So as we were saying @Fifty-5, Jaeger could do either a Ball or a Stevens....

 

2 hours ago, Skin D said:

There not their.

I see what you did their - there no quite theyre

Edited September 14, 20168 yr by binman

43 minutes ago, stuie said:

So as we were saying @Fifty-5, Jaeger could do either a Ball or a Stevens....

 

O'Meara has nominated Hawthorn.  Their best offer would be something like 2016 1st + 2017 1st.

Hawthorn may offer one 1st plus

• Brad Hill compensation from Freo so they can stay in the Tom Mitchell market (not sure what Freo can offer there - they don't have a 2016 2nd - they'll get picks for Mayne, Ballantyne and Barlow but probably not high enough to get it done)
• A player - maybe Sicily or Hartung have been mentioned by unreliable sources

I think they'll get it done but if they don't then O'Meara would go into the ND with a false price on his head a la Luke Ball (he went in at $900k/2 years and played the 3rd year for $100k on a gentleman's agreement i.e 3 years @ $1M) hoping to get through to Hawthorn.  O'Meara could go in at $1.8M/2years and play the 3rd for $300k at Hawthorn i.e $700k/year for 3, but the $900k/year other clubs would need to pay would hurt - he wouldn't offer them the 3rd year discount

Depending on where Hawthorn's pick is I think he'd possibly get through.  GC themselves will probably have 3 in the top 10 and I doubt they'll waste one on drafting him back.

Round one
1 Essendon
2 Brisbane Lions
3 Fremantle
4 Gold Coast
5 Carlton
6 Richmond Gold Coast for Prestia
7 Greater Western Sydney (received from Collingwood)
8 Gold Coast (received from Melbourne)
9 Port Adelaide
10 St Kilda
11 North Melbourne
12 West Coast

Edited September 14, 20168 yr by Fifty-5

57 minutes ago, Fifty-5 said:

O'Meara has nominated Hawthorn.  Their best offer would be something like 2016 1st + 2017 1st.

Hawthorn may offer one 1st plus

• Brad Hill compensation from Freo so they can stay in the Tom Mitchell market (not sure what Freo can offer there - they don't have a 2016 2nd - they'll get picks for Mayne, Ballantyne and Barlow but probably not high enough to get it done)
• A player - maybe Sicily or Hartung have been mentioned by unreliable sources

I think they'll get it done but if they don't then O'Meara would go into the ND with a false price on his head a la Luke Ball (he went in at $900k/2 years and played the 3rd year for $100k on a gentleman's agreement i.e 3 years @ $1M) hoping to get through to Hawthorn.  O'Meara could go in at $1.8M/2years and play the 3rd for $300k at Hawthorn i.e $700k/year for 3, but the $900k/year other clubs would need to pay would hurt - he wouldn't offer them the 3rd year discount

Depending on where Hawthorn's pick is I think he'd possibly get through.  GC themselves will probably have 3 in the top 10 and I doubt they'll waste one on drafting him back.

Round one
1 Essendon
2 Brisbane Lions
3 Fremantle
4 Gold Coast
5 Carlton
6 Richmond Gold Coast for Prestia
7 Greater Western Sydney (received from Collingwood)
8 Gold Coast (received from Melbourne)
9 Port Adelaide
10 St Kilda
11 North Melbourne
12 West Coast

I do think he'll get there, I just think it's not guaranteed. The money won't be an issue, it's already been said that their players will take a pay cut if they have to, but you'd think they'd have a bit of room anyway, plus they could backload contracts accounting for all the forthcoming retirements.

I'm not sure on what picks the Hawks have used the last few years, but I'm not sure they could trade away 1st rounders for the next 2 years, will they have used enough over the 4 year period to do that?

I'm definitely sensing a ground swell of unrest about the whole "club preference" issue at the moment, so will be an interesting time this trade period.

 

Edit - Bugger, just had a look and technically the Hawks used 2 first round picks last year.

 

Edited September 14, 20168 yr by stuie

6 minutes ago, stuie said:

I do think he'll get there, I just think it's not guaranteed. The money won't be an issue, it's already been said that their players will take a pay cut if they have to, but you'd think they'd have a bit of room anyway, plus they could backload contracts accounting for all the forthcoming retirements.

I'm not sure on what picks the Hawks have used the last few years, but I'm not sure they could trade away 1st rounders for the next 2 years, will they have used enough over the 4 year period to do that?

I'm definitely sensing a ground swell of unrest about the whole "club preference" issue at the moment, so will be an interesting time this trade period.

 

Look I think they would struggle to find the big $s over the next 2 years so that could be a problem with my suggested plan.  

Apparently they can trade their next 2 1sts because they used 2 last year (one from North for Jed Anderson - incredible isn't it!) and their own 1st.  They traded away their 1st in 2014 for O'Rourke but apparently that doesn't count, the 2 in 4 starts from last year when future picks became tradeable - which is probably fair enough.

I think they must struggle to get O'Meara AND Mitchell - surely we can get involved in the Mitchell move?

Hawthorn just want to stop O'meara from getting to Essendon, because they hate each other, So probably like most of these blokes he must be designated as sound and trade able.

1 minute ago, Fifty-5 said:

Look I think they would struggle to find the big $s over the next 2 years so that could be a problem with my suggested plan.  

Apparently they can trade their next 2 1sts because they used 2 last year (one from North for Jed Anderson - incredible isn't it!) and their own 1st.  They traded away their 1st in 2014 for O'Rourke but apparently that doesn't count, the 2 in 4 starts from last year when future picks became tradeable - which is probably fair enough.

I think they must struggle to get O'Meara AND Mitchell - surely we can get involved in the Mitchell move?

Given the moves and rumoured moves this year, plus the points system and how many high picks GWS have compared to how much list room is available, I feel like there'll be a fair few 3 way trades and maybe a few single for multiple pick trades too.

Seeing how Josh "Dark Horse" Mahoney went last year, I have high hopes for what we can achieve in that environment.

 

What the club should be doing, is seeing this as an opportunity.

Hawthorn are making a bold gamble to keep their premiership clock open, without going through the downturn that the Salary Cap/Draft is designed to facilitate.  Sydney has achieved this to some extent; while Geelong are trying their best.  It can be done, but it does need everything to line up correctly (Other clubs such as Melbourne needs to ensure that everything lining up is very difficulty and therefore unlikely).

It is accepted that the Hawks are going to very quickly lose champion players who as history has shown are not easily replaced.  They are in a position to do this because importantly their champions have never been reliant on speed (therefore the loss of it won't significantly influence their output), are all essentially assistant coaches on the field, and they are taking pay cuts to keep the Dynasty going (ironically this approach also improves their income as it extends their careers a number of years, noting that if the club was in a rebuild then they would most likely be encouraged to retire).  This works well when the supporting cast suits the mix - i.e for the hawks this equates to a support cast that has speed, and run n carry (Rioli, Smith, Hill, Hartung, Bruest, etc, even Gunston).  Now while the Hawks are going about replacing Roughead, Mitchell, Hodge etc with Vickery, Mitchell, O'meara; other clubs should be targeting their mid tier run n carry players.  This would result in the Hawks having the wrong mix, to continue in the premiership window.

I beleive Melbourne should be offering nice money to someone like Hartung (I'm not a Smith fan, but can understand the appeal) which forces the Hawks to match the offer (reducing their salary cap space and ability to recruit); if they don't match it then we get a player who meets our need (and at the same time reduces their ability to negotiate a trade should if he was identified as potential trade-bait's but request a trade to a destination not of their liking).  Furthermore, every run n carry player the Hawks lose requires their aging inside players to take on a role which they are losing the capability to do at the top level; or requires the replacement players to take on a role they were not recruited for.  If they lost Hartung, Smith and Hill; they already look very slow!

These mid tier players are get-able, for it just needs as some, possibly most will be put out by the perceived pressure of senior players taking pay cuts after being paid top dollar for most of their career, so that new players to the club can get the top dollar, not the mid-tier who deserves it.  Also they are not the maryrs they are making out to be as the chances are it was a choice for some between retirement or paycut; and as noted earlier the paycut extends their earning potential while the premiership window is open. 

Note with Fremantle already grabbing Hill, it wouldn't take a lot to upset their team balance.

Now if the Hawks put an effort into keeping these mid-tier players then they don't get the replacements they need for their aging champions.  Either way, it makes it that much more harder for them to continue the Dynasty.  

Who else could we target.

 

Edited September 14, 20168 yr by Ungarie boy

I think the Suns will clearly want an established player for O'meara, are the Hawks really willing to give up someone like Shiel or Issac Smith? 

 

I suspect they'll offer their first pick and someone like Hartung

33 minutes ago, Abe said:

I think the Suns will clearly want an established player for O'meara, are the Hawks really willing to give up someone like Shiel or Issac Smith? 

 

I suspect they'll offer their first pick and someone like Hartung

If Hartung is overlooked for the rest of the finals, I would say he will be off to another club.

2 hours ago, Abe said:

I think the Suns will clearly want an established player for O'meara, are the Hawks really willing to give up someone like Shiel or Issac Smith? 

 

I suspect they'll offer their first pick and someone like Hartung

I was thinking about the Suns high picks and what it would take for us to nab one, and thought maybe we'd trade one or both of the two Qld boys on the list, in Wagner and VandenBerg..?

Both high draft picks who've shown a bit and may warrant some interest... and a low draft pick.

Edited September 14, 20168 yr by PaulRB

4 hours ago, willmoy said:

Hawthorn just want to stop O'meara from getting to Essendon, because they hate each other, So probably like most of these blokes he must be designated as sound and trade able.

Id rather see another Hawks flag than Essendon be a finals side or worse, a contender.

 

13 hours ago, Petraccattack said:

Id rather see another Hawks flag than Essendon be a finals side or worse, a contender.

 

It hurts to say.

I hate Essendon more than Collingwood. 

17 hours ago, Abe said:

It hurts to say.

I hate Essendon more than Collingwood. 

Why does that hurt? I thought that would go without saying for anyone under the age of 50.  

Hope he was watching tonight end of the hawks. They will play finals next year and then they're done. The umps will start to drop off they won't get the rub of the green. There stars will be older or gone era over. Suck eggs Frawley 

I just said the same thing to my son. O'Meara would have thought he was joining success. He still might be, Geelong were looking over the cliff and have kept themsleves as a top team. But it really does look like the Hawks top players are in decline, and they can't control games anymore. Surely, his manager would be keeping options open now. 

Hawks need about 3 inside bulls, they're absolute rubbish at the contest. 

The end is nigh.

Last 3 times I've seen Hawthorn live they've lost - sweet days!

Could not happen to a better bunch of old campaigners.

Clarko, Hodge, Mitchell, Smith - the list goes on - total campaigners.

Edited September 16, 20168 yr by Fifty-5

.....and to think we started the rot, o joy, o happiness....

Now officially a Hawk ...

On 16/09/2016 at 11:43 PM, Fifty-5 said:

Last 3 times I've seen Hawthorn live they've lost - sweet days!

Could not happen to a better bunch of old campaigners.

Clarko, Hodge, Mitchell, Smith - the list goes on - total campaigners.

Before this week I would have had Lewis in that list

Edited October 20, 20168 yr by chook fowler

Just now, chook fowler said:

Before this week I would have had Lewis in that listing

Always loved him

6 hours ago, Whispering_Jack said:

Now officially a Hawk ...

And no doubt his knees will miraculously recover after two years of misery and he will be an absolute gun who plays every week. 

9 minutes ago, Earl Hood said:

And no doubt his knees will miraculously recover after two years of misery and he will be an absolute gun who plays every week. 

Would not be upset if he blew it up again.

eff O'Meara, and eff the hawks.