The worst part is that Melbourne players don't move.

I understand that when there is a zone there isn't a lot of space ot move into but if one Melbourne player moves then there is space from where he moved from which then allows another Melbourne player to move into that space and so on.

This is actually the second worst part, The time taken to kick is the worst. Sometimes you need to kick to space to 'force' the player to run onto it...

cause he kicked it out on the full once, in the first half. the nerve of him.

It wasn't just an out on the full. It was the most appalling kick imaginable under zero pressure. And from memory cost us a goal

I may be wrong, but do the good clubs have just one player doing it all, or do they just make do with whoever is there at the time? I'd guess the latter, which they can afford to do because they have talented kicks in their backlines (e.g. does it really matter if Birchall or Suckling or Hodge or Burgoyne takes the Hawthorn kick in?).

We can't afford to nominate a player or two and wait for them to show up every time we need to kick the ball in. It wastes time and gives the opponent time to zone, which leads to us resorting to our standard for the last 8 years, which is to kick it long to the 50 on the boundary, which is very low percentage and very stupid.

Dunn should be our sole kicker-iner. What about our last goal. He decides to thump the [censored] out it well outside the 50, then we thump it in quickly to our forward line, where low and behold, because of the quick transition, an inside 50 mark and subsequent goal.

It took us all game to figure it out? FFS

No he shouldn't.

For one, he should be playing forward. I'd rather Dunn be on the end of the kick-in as he can actually lead and mark decently (contrast with Spencer, who doesn't understand those two concepts well).

For another, he isn't a smart kicker and too often tries to show off his long boot by playing on to himself and going 50 metres down the line. Every. Time. Which leads to opponents reading us faster than our own players.

Why is Terlich copping such a flogging on here? He was ok yesterday. Dunn was the worst with our kick ins, dinky little play on and then kick to the right side, EVERY TIME, until the game was all but over.

Agree re: Dunn, but you were not watching the same game if you thought Terlich was 'ok' yesterday.

Agree re: Dunn, but you were not watching the same game if you thought Terlich was 'ok' yesterday.

I didn't say he was great, said he was ok. He gave us run out of defence, won all his one on ones, and cleaned up a lot of others mistakes. It's no coincidence that McDonald, Georgiou, Terlich, Vince etc didn't have great games given the lack of midfield pressure for most of the day.

I didn't say he was great, said he was ok. He gave us run out of defence, won all his one on ones, and cleaned up a lot of others mistakes. It's no coincidence that McDonald, Georgiou, Terlich, Vince etc didn't have great games given the lack of midfield pressure for most of the day.

I know you said he was 'ok'. I disagree. I don't think he was 'ok' at all.

I don't agree that he 'won all his one on ones', I don't agree that he 'cleaned up a lot of others mistakes' either. Even if he did clean up mistakes, he created more of his own. I also think he was far too loose on Matera, he turned it over every time he had it, and at times he was in the wrong spot in defensive positioning.

I agree that the backline had a tougher job than usual, but Terlich has now had two or three consecutive weeks of mediocrity.

It wasn't just an out on the full. It was the most appalling kick imaginable under zero pressure. And from memory cost us a goal

he has played 20 games. Does far more good things than bad things. At least he has a crack at it, many others should be under the microscope before him.

Salem can kick out. Problem solved.

Was surprised the directive yesterday wasn't to keep the kickouts away from Ablett.

It needs to be a combined effort to stop Gary and the kicker didn't pull his weight.

Jordie was good.

he turned it over every time he had it

No he didn't. 1 clanger.

Salem can kick out. Problem solved.

Was surprised the directive yesterday wasn't to keep the kickouts away from Ablett.

It needs to be a combined effort to stop Gary and the kicker didn't pull his weight.

Jordie was good.

Jordie was good? Excuse me? It was absolutely pointless having him on the field.

As for Salem, I agree it will be great to slot him in at some point and he'd be fantastic to have as our kick in player however I'm with others who are of the belief that he should be made to wait. One big game in the VFL doesn't earn you a call up to the firsts. He needs to find consistency and continuity to his game in the VFL now, and if he finds that, it will have a hugely positive effect on his prep going into an AFL game knowing he has been performing well.

Roos will know that. But jeez I can't wait until he cements his spot. One less player on the field for me to shake my head at.

Salem can kick out. Problem solved.

Was surprised the directive yesterday wasn't to keep the kickouts away from Ablett.

It needs to be a combined effort to stop Gary and the kicker didn't pull his weight.

Jordie was good.

yup, an area we have been insipid in for almost forever and giving the responsibilities of it to a first season kid will solve our problems.

Really man? Have you learnt nothing from the mistakes we have made in the past by putting pressure on kids?

Kids should just play and enjoy the game for the first 1-2 seasons. Roos knows this.

yup, an area we have been insipid in for almost forever and giving the responsibilities of it to a first season kid will solve our problems.

Really man? Have you learnt nothing from the mistakes we have made in the past by putting pressure on kids?

Kids should just play and enjoy the game for the first 1-2 seasons. Roos knows this.

First year or not, Salem can kick.

Problem solved. It is a kick out for christs sakes, it's hardly going to compromise his development.

We aren't this precious surely? Plus, it is our recruitment that has let us down over the past 5 years.

You can develop spuds all you like, dress em up and roll em out, but at the end of the day - they will still be spuds.

bring back the t.viney double huddle!

I would play Vince in the backline to give us at least one elite kick when we rebound. He can also take kick ins. He hasn't been setting the world on fire in the midfield but he has looked good when he runs back and helps out the backline.

I have wrote this in the post match thread but I think it deserves a thread of its on. What is going on with our kick ins ? Its driving me insane. We have been the worst side at it since the Daniher era. Ever since they bought in the not waiting for the flag rule it has become even worse because every side bar us grab the ball and move it within 5 seconds of a point been kicked and before the opposition can set a zone up and the balls cleared. We wait for a player (usually Dunn) to slowly jog over grab the ball and by the time he does this the whole front half of the ground is zoned up. I would love to know the stats in regards to direct scores from our kick ins. We saw when we moved it quickly how beneficial it is, I think JKH got on the end of a quick kick in and goaled and the last goal of the game from dawes came as quick movement.

We have had numerous coaches since Daniher but yet none have been able to rectify this part of our game, I honestly think its a prime example of players not working hard enough. They don't work hard into space, or to create space for other teammates, they just stand there and point at eachother. Resulting in us to kick long and hope the ball gets knocked out of bounds and then its a 50/50 ball(probably worse knowing our clearance rate) from a throw in. It is a serious part of our game we must improve because in a game like yesterday it can make the difference between a win & a loss.

Spot on. Particularly, as our clearance rate from throw ins is abysmal. Even when we won the centre clearances yesterday, we lost from throw in and stoppage clearances.

I've been bemoaning our lack of plan B from this situation for the past 7 years as well. It seems amazing that none of our coaches have identified this as a weakness. They couldn't have, otherwise we would have done something about it. We consistently, slowly kick long to a player (usually ruckman) on the back flank.

Dunn should be our sole kicker-iner. What about our last goal. He decides to thump the [censored] out it well outside the 50, then we thump it in quickly to our forward line, where low and behold, because of the quick transition, an inside 50 mark and subsequent goal.

It took us all game to figure it out? FFS

There were a number of occasions that Dunn chose to do the dinky kick to the pocket, when the camera behind the goals clearly showed 2 free and unmarked Melbourne players in the middle of the ground.

It wasn't the team that took the whole game to "open their eyes".... it was Dunn.

Yes he can kick the ball, but his awareness of the game around himself is appalling.

What would have been the result if those type of kicks had been taken earlier in the game, and similar easy goals resulted?......certainly not another respectable loss.....

It's simple. Kick the ball as quickly as possible to the player as far from his opponent as possible. Failing that, THEN you go long down the boundary.

This has been a bugbear of mine for a long time now. And of course yesterday I was discussing it openly as it was on display.

The consensus is it's been about 7 to 8 years where we gave been abysmal at bringing the ball in from a behind. We have had multiple defensive coaches and not a thing has changed. It infuriates me when you watch the likes of GC yesterday do the exact opposite, short zig zagging kicks with ease out of defence that then goes the length of the field in 20 secs because they keep the ball moving.

We have;

No plan B

No spontibaity

No desire to try an alternative

We don't spread

We don't work hard enough

We just make it simple for oppositions to set up as we are so predictable.

People can suggest roos is having us stick to plans .... Hey I've got no idea on that but what I do know is when we play good sides aka hawthorn, cats, freo we will be severely exposed if we have no sense of awareness to move move move.

Guys it's not VFL you don't have time to stop and prop. This is our single biggest problem I beleive and we can thank mark neeld for entrenching that trait even worse than it may have been.

Speed and backing there skills and first decision is what required ..... Full stop !

Has anyone mentioned Strauss for kick ins...serious option!

Spot on. Particularly, as our clearance rate from throw ins is abysmal. Even when we won the centre clearances yesterday, we lost from throw in and stoppage clearances.

I've been bemoaning our lack of plan B from this situation for the past 7 years as well. It seems amazing that none of our coaches have identified this as a weakness. They couldn't have, otherwise we would have done something about it. We consistently, slowly kick long to a player (usually ruckman) on the back flank.

Adam well said its the part of the game that we can actually improve by coaching and discipline

I said the same thing. We are to slow kicking out. GC yesterday always found a target and got out easily. its always the same. Short kick to yourself then kick it near the boundary where the ruckman always is. But it doesnt always work. Its what we did last year. We need to change it up

Has anyone mentioned Strauss for kick ins...serious option!

Are you insane?Strauus will not be there next year No good at all!

Are you insane?Strauus will not be there next year No good at all!

Ill take your word for it, have u seen him playing for Casey?

This has been a bugbear of mine for a long time now. And of course yesterday I was discussing it openly as it was on display.

The consensus is it's been about 7 to 8 years where we gave been abysmal at bringing the ball in from a behind. We have had multiple defensive coaches and not a thing has changed. It infuriates me when you watch the likes of GC yesterday do the exact opposite, short zig zagging kicks with ease out of defence that then goes the length of the field in 20 secs because they keep the ball moving.

We have;

No plan B

No spontibaity

No desire to try an alternative

We don't spread

We don't work hard enough

We just make it simple for oppositions to set up as we are so predictable.

People can suggest roos is having us stick to plans .... Hey I've got no idea on that but what I do know is when we play good sides aka hawthorn, cats, freo we will be severely exposed if we have no sense of awareness to move move move.

Guys it's not VFL you don't have time to stop and prop. This is our single biggest problem I beleive and we can thank mark neeld for entrenching that trait even worse than it may have been.

Speed and backing there skills and first decision is what required ..... Full stop !

please, we don't need any more spontibaity

Has anyone mentioned Strauss for kick ins...serious option!

was going to say the same thing, Strauss could well play next week and i still think he is above terlich and clisby in the fact he actually can stop his opponent scoring.

He has struggled at times to find the football while playing as a defender but he is still our best option when fit. IMO of course but lots of fans on here dont like him, but having said that lots of fans on here dont like lots of the players

Why Terlich often kicks in God only knows

I believe it's his busy season, what with Easter and Passover, so we're going to have to rely on Paul Roos.

I don't blame Dunn for the kick ins. I'm confident he's just following the coach's instructions and sticking to the game plan. I don't like the instructions, though.