly at that location.

Why would rugby or soccer move out of AAM stadium, the stadium was built as a rectangular stadium for a reason to house state Rugby League, Union... and Soccer.

It is purpose built for them.

 

We are the odd bods in that stadium.

[george_on_the_outer 7,565]

17 hours ago, DV8 said:

Why would rugby or soccer move out of AAM stadium, the stadium was built as a rectangular stadium for a reason to house state Rugby League, Union... and Soccer.

It is purpose built for them.

 

We are the odd bods in that stadium.

We would not be trying to move them out of the stadium, it is their occupation of the training areas in Gosch's paddock which restricts what is possible.  They don't train inside.  In the same way we don't train on the MCG. 

So like us, they have piecemeal training and administration facilities.  IF...IF something better was offered to the other tenants, it would mean WE could develop ours in proximity. 

OR we have to move somewhere else which can accomodate an oval, which means we will not be in proximity to the MCG.

[Diamond_Jim 12,527]

1 hour ago, george_on_the_outer said:

OR we have to move somewhere else which can accomodate an oval, which means we will not be in proximity to the MCG.

I think that is the only solution.

Having a look at the Essendon facility it is seriously good and they were prepared to move to get it.

"The project involved the development of a Greenfield 10 hectare site with the construction of two full sized AFL ovals and elite training facilities for the club. EFC also relocated all administrative and football department functions to the new state of the art facility.

The training facility also includes all player treatment areas and a 4 lane 25 metre pool.  The new facilities were programmed to be available for the start of the 2013 football season."

http://www.kersulting.com.au/project/essendon-football-club-training-facility-tullamarine/

If we cannot get a decent answer to the issue this year I am resolved to developing Casey. It is a designated high performance sport precinct. Sure it's not CBD etc but with the freeway the access is not too bad from the southern suburbs.

Whatever happens we need to do something if we are not to be left behind in the arms war that is high tech sport.

Edited November 26, 2018 by Diamond_Jim

[deebug 1,754]

Not only ess, but the tigers are also planning to relocate somewhere else as well.

Hope we have a plan B?

[old dee 23,770]

9 minutes ago, Diamond_Jim said:

I think that is the only solution.

Having a look at the Essendon facility it is seriously good and they were prepared to move to get it.

"The project involved the development of a Greenfield 10 hectare site with the construction of two full sized AFL ovals and elite training facilities for the club. EFC also relocated all administrative and football department functions to the new state of the art facility.

The training facility also includes all player treatment areas and a 4 lane 25 metre pool.  The new facilities were programmed to be available for the start of the 2013 football season."

http://www.kersulting.com.au/project/essendon-football-club-training-facility-tullamarine/

If we cannot get a decent answer to the issue this year I am resolved to developing Casey. It is a designated high performance sport precinct. Sure it's not CBD etc but with the freeway the access is not too bad from the southern suburbs.

Whatever happens we need to do something if we are not to be left behind in the arms war that is high tech sport.

You have my vote DJ. The large problem as I understand it is that very few of the playing and admin group want to go there. In fact I have heard a number of the admin would leave rather than go there and players don't want to live anywhere near there. So that puts a big negative on Casey. Not sure it would fly with "establishment" members either.

Seems to me the options are Yarra park ( cannot see it happening ) 

Docklands ( probably not this decade )

The outer surburbs.

Docklands is probably the most likely so what is the ten year stop gap? More of what we have now?

 

[old dee 23,770]

7 minutes ago, deebug said:

Not only ess, but the tigers are also planning to relocate somewhere else as well.

Hope we have a plan B?

Takeover Richmond!

[Diamond_Jim 12,527]

9 minutes ago, old dee said:

You have my vote DJ. The large problem as I understand it is that very few of the playing and admin group want to go there. In fact I have heard a number of the admin would leave rather than go there and players don't want to live anywhere near there. So that puts a big negative on Casey. Not sure it would fly with "establishment" members either.

Seems to me the options are Yarra park ( cannot see it happening ) 

Docklands ( probably not this decade )

The outer surburbs.

Docklands is probably the most likely so what is the ten year stop gap? More of what we have now?

 

Worked most of my life in the big high rises of the CBD and then spent the last ten working in Dandenong.

You get used to it.

Driving against the traffic was usually very good. As to the admin there's a lot of people living in the Cranbourne catchment area if you are looking for employees. (Just google Berwick... enormous area that has now been there over ten years for example.)

Gosch's paddock and the inner city will almost involve compromises. The land at Docklands is not cheap and every time I go to visit anybody down that way the wind is blowing a gale.

Philosophically I can see benefits of the admin being located near the player facility but it is not a must have.

I would however like to see a strong shopfront presence by the MFC in the MCG environs. By shopfront I don't just mean a merchandising outlet but a building with naming rights that could display a prominent neon sign or the like.

Of course if you want Government money to help it along the outer suburbs including the likes of Point Cook are probably where you have to go.

As an aside there is big voter backlash in NSW against the government funding for the upgrading of the Olympic Stadium.

[old dee 23,770]

44 minutes ago, Diamond_Jim said:

Worked most of my life in the big high rises of the CBD and then spent the last ten working in Dandenong.

You get used to it.

Driving against the traffic was usually very good. As to the admin there's a lot of people living in the Cranbourne catchment area if you are looking for employees. (Just google Berwick... enormous area that has now been there over ten years for example.)

Gosch's paddock and the inner city will almost involve compromises. The land at Docklands is not cheap and every time I go to visit anybody down that way the wind is blowing a gale.

Philosophically I can see benefits of the admin being located near the player facility but it is not a must have.

I would however like to see a strong shopfront presence by the MFC in the MCG environs. By shopfront I don't just mean a merchandising outlet but a building with naming rights that could display a prominent neon sign or the like.

Of course if you want Government money to help it along the outer suburbs including the likes of Point Cook are probably where you have to go.

As an aside there is big voter backlash in NSW against the government funding for the upgrading of the Olympic Stadium.

All that has merit dj. It just shows how big the problem is for us to find a home that suits.

ps. I worked in Dandy south for 15 years and lived in the north west. So I know the journey. Fairly confident the molly coddlied players would not like it one bit. 

Edited November 26, 2018 by old dee

[DV8 2,271]

4 hours ago, george_on_the_outer said:

We would not be trying to move them out of the stadium, it is their occupation of the training areas in Gosch's paddock which restricts what is possible.  They don't train inside.  In the same way we don't train on the MCG. 

So like us, they have piecemeal training and administration facilities.  IF...IF something better was offered to the other tenants, it would mean WE could develop ours in proximity. 

OR we have to move somewhere else which can accomodate an oval, which means we will not be in proximity to the MCG.

Sorry, I thought you were talking about AAMI stadium, the building.  I didn't realise you wee talking about Gosch's.

That's easy, we just get the show at Gosch's realigned, so we can abutt our new home building. 

 

"It's just a jump to the left" for that rectangular training pitch. 

 

I'll take my line-marker & tape down there after midnight tomorrow, and get things started. ?

 

Edited November 26, 2018 by DV8

[deebug 1,754]

6 hours ago, old dee said:

Takeover Richmond!

I was thinking the same thing, only problem it's becoming to small with the both the mens and womens teams.

Wish we could find some prime land to build something the same as ess have? Or we are going to get left behind again.

I think it was Travis Johnston who said we the team was at the Junction oval, that if we had, the money the pies had and all the best that money bought back then we would have one four flags.

[deebug 1,754]

We could convince the tennis to move to Docklands, and we take over that space?

[CBDees 3,167]

As an aside, I spoke with Mick Malthouse today (who lives directly opposite our proposed Yarra Park facility)! He is dead against it! (NIMBY?)

[Guest]

12 minutes ago, CBDees said:

As an aside, I spoke with Mick Malthouse today (who lives directly opposite our proposed Yarra Park facility)! He is dead against it! (NIMBY?)

He fits the mould. Old, contrary for the sake of it and cantankerous.

[deebug 1,754]

31 minutes ago, CBDees said:

As an aside, I spoke with Mick Malthouse today (who lives directly opposite our proposed Yarra Park facility)! He is dead against it! (NIMBY?)

Did you ask him why, he didn't like the idea?

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,687]

32 minutes ago, CBDees said:

As an aside, I spoke with Mick Malthouse today (who lives directly opposite our proposed Yarra Park facility)! He is dead against it! (NIMBY?)

There's the proof that our plan is the optimal solution. 

[deebug 1,754]

Why should these nut jobs get a say in what we want to do? It's not like we are saying to give up their houses for goodness sake. 

Can we get this done or is time to look elsewhere? Does anybody have any new news?

[Moonshadow 17,675]

45 minutes ago, CBDees said:

As an aside, I spoke with Mick Malthouse today (who lives directly opposite our proposed Yarra Park facility)! He is dead against it! (NIMBY?)

Of course he is, bitter old man.

[Cards13 9,117]

1 hour ago, CBDees said:

As an aside, I spoke with Mick Malthouse today (who lives directly opposite our proposed Yarra Park facility)! He is dead against it! (NIMBY?)

Haha tell him to GFH. He was a coach not an administrator, 2 totally different fields of expertise. 

[Its Time for Another 4,187]

On 11/26/2018 at 8:50 PM, CBDees said:

As an aside, I spoke with Mick Malthouse today (who lives directly opposite our proposed Yarra Park facility)! He is dead against it! (NIMBY?)

If he's directly opposite it will take away his view into the Park. I'd be dead against it if I was him as well. His building would be the only group of people who will be effected by it. 

On a much more interesting note. The Club's accounts show that they spent $227,000 on this project in the past year. That's serious money. Love to know what it was spent on. 

[Redleg 40,815]

8 minutes ago, It's Time said:

If he's directly opposite it will take away his view into the Park. I'd be dead against it if I was him as well. His building would be the only group of people who will be effected by it. 

On a much more interesting note. The Club's accounts show that they spent $227,000 on this project in the past year. That's serious money. Love to know what it was spent on. 

Bribes.

Seriously,  it would be architects and planning consultants.

Edited November 27, 2018 by Redleg

[Diamond_Jim 12,527]

2 minutes ago, It's Time said:

If he's directly opposite it will take away his view into the Park. I'd be dead against it if I was him as well. His building would be the only group of people who will be effected by it. 

On a much more interesting note. The Club's accounts show that they spent $227,000 on this project in the past year. That's serious money. Love to know what it was spent on. 

I think in all of this we are missing overall costs.

Would love to know the cost of the Bomber's development.

I suspect we are effectively asking for the land for free and we pick up the development costs.

As an aside the new Perth stadium has the highest cost per seat (a measure of stadium costs) in the world.

$227k on a feasibility study is small these days and I suspect it would also include lobbying and preliminary submissions etc. I have no personal knowledge but I suspect that even when you mention something being built over a rail line the planning costs soars.

(Have a look at what the NBN is charging for individual connections if you want FTTP as against their standard offering.)

[Its Time for Another 4,187]

8 minutes ago, Diamond_Jim said:

I think in all of this we are missing overall costs.

Would love to know the cost of the Bomber's development.

I suspect we are effectively asking for the land for free and we pick up the development costs.

As an aside the new Perth stadium has the highest cost per seat (a measure of stadium costs) in the world.

$227k on a feasibility study is small these days and I suspect it would also include lobbying and preliminary submissions etc. I have no personal knowledge but I suspect that even when you mention something being built over a rail line the planning costs soars.

(Have a look at what the NBN is charging for individual connections if you want FTTP as against their standard offering.)

Would love to know if it's all been spent just on the Yarra Park idea. I've heard opinions from various people who work in the planning area that it is very unlikely to get up. That's a hell of a lot of money to spend on a very speculative proposal. All political parties have come out opposing it. 

What worries me about this site is that we might be throwing everything in for the location not necessarily the long term suitability. I mean, I'm sure they are thinking about it but if we ended up with a facility like Richmond's at Punt Rd that would be an incredible result. Obviously without the Grandstands. But Richmond spent a fortune doing that up just 5 or 6 years ago and they have grown out of it already and are looking for something else, possibly in addition to rather than replacing it all together. So if that's too small for them why is ours going to be big enough for us. Look at what Essendon have built and Hawthorn are about to build. They are massive facilities with 2 to 4 grounds to train on including indoor facilities. We will have a piece of parkland fully open to the public that we will have restricted access to part of the time as the public will have access to it as well.

Edited November 27, 2018 by It's Time

[old dee 23,770]

35 minutes ago, It's Time said:

Would love to know if it's all been spent just on the Yarra Park idea. I've heard opinions from various people who work in the planning area that it is very unlikely to get up. That's a hell of a lot of money to spend on a very speculative proposal. All political parties have come out opposing it. 

What worries me about this site is that we might be throwing everything in for the location not necessarily the long term suitability. I mean, I'm sure they are thinking about it but if we ended up with a facility like Richmond's at Punt Rd that would be an incredible result. Obviously without the Grandstands. But Richmond spent a fortune doing that up just 5 or 6 years ago and they have grown out of it already and are looking for something else, possibly in addition to rather than replacing it all together. So if that's too small for them why is ours going to be big enough for us. Look at what Essendon have built and Hawthorn are about to build. They are massive facilities with 2 to 4 grounds to train on including indoor facilities. We will have a piece of parkland fully open to the public that we will have restricted access to part of the time as the public will have access to it as well.

If that is correct why are we even considering Yarra Park.

It would appear the MFC have a totally different idea of what is required for an AFL team than Essendon and Hawthorn.