Cannot judge him yet surely

don't judge him on his game yet.
kid needs time in Casey for sure.

These apologetic views are contrary to where we need to be.

Wines was ready.

Already a Rising Star nomination.

Record 16 contested possessions in his first game.

Big, strong, hard at it.

Wanted to come to the club.....WANTED!

Friends with our own Jack.

Alas, too late now.

These apologetic views are contrary to where we need to be.

Wines was ready.

Already a Rising Star nomination.

Record 16 contested possessions in his first game.

Big, strong, hard at it.

Wanted to come to the club.....WANTED!

Friends with our own Jack.

Alas, too late now.

Jordan Gysberts should show you that early nominations and high possession counts don't bring definites. As for friends with Jack, this is not suburban footy. It should have nothing to do with decisions made.

Time could show Wines to be the Joel Selwood of his draft though. Maybe GWS will wish they took him.

The thing with Wines is he has it. You see it, just like you see it in Viney.. Size, strength, hardness, he's a footballer and always will be. With Toumpas it's wait and see. So you can understand why Dees supporters are worried with our track record.

The Selwood of this draft already plays at MFC.

If you go back to the Wines thread youll see i was a strong advocate for Wines, simply because we lack so much in the area of centre clearances.

I do think Toumpas will be a great player though, but the situation seems fairly critical, and extra grunt in the middle is still exactly what we need.

We went down the path of skinny skilled players before , with the likes of Watts ,gysberts,Morton etc.. And it never works for us...why?

Because we cant get the bloody ball to them yet , thats why.

Fix the engine first , and the machine will start to purr.

There is a bloke named Chris Masten who cut us apart yesterday. His first few seasons he was much maligned and struggled to find the pace of afl. Get off Toumpas back you poor excuses for supporters.

There is a bloke named Chris Masten who cut us apart yesterday. His first few seasons he was much maligned and struggled to find the pace of afl. Get off Toumpas back you poor excuses for supporters.

This,

Idiots are writing him off after 3 games playing in the worst AFL side of the last 2 decades.

Give the kid a month at Casey where he will find the pill and develop and get confidence.

He'll be fine when he adjusts to the speed of the game. Give the kid time.

That said, I don't think he should be playing AFL footy yet, I think that was clear in round 1 and I don't think making him sub does much for him. Some of our development decisions are baffling IMO.

So out of his depth.

Some pretty premature calls going on in here.

The kid is out of his depth at the moment, no need to put him in the mistake basket just yet.

Morton started out getting a million touches, unlike Morton Jimmy hasn't missed a target in the few kicks he's had.

Scully and Trengove started off like a house on fire, where are these blokes at now? (Scully yesterday omg lolz$)

Jimmy looks slow, from all reports he is not, probably just overwhelmed running around is this rabble. Give him some time.

As for a first year apprentice not building you a house, Viney has half built a mansion already.

It may also take him time to get used to running again after his hip ops.

At 19 years old, he is the very least of our worries.

He'll be fine when he adjusts to the speed of the game. Give the kid time.

That said, I don't think he should be playing AFL footy yet, I think that was clear in round 1 and I don't think making him sub does much for him. Some of our development decisions are baffling IMO.

Agreed. Play him or don't.

There needs to be a meme on this thread relating to the stupidity on many of those within it.

Toumpas isn't playing at AFL tempo yet. By giving him some early games he can learn and adapt, so that when he returns to VFL he will already know what he needs to work on.

The kid has played 2 games and one as a sub in a team that's been thrashed each game, give him a break.

Hopefully he gets a stint in the VFL to dominate some games and show us just how good he is/will be

Everyone needs to lay off Toumpas. He clearly isn't ready for AFL and needs more time in the VFL. There is not a single point in labeling him as a spud. I've had it! Just bide your time and quit being so pessimistic. Its not like he's the very first person ever to play his first year of footy and look a overwhelmed by the big league. Take a chill pill.

My thoughts exactly. Give the kid room to breathe.

No we cannot judge him yet.

He is clearly not ready. Coming back from a hip injury late last year. He is long way from senior AFL football. Once again it shows the coaching staff incompetence.

Early thread I made with similar comparisons.

http://demonland.com/forums/index.php?/topic/33147-trengrovetoumpas-martinwines/#entry717862

As for a first year apprentice not building you a house, Viney has half built a mansion already.

Haha I'd call him a very good second year apprentice due to his grooming last year but point taken.

The guy runs funny, has anyone else noticed that?

Mate, how they picked him over Wines is another mystery. just another mystery that has spilled forth from the Dees!!

Toumpas sure cant run, he is so slow. Lurch in the Adams family would run him down!!

Mate, how they picked him over Wines is another mystery. just another mystery that has spilled forth from the Dees!!

Toumpas sure cant run, he is so slow. Lurch in the Adams family would run him down!!

Ok so he has had hip trouble, didnt read all reports!! i apologise, but still would have picked Wines even before I saw him in his first match

Each to their own, I think it's more recruiting.

Watts is an athlete who lacks intensity, he is very skilled - but soft and doesn't want to it enough.

Morton is the soft receiver who never really shown much, he was a good junior, because he was soft and it allows that.

Scully was an elite runner as a junior and through sheer will and determination, racked up possies and dominated.

I would not write Tom Scully off, that is something I would not do.. He has more determination than half out list put together

Toumpas is a receiver, he's never really had to do the hard things and unfortunately he has came to a club that doesn't do hard things either.

I've said it before, Toumpas is the cream to a good side, but completely useless for ours, the recruiters should've definitely taken Ollie.

Will prove a massive blunder, lets just hope Ollie wants to come home and we can do a swap at years end.... Wishful thinking.

Every single one of your observations is based on what the player has done at AFL level.

Like I said. Go back to the build ups to each of the drafts. Every single player we took (with the sole exception of Lucas Cook) was rated highly enough to be taken where they were. That rating did not come from the MFC only, but league-wide.

We did not make mistakes in taking these players. Our mistakes have been the way we have developed them.

Time could show Wines to be the Joel Selwood of his draft though. Maybe GWS will wish they took him.

The thing with Wines is he has it. You see it, just like you see it in Viney.. Size, strength, hardness, he's a footballer and always will be. With Toumpas it's wait and see. So you can understand why Dees supporters are worried with our track record.

It's just ridiculous.

Remember Daniel Rich? He 'had it' in his first year. Then he disappeared. I heard one commentator refer to his good game last night as 'finally, the return of Daniel Rich'.

Just because Wines has a bigger body than Toumpas does not make him a better player.

These apologetic views are contrary to where we need to be.

Wines was ready.

Already a Rising Star nomination.

Record 16 contested possessions in his first game.

Big, strong, hard at it.

Wanted to come to the club.....WANTED!

Friends with our own Jack.

Alas, too late now.

Why is it that anyone who disagrees with a pessimistic view is an apologist, or has an apologetic view?

You, and anyone else who uses that phrase, mistakes 'logic' for 'apologism'.

Meanwhile, Wines absolutely killing them over in the showdown.

2 goals, has unsettled Scott Thompson and managed to accidentally break Dangerfield's nose in the bloody minded pursuit of the ball in a stoppage.

These are facts and that's my logic.

Meanwhile, Wines absolutely killing them over in the showdown.

2 goals, has unsettled Scott Thompson and managed to accidentally break Dangerfield's nose in the bloody minded pursuit of the ball in a stoppage.

These are facts and that's my logic.

Said this in the other thread but i'll damn well say it again, I'M TRYING TO FORGET ABOUT A KID CALLED OLLIE WINES.

Cut the poor kid some slack. Agree he needs time at Casey but no need to take stabs at a 3rd gamer. Compare him to half our starting players, what's different? Nothing really.

Low.

Very low.