He played at the same Club I did and you always saw he was a gun, I think any reason not to play Oscar is ok. He is very talented and agile. Also from Victoria so that might strengthen our claim.

28 minutes ago, Hogans Heroe"s said:

I think any reason not to play Oscar is ok. 

Prepare for the storm that is about to rain down on you. 

Crows wanted Gibbs, still might want him. Could do a three way deal with Carlton and Adelaide.

Edited April 4, 20178 yr by Ethan Tremblay

Jake Lever is one of the few key position defenders it would make sense to chase as he is a 10+ year player and he will slot in ahead of OMac, but IMO we are not desperate for another key position defender and giving up two first rounders and taking ourselves out of the draft for 2 years is probably not worth it. 1st and secound round pick, this and next year is where i think the deal will sit with us, but Carlton with Bryce Gibbs and a first rounder seems like a more logical option.

Jake Lever would be nice but for what it would cost I would rather have the Mc bros as our tall backs and go for another up and coming mid. 

2 minutes ago, fndee said:

Jake Lever would be nice but for what it would cost I would rather have the Mc bros as our tall backs and go for another up and coming mid. 

There's no reason why we can't have both - landing a midfielder with a second/third rounder that can be a good player for us isn't out of the question.  If Lever was available then he should be our priority.

I like Lever a lot, but agree with those saying we need an established A grade mid to support our young ones. Control the ball better in the midfield and our back line will hold its own.

If Brayshaw doesn't kick on this year, perhaps we could throw him in the mix.

Crows need mids.

Brayshaw for Lever. Get it done.

A perfect target. Just what we need. Jacko make it happen.

Edited April 4, 20178 yr by chook fowler

Wow.. Brayshaw for Lever!?

April fools right???

Edited April 4, 20178 yr by dazzledavey36

Brayshaw was ordinary on the weekend, but he's being played out of position and will be a very good player when he gets a run at it. He showed this in the middle towards the back end of last year.

If you're going after Lever, it's draft picks. You don't take from the midfield we're building. We still need to strengthen the midfield, so taking another player from that area is stooopid.

Lever has had a far superior start to his career than Brayshaw - he can hit a target by foot which helps.

Brayshaw to Carlton, Gibbs to Adelaide, Lever to Melbourne plus a shuffle of draft picks.

You've got to give something to get something, and Brayshaw could easily be the makeweight in any deal to get the likes of Lever in.

40 minutes ago, DemonAndrew said:

Lever has had a far superior start to his career than Brayshaw - he can hit a target by foot which helps.

Brayshaw to Carlton, Gibbs to Adelaide, Lever to Melbourne plus a shuffle of draft picks.

You've got to give something to get something, and Brayshaw could easily be the makeweight in any deal to get the likes of Lever in.

Get out.

Let's go full stupid and send Oliver to Adelaide for Lever.  Don't settle for being a little outrageous, just send yourself right over the edge.

I just don't rate Brayshaw.

He can't get the ball and when he does get it he turns it over.

Either he improves massively in 2017 or he's trade bait for mine.

57 minutes ago, DemonAndrew said:

Lever has had a far superior start to his career than Brayshaw - he can hit a target by foot which helps.

Brayshaw to Carlton, Gibbs to Adelaide, Lever to Melbourne plus a shuffle of draft picks.

You've got to give something to get something, and Brayshaw could easily be the makeweight in any deal to get the likes of Lever in.

 

 

Brayshaw had an outstanding first year in 2015. Last year he did his knee in the first second of the pre-season and was knocked out multiple times. No wonder Lever is ahead of Gus in his development. We are building a deep midfield required to win a flag (as the doggies showed). Every club would kill for someone like Lever but we need the midfield depth first and foremost. It is just plain recency bias in wanting to offload Gus, as he wasn't at his best on the weekend, but he was instrumental in round 1. 

Edited April 5, 20178 yr by TickleMeTyson

Brayshaw is highly rated internally and ain't going anywhere 

But that's the things @TickleMeTyson - you've got to give to get.

Brayshaw's ceiling is high; so too is Lever's.

I'd argue that the latter has more scope for improvement and greater natural ability than Brayshaw.

Both are highly rated, and if we have to give to get, Brayshaw could be a possibility - he's definitely rated higher than ANB for instance, and Stretch (who I'd argue has more impact on a game-to-game basis than Brayshaw).

3 minutes ago, DemonAndrew said:

But that's the things @TickleMeTyson - you've got to give to get.

Brayshaw's ceiling is high; so too is Lever's.

I'd argue that the latter has more scope for improvement and greater natural ability than Brayshaw.

Both are highly rated, and if we have to give to get, Brayshaw could be a possibility - he's definitely rated higher than ANB for instance, and Stretch (who I'd argue has more impact on a game-to-game basis than Brayshaw).

 

I agree 100%, would have to give up something very valuable for Lever. I think our disagreement stems from which areas of the ground require the most focus. In my opinion, sacrificing talent from the midfield to add talent to back-line is counter-productive to building a list for the modern game, particularly given we already have a top five defender in Tom McDonald and a talented supporting cast (Oscar cops a lot on this forum and at times it is justified, but Frost/Wagner/Smith are all decade long key defence prospects).

To challenge in finals, and overcome injuries, a deep midfield is paramount. I'm not saying I wouldn't love to have Jakey Lever at Melbourne, just that robbing Peter to pay Paul isn't the best strategy. 

Our backline is thin tho and lacking in skill - at the moment Lumumba and Garland are 'gone' for their career and 2017 respectfully, Frost cannot maintain fitness, and Hibberd has come to the club and immediately broken down at the age of 26, 27.

Lever's skills are miles higher than the two Macs - and I'm a big fan of both those boys, but they lack the natural ability of Lever.

Midfielders can always be found - there's an expectation that Petracca will go into the midfield, Stretch is getting better all the time, and ANB has started 2017 in much the same form as Brayshaw (middling, at best).

It's always "easier" to find mids than quality ball-using key defenders.

ANB and picks for Lever.

He'd be a great get, but not worth a couple of first rounders ('17 & '18) as some have suggested. I wouldn't be giving up Brayshaw either, I think that could do more damage than expected with his relationship with the other younger guys.

41 minutes ago, DemonAndrew said:

Our backline is thin tho and lacking in skill - at the moment Lumumba and Garland are 'gone' for their career and 2017 respectfully, Frost cannot maintain fitness, and Hibberd has come to the club and immediately broken down at the age of 26, 27.

Lever's skills are miles higher than the two Macs - and I'm a big fan of both those boys, but they lack the natural ability of Lever.

Midfielders can always be found - there's an expectation that Petracca will go into the midfield, Stretch is getting better all the time, and ANB has started 2017 in much the same form as Brayshaw (middling, at best).

It's always "easier" to find mids than quality ball-using key defenders.

Andrew your overrating Levers skills here. While he is an outstanding talent the games i have watched he is prone to turn it over by foot. Crow fans will say that of its one thing he needs to work on its his disposal by foot.

And i tend to disagree that midfielder arr easier to find then KPDs.. Both Mac brother pick 53 and are set for 10 year long careers. Mitch McGovern who is one of the best intercept defender in the comp was a rookie listed player.

Top 10 draft pick midfielders are hard to find. Especially when your drafting guys like Toumpas Morton O' Rourke Aish. 

Brayshaw ceiling is much higher then Lever. You can have an average backline and still win a flag. Just ask the westerteen bulldogs. What won them the game was their superior and competitive midfield. They have about 8 quality players that run through the midfield. Brayshaw with 50 games next to his game will really start to impact games and show his true value.

188cm 87kg midfielders like Gus aren't easy to find.

Edited April 5, 20178 yr by dazzledavey36

15 hours ago, Watts the matter said:

Sufficient I think you mean. They took Ellis with pick 12 and lever went pick 14.

By golly, that's right.

And as nice a guy as JT is and as much as I want him to succeed in his comeback, we have really missed out on a gem.