Training - Tuesday 26th March, 2013

[old dee 23,872]

Went down for a brief period today, I was there for about 30 minutes towards the end. They finished as I was walking over the Yarra bridge.

I will be surprised if T Mac does not play on Sunday.

He was in everything till I left and looked good.

Dawes did not seemed to be troubled by any injury.

Trengove and Clark we off by the time I got there.

I doubt Trengove will play on that basis.

It Watts is not the best kick in our team I will eat my hat.

Every kick I saw went straight to someone.

It did not matter if it was short , long or for a player to run on to.

If only about ten others were that good.

[Redleg 41,577]

Went down for a brief period today, I was there for about 30 minutes towards the end. They finished as I was walking over the Yarra bridge.

I will be surprised if T Mac does not play on Sunday.

He was in everything till I left and looked good.

Dawes did not seemed to be troubled by any injury.

Trengove and Clark we off by the time I got there.

I doubt Trengove will play on that basis.

It Watts is not the best kick in our team I will eat my hat.

Every kick I saw went straight to someone.

It did not matter if it was short , long or for a player to run on to.

If only about ten others were that good.

Put away the knife and fork, he is.

[Barney Rubble 1,576]

An Old Dee like you threatening to eat your hat.

I hope you have hair or another hat.

Was "Wattsy" aiming for the the player he kicked it to. (joking of course)

[stevethemanjordan 6,952]

For what it's worth Dawes and T McDonald spent far more time on the track than Clark, Trengove and Blease.

If I were a betting man I'd say Dawes and McDonald will play V port while Blease will be sub at best. Blease looked good and fast on hb/wing in the drills.

Clark and Trengove to play for Casey.

Viney had a light session.

Byrnes knows how to kick a sausage. Realky want him to kick at least 30 this year.

McKenzie and Nicholson only did a bit of kick to kick while J MacDonald only walked a lap.

Gawn participated in most of training and was the first one on the track.

Training overall was quite good, but a lot of missed targets which is why we'll only win 3-5 games.

This is why we need to weed more players out by the end of the season and bring in some quality kickers. I know it won't happen but in a perfect world for me I'd like to see McKenzie, Davis, MacDonald, Bail and Couch all gone by years end.

We may improve in other facets of the game this year but these players will never improve their kicking skills much.

[Longsufferingnomore 1,652]

Went down for a brief period today, I was there for about 30 minutes towards the end. They finished as I was walking over the Yarra bridge.

I will be surprised if T Mac does not play on Sunday.

He was in everything till I left and looked good.

Dawes did not seemed to be troubled by any injury.

Trengove and Clark we off by the time I got there.

I doubt Trengove will play on that basis.

It Watts is not the best kick in our team I will eat my hat.

Every kick I saw went straight to someone.

It did not matter if it was short , long or for a player to run on to.

If only about ten others were that good.

Old for someone who seems usually so despondent you have made a big effort to go and watch training. Alternatively did you lose your way going home and happen on training!!!

Do I detect a miniscule of enthusiasm in your observations. If so I am feeling very confident about Sunday.

[old dee 23,872]

An Old Dee like you threatening to eat your hat.

I hope you have hair or another hat.

Was "Wattsy" aiming for the the player he kicked it to. (joking of course)

Hair departed long ago Chippy, so I do have a number of hats.

Not that I would enjoy having to eat one.

I was standing there today thinking this is better than most games I have been to over the last 5 years.

90% of the players look like champions, we never lose a game and I walk back to my car

In a good mood.

[old dee 23,872]

Old for someone who seems usually so despondent you have made a big effort to go and watch training. Alternatively did you lose your way going home and happen on training!!!

Do I detect a miniscule of enthusiasm in your observations. If so I am feeling very confident about Sunday.

ls I have been to training a number of times this year.

The good part is we always look like world beaters.

Believe it or not I mostly enjoy the MFC or I would stop

I just try and keep in mind were we are at in the real world.

Reality sets in around 2.30 on Sunday.

[sue 9,145]

This is why we need to weed more players out by the end of the season and bring in some quality kickers. I know it won't happen but in a perfect world for me I'd like to see McKenzie, Davis, MacDonald, Bail and Couch all gone by years end.

We may improve in other facets of the game this year but these players will never improve their kicking skills much.

Excuse my ignorance - while I can see some are 'naturals', why is kicking the one skill which can't be improved by coaching? Genuine question.

[old dee 23,872]

This is why we need to weed more players out by the end of the season and bring in some quality kickers. I know it won't happen but in a perfect world for me I'd like to see McKenzie, Davis, MacDonald, Bail and Couch all gone by years end.

We may improve in other facets of the game this year but these players will never improve their kicking skills much.

IMHO 4 of the above will be.

3 are not up to it, 1 has large concussion problems and the other will stay because he is real tryer.

[Young Dee 1,303]

This is why we need to weed more players out by the end of the season and bring in some quality kickers. I know it won't happen but in a perfect world for me I'd like to see McKenzie, Davis, MacDonald, Bail and Couch all gone by years end.

We may improve in other facets of the game this year but these players will never improve their kicking skills much.

Don't know about McKenzie he actually has an attribute that counters for his poor disposal (tough nut/clearance king)

[old dee 23,872]

Excuse my ignorance - while I can see some are 'naturals', why is kicking the one skill which can't be improved by coaching? Genuine question.

I do not have a good answer sue except to saw that in my experience 90% of players who are poor kickers of the ball in their youth don't improve much over time.

If by your early 20's you are a poor kick chances are you won't improve.

IMO those are the odds

Don't waste time on them most won't improve by any significant degree

[Nasher 33,617]

Excuse my ignorance - while I can see some are 'naturals', why is kicking the one skill which can't be improved by coaching? Genuine question.

My recollection of the theory is that it's because by the time you're in your 20s you have done so much kicking that your action is too firmly burned in to your 'muscle memory' and it's difficult to get in enough repetitions (many thousands) in to change it. Kicking for goal is a different matter because you have time to think through your kick, but general field of play kicking is a split second thing and happens almost automatically.

I wouldn't put too much confidence in this as I'm just going off very sketchy memory, but it seems to make sense to me. I know that for me, if I'm playing "kick to kick" with someone I always guide the ball nicely down on to my foot because I know that's the best way to do it, but whenever I played I tended to do the Cam Bruce drop it from chest height thing.

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,909]

My recollection of the theory is that it's because by the time you're in your 20s you have done so much kicking that your action is too firmly burned in to your 'muscle memory' and it's difficult to get in enough repetitions (many thousands) in to change it. Kicking for goal is a different matter because you have time to think through your kick, but general field of play kicking is a split second thing and happens almost automatically.

I wouldn't put too much confidence in this as I'm just going off very sketchy memory, but it seems to make sense to me.

But don't we teach footballers to run differently (to avoid hamstring strains) and tackle differently? Golfers change their swings and tennis player improve their stroke play. It seems logical to me that with the right amount of effort players should be able to be taught to kick differently.

Having said that, I'm forever amazed at how many professional AFL players cannot kick at least reasonably on the "wrong" foot.

[old dee 23,872]

But don't we teach footballers to run differently (to avoid hamstring strains) and tackle differently? Golfers change their swings and tennis player improve their stroke play. It seems logical to me that with the right amount of effort players should be able to be taught to kick differently.

Having said that, I'm forever amazed at how many professional AFL players cannot kick at least reasonably on the "wrong" foot.

I am amazed at the number that cannot kick reasonably on the "right" foot

[old dee 23,872]

Don't know about McKenzie he actually has an attribute that counters for his poor disposal (tough nut/clearance king)

IMO young dee nothing counters for poor disposal.

Quite often it is the difference between the good teams and the poor ones.

[BarnDee 287]

Initial live update.

Around 18 watchers here for the big day.

Gary loin chop stretcher Lyon gracing us with his presence

Magically mystery players not sighted in Sylvia and Matt jones.

Clisby and Jonah Lomu's skinny cousin walking laps same as Fitzy and Joel too old McDonald.

Mckenzie and kent doing reduced training by themselves.

why do you bother ? wheres nick , ?

[BarnDee 287]

why do you bother ? wheres nick , ?

well it did improve along the way , lol

[stevethemanjordan 6,952]

I reckon Nasher and Old Dee have summed it up but going into more detail, kicking a footy comes down to ball eye coordination. It seems like there is a fair chunk of natural ability involved but the question that intrigues me is where does the natural ability come from? I don't know if it's to do with being exposed to balls from a young age or if some are born with it or if its a combination? Same can be said for kids that excel at maths and physics versus those of us who are creative etc. Left Brain development versus Right Brain development.

Those who are blessed with this natural ability or coordination seem to develop a fluent and proficient techniques when it comes to the art of kicking and those within the AFL who have beautiful kicks seem to move more gracefully and have better awareness than players without this natural ability or coordination.

Kids without this natural ability who end up being drafted seem to never quite develop a better kicking technique as its hard to break down what you've been doing for so long especially for players who are not blessed with this natural ability. They never learnt how to kick the ball well from whenever they started to play so its near impossible for them to re-learn a technique whilst at a club. McKenzie will never improve his kicking much and neither will Bail alongside a host of others on our list.

However as people say, McKenzie was picked up for a reason. Attitude and work ethic. Which is why we see him fly in at the contest so often. Bail got a spot on a list because of his aerobic ability. He is a great runner. We have had far too many on our list who have had one or two standout attributes but kicking has been one of their weaknesses. We need to start picking up kids that are more well rounded players and natural sportsmen.

When you get a player with natural ability and coordination come in to your club along with several other strong attributes, you know you have a star on your hands. Cotchin is my favourite player to watch because he fits that description to a tee. He would beat Mckenzie in a contested scenario, burn him in a flash and deliver to the [censored] of reiwoldt before we knew what had happened. Same with Cyril.

If Jack Watts had the same desire and urgency about him when it comes to winning the pill, he would be a star of the comp as he has all the natural ability in the world.

Apologies for the rant.

[Dan Fantastik 50]

Not saying that our players will improve there kicking to an elite level, however it is a skill that a few players are able to greatly improve on. Nathan Jones was able to improve his kicking hugely over the past 2-3 seasons. Same can be said for Brownlow medalist Jobe Watson.

[stevethemanjordan 6,952]

Not saying that our players will improve there kicking to an elite level, however it is a skill that a few players are able to greatly improve on. Nathan Jones was able to improve his kicking hugely over the past 2-3 seasons. Same can be said for Brownlow medalist Jobe Watson.

In my view it was Jones' decision making that improved. He has always been able to hit targets, it's just he used to bomb it aimlessly a lot of the time. He has learnt to lower his eyes and now makes much better decisions when in possession.

Not a technique thing of you ask me. His technique is fine. Look at his set shots.

Edited March 26, 2013 by stevethemanjordan

[binman 43,835]

In my view it was Jones' decision making that improved. He has always been able to hit targets, it's just he used to bomb it aimlessly a lot of the time. He has learnt to lower his eyes and now makes much better decisions when in possession.

Not a technique thing of you ask me. His technique is fine. Look at his set shots.

I largely agree - however i would say that Jones increased the length of his kicks substantially, which is partly technique.

[dee-luded 2,959]

For what it's worth Dawes and T McDonald spent far more time on the track than Clark, Trengove and Blease.

If I were a betting man I'd say Dawes and McDonald will play V port while Blease will be sub at best. Blease looked good and fast on hb/wing in the drills.

Clark and Trengove to play for Casey.

Viney had a light session.

Byrnes knows how to kick a sausage. Realky want him to kick at least 30 this year.

McKenzie and Nicholson only did a bit of kick to kick while J MacDonald only walked a lap.

Gawn participated in most of training and was the first one on the track.

Training overall was quite good, but a lot of missed targets which is why we'll only win 3-5 games.

I'm anticipating somewhere between 4 & 8 wins... at this stage.

anything more will be a bonus IMO, after the last few years.

[stevethemanjordan 6,952]

I largely agree - however i would say that Jones increased the length of his kicks substantially, which is partly technique.

Penetration and distance come from strong quads which obviously comes from having pre season after pre season in the gym. I honestly don't see any technique change with the jones of now compared to the jones of 2005. Edited March 26, 2013 by stevethemanjordan

[waynewussell 6,242]

I've noted that quite a few long kickers were on the skinny side... Robert Flower, Michael Tuck etc. I think this is the result of timing/co-ordination and extension (having a longer follow through). So, long kicking is not solely the demain of strong quads, though I acknowledge this can be a plus.

[rpfc 28,784]

You can get better at kicking if you think you need to get better at kicking. I have seen it with my own two eyes up here in Canberra. The ones prepared to do the work and humble enough to listen have become excellent kicks.

Decision making under pressure is where we fall down. That is harder to fix and involves training and confidence, but ultimately requires you to play the game to get better.