Wanted: The Hail Mary Kick-in with 1 minute to go

[TGR 1,367]

Each club, no doubt, has the hail mary kick-in, that is HIGH RISK, that is put into play when a team needs to score a goal or 2 with a minute or 2 to play.  This play might be a guts-or-nuts torp or a play-on-with-block to get around the man-on-the-mark.

What I saw with 1 minute to go yesterday was pure amateur-hour.  Jordan Lewis was never going to play on.  Jordan Lewis was never going to torp it.  Sydney could put their house on his kick landing no more than 55/60 (including goal square) from their goal.  They cram this area in the guts, and we kick a short and ultimately go wide.

The game was over when he had the ball in his hands with 1 minute to go.  We were never going to threaten.  The most amateur play from a personnel/structure viewpoint I have seen at AFL level for a long time.  Unforgivable at this level.

Real leadership and brains +/- planning would have dictated that the guy kicking out could either risk playing-on for overlap and territory OR could have torped it to potentially 70 (including goal square) from their goal.

[jackaub 1,402]

Maybe we need the Hail Mary Game Plan and not just the last kick>

[spirit of norm smith 16,478]

Sydney was 7 points up  , 19 minute mark, 6 minutes to play, 2 men down, had 1 point scored in the quarter, we had all the momentum after 3 goals and...

nul nil nudda nothing

swans controlled the game 

played heeney as a loose man

goodwin 1- work out how to overcome this or lose the close ones 2- work out how to do it or lose the close ones

[Dee Zephyr 19,267]

4 minutes ago, spirit of norm smith said:

played heeney as a loose man

I’ll harp on this until I turn blue in the face. All of us behind the goals in the last have lost our voice at trying to get someone, anyone to go near him. At worst, by putting a body on him Heeney is moved from the square and not roasting marshmallows.  

[Eelesie 217]

No point having a hail mary kick-in when you play in a team that cannot take a contested mark...

[Go the Biff 3,435]

Real leadership and brains would have addressed the lack of two way running allowing the Swans to waltz the ball up the ground with chip kicks & uncontested marks. Or would maybe have pushed AVB back to the square so Allir stopped ripping us across half back. Or realising Heeney was their mop up man in the last quarter & manning him up. And so on and so on..........

Usually like your contributions Rono but this is just a pizz poor opportunistic slap at Lewis.

 But you go ahead and worry about the last minute of the game. I'm far more concerned by what happened in the 99 minutes prior

[Jumping Jack Clennett 1,799]

3 hours ago, TGR said:

Each club, no doubt, has the hail mary kick-in, that is HIGH RISK, that is put into play when a team needs to score a goal or 2 with a minute or 2 to play.  This play might be a guts-or-nuts torp or a play-on-with-block to get around the man-on-the-mark.

What I saw with 1 minute to go yesterday was pure amateur-hour.  Jordan Lewis was never going to play on.  Jordan Lewis was never going to torp it.  Sydney could put their house on his kick landing no more than 55/60 (including goal square) from their goal.  They cram this area in the guts, and we kick a short and ultimately go wide.

The game was over when he had the ball in his hands with 1 minute to go.  We were never going to threaten.  The most amateur play from a personnel/structure viewpoint I have seen at AFL level for a long time.  Unforgivable at this level.

Real leadership and brains +/- planning would have dictated that the guy kicking out could either risk playing-on for overlap and territory OR could have torped it to potentially 70 (including goal square) from their goal.

Spot on,TGR.

My mind went back to the Geelong game last minutes when Henderson sent it 60 m straight up the middle.

I’ll never  forget the last half minute of the ‘87 prelim. After our last behind, they torped it right up the centre, and ended up with Buckanara’s goal.

But perhaps we should follow “Go the Biff’s” advice, when we’re a goal down with a minute to play. Don’t try and get it down the other end, just lament the way you’ve been playing all day!

[SFebes 4,884]

3 hours ago, spirit of norm smith said:

Sydney was 7 points up  , 19 minute mark, 6 minutes to play, 2 men down, had 1 point scored in the quarter, we had all the momentum after 3 goals and...

nul nil nudda nothing

swans controlled the game 

played heeney as a loose man

goodwin 1- work out how to overcome this or lose the close ones 2- work out how to do it or lose the close ones

 

2 hours ago, Dee Zephyr said:

I’ll harp on this until I turn blue in the face. All of us behind the goals in the last have lost our voice at trying to get someone, anyone to go near him. At worst, by putting a body on him Heeney is moved from the square and not roasting marshmallows.  

If the opposition analysis coach had done his homework, he would have picked up that Heeney going back as a loose man is quite common for Sydney. How we left him alone for so long is actually a joke. Once again Goody outcoached and slow to react.

Edited August 13, 2018 by MSFebey

[rjay 24,997]

3 hours ago, TGR said:

Real leadership and brains +/- planning would have dictated that the guy kicking out could either risk playing-on for overlap and territory OR could have torped it to potentially 70 (including goal square) from their goal.

Who do we have in the team that can do that?

Salem, the other dedicated kicker would give you the same Lewis result.

Maybe Pedders...if Hunt was fit then him.

As far as playing on and grabbing some metres?

Again Hunt if fit or Frost...with either of those who knows were it would end up.

In both scenarios it would have been Hibberd if he was there but he wasn't.

[YesitwasaWin4theAges 6,704]

4 hours ago, spirit of norm smith said:

Sydney was 7 points up  , 19 minute mark, 6 minutes to play, 2 men down, had 1 point scored in the quarter, we had all the momentum after 3 goals and...

nul nil nudda nothing

swans controlled the game 

played heeney as a loose man

goodwin 1- work out how to overcome this or lose the close ones 2- work out how to do it or lose the close ones

They were shot to bits and we still found away to lose the unloseable.

[YesitwasaWin4theAges 6,704]

2 hours ago, Go the Biff said:

Real leadership and brains would have addressed the lack of two way running allowing the Swans to waltz the ball up the ground with chip kicks & uncontested marks. Or would maybe have pushed AVB back to the square so Allir stopped ripping us across half back. Or realising Heeney was their mop up man in the last quarter & manning him up. And so on and so on..........

Usually like your contributions Rono but this is just a pizz poor opportunistic slap at Lewis.

 But you go ahead and worry about the last minute of the game. I'm far more concerned by what happened in the 99 minutes prior

We refuse to man up spares in our forward line especially when we have so much momentum. 

Those last 6 minutes were so [censored] frustrating.

[Pennant St Dee 13,242]

2 hours ago, Jumping Jack Clennett said:

Spot on,TGR.

My mind went back to the Geelong game last minutes when Henderson sent it 60 m straight up the middle.

I’ll never  forget the last half minute of the ‘87 prelim. After our last behind, they torped it right up the centre, and ended up with Buckanara’s goal.

But perhaps we should follow “Go the Biff’s” advice, when we’re a goal down with a minute to play. Don’t try and get it down the other end, just lament the way you’ve been playing all day!

Is that the Henderson kick which went 40m (kicked from the top of the square) and went straight to Vince and Melksham on the RHFF only to be butchered by Vince not taking a mark. 

The OP was started by a Lewis detractor who takes one thing from Lewis's game FCS of all the things which went wrong yesterday this is not one to highlight. Watch the tape again Sydney absolutely clogged the corridor.

If I had to chose between Lewis and Jones making a decision and holding their nerve there's only 1 clear choice

Edited August 13, 2018 by Pennant St Dee

[TRIGON 4,783]

Now just wait a minute. This thread is based on a falsehood , it was much longer than a minute to go. When Lewis kicked that we were 8 points behind, with 4 minutes on the clock. He kicked it to near the 50 meter arc in the direction of the point of the centre square - a good place to attack from. Gawn and Brayshaw got in each others way and messed it up. Lewis took the right option and executed his kick well.

Edited August 13, 2018 by TRIGON

[martin 727]

6 hours ago, TGR said:

Each club, no doubt, has the hail mary kick-in, that is HIGH RISK, that is put into play when a team needs to score a goal or 2 with a minute or 2 to play.  This play might be a guts-or-nuts torp or a play-on-with-block to get around the man-on-the-mark.

What I saw with 1 minute to go yesterday was pure amateur-hour.  Jordan Lewis was never going to play on.  Jordan Lewis was never going to torp it.  Sydney could put their house on his kick landing no more than 55/60 (including goal square) from their goal.  They cram this area in the guts, and we kick a short and ultimately go wide.

The game was over when he had the ball in his hands with 1 minute to go.  We were never going to threaten.  The most amateur play from a personnel/structure viewpoint I have seen at AFL level for a long time.  Unforgivable at this level.

Real leadership and brains +/- planning would have dictated that the guy kicking out could either risk playing-on for overlap and territory OR could have torped it to potentially 70 (including goal square) from their goal.

Yawn

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,816]

4 minutes ago, TRIGON said:

Now just wait a minute. This thread is based on a falsehood , it was much longer than a minute to go. When Lewis kicked that we were 8 points behind, with 4 minutes on the clock. He kicked it to near the point of the centre square - a good place to attack from. Gawn and Brayshaw got in each others way and messed it up. Lewis took the right option and executed his kick well.

Whether the thread is started on the basis of a falsehood or not, we clearly don't yet know what to do in the last few minutes of a game when it is close, whether we're ahead or behind. It's time we worked out what to do in each scenario.

[TRIGON 4,783]

1 minute ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

Whether the thread is started on the basis of a falsehood or not, we clearly don't yet know what to do in the last few minutes of a game when it is close, whether we're ahead or behind. It's time we worked out what to do in each scenario.

Yes, we generally-speaking have an on-field leadership vacuum, that much I agree with. However, in this instance Lewis, made a very good decision. He set us up to have possession in a part of the ground where we had options to go down the line,  middle, or switch. Sadly, Max and Angus got in each others way and stuffed it up.

[TGR 1,367]

9 hours ago, Go the Biff said:

Real leadership and brains would have addressed the lack of two way running allowing the Swans to waltz the ball up the ground with chip kicks & uncontested marks. Or would maybe have pushed AVB back to the square so Allir stopped ripping us across half back. Or realising Heeney was their mop up man in the last quarter & manning him up. And so on and so on..........

Usually like your contributions Rono but this is just a pizz poor opportunistic slap at Lewis.

 But you go ahead and worry about the last minute of the game. I'm far more concerned by what happened in the 99 minutes prior

If I wanted to be opportunistic about Lewis, I would have mentioned Papley and daylight.  I haven't.

As far as the 99 minutes beforehand go, if we'd kicked straight, the 99 minutes wouldn't have been an issue.

 

This kick-in was not only about Lewis.  It is about having a green-light, hail-mary plan at the end, which every other team in the AFL and VFL would have.  These are full-time professionals FCS.  This kick-in was an indictment on Goody (who I rarely criticise) and the leadership group; including Lewis, who was the last person you would want kicking-in for a hail-mary scenario.

 

 

6 hours ago, Pennant St Dee said:

 

The OP was started by a Lewis detractor who takes one thing from Lewis's game FCS of all the things which went wrong yesterday this is not one to highlight. Watch the tape again Sydney absolutely clogged the corridor.

Nick Riewoldt on the commentary actually blamed Melbourne for sucking more Sydney opponents into the corridor and failing to set up space to run in to.  Watch the tape again.

When Lewis was about to take the kick-in, Sydney had only one guy in D50.  This left 17 guys clogging corridor.  Do you really think with the ball in Frost's hand, that Sydney would only allow one of theirs in D50?  Do the maths.  Lewis taking the kick-in with 70 seconds to go was a failure on so many levels.  Amateur hour.

 

 

 

[titan_uranus 25,020]

I started reading the OP thinking "of all the things that went wrong yesterday, this is what you started a thread about?"

Then I saw who started the thread, and it all made sense.

[Pennant St Dee 13,242]

1 hour ago, TGR said:

If I wanted to be opportunistic about Lewis, I would have mentioned Papley and daylight.  I haven't.

As far as the 99 minutes beforehand go, if we'd kicked straight, the 99 minutes wouldn't have been an issue.

 

This kick-in was not only about Lewis.  It is about having a green-light, hail-mary plan at the end, which every other team in the AFL and VFL would have.  These are full-time professionals FCS.  This kick-in was an indictment on Goody (who I rarely criticise) and the leadership group; including Lewis, who was the last person you would want kicking-in for a hail-mary scenario.

 

 

Nick Riewoldt on the commentary actually blamed Melbourne for sucking more Sydney opponents into the corridor and failing to set up space to run in to.  Watch the tape again.

When Lewis was about to take the kick-in, Sydney had only one guy in D50.  This left 17 guys clogging corridor.  Do you really think with the ball in Frost's hand, that Sydney would only allow one of theirs in D50?  Do the maths.  Lewis taking the kick-in with 70 seconds to go was a failure on so many levels.  Amateur hour.

 

 

 

It's a shame Salem was picking up Papley

Just clarify you expext Frost to take the kick in, if the answer to that is yes, however long you've been watching footy has been wasted

[TGR 1,367]

3 minutes ago, Pennant St Dee said:

It's a shame Salem was picking up Papley

Just clarify you expext Frost to take the kick in, if the answer to that is yes, however long you've been watching footy has been wasted

Any player that could have played on and broken a line OR a player that could have torped it.  In essence, Lewis is the last player that should have got the gig in that situation.

[Pennant St Dee 13,242]

11 minutes ago, TGR said:

Any player that could have played on and broken a line OR a player that could have torped it.  In essence, Lewis is the last player that should have got the gig in that situation.

Enough said I'll refrain from commenting again 

Frost to take a kick in, absolutely clueless 

[Pates 9,660]

Agreed, they said it on the commentary as well. Something along the lines of "surely they know there isn't much time left" we played that last minute as if we'd already lost. 

I'm not the biggest fan of Jimmy Bartel's special comments but the whole second half he sounded baffled as to what we were doing, and it wasn't like what he was saying was anything groundbreaking but it really seemed to show that when we are down we seem to become nothing more than headless chickens.

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,816]

8 hours ago, Pates said:

Agreed, they said it on the commentary as well. Something along the lines of "surely they know there isn't much time left" we played that last minute as if we'd already lost. 

I'm not the biggest fan of Jimmy Bartel's special comments but the whole second half he sounded baffled as to what we were doing, and it wasn't like what he was saying was anything groundbreaking but it really seemed to show that when we are down we seem to become nothing more than headless chickens.

Actually, I am. He seems to me to be the only commentator that appreciates how the game is played today. Too many of the rest seem to think the game is played the way they played it, even if that's only 5 years ago. Irrespective of any other value they bring, commentators like Matthew Richardson, Luke Darcy and even Cameron Ling have been out of the game so long that their comments show they don't understand the technical side of how the game is now played.  I find Bartel's commentary to be insightful.

[Pates 9,660]

6 hours ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

Actually, I am. He seems to me to be the only commentator that appreciates how the game is played today. Too many of the rest seem to think the game is played the way they played it, even if that's only 5 years ago. Irrespective of any other value they bring, commentators like Matthew Richardson, Luke Darcy and even Cameron Ling have been out of the game so long that their comments show they don't understand the technical side of how the game is now played.  I find Bartel's commentary to be insightful.

Fair point, his comments regarding this game I think mainly centred around the fact that we were playing into Sydney’s hands and that when momentum went against you it was up to the leaders to wrestle that momentum back or at least into a stalemate. 

Hes truckloads better than the likes of Matthews and Walls. Matthews doesn’t get the modern game and it’s grating to here him try to rationalise it.