Sums up 'Land and MFC supporters in general doesn't it? We've copped it for so long and we're so depressed. Other supporters often rate our players (the good ones at least) much better than we do. Is it our expectations or our disappointment with the last 6 years that cause it do you think? Winning games is the great cure all, but geez I'm really sick of how much effort some people who apparently support the Dees go to to bag out our players, admin, and club in general.

Stuie after the last six years it is fairly evident that at the end of 2012 we had what maybe the worst list in the AFL.

That being the case there were not many on the list we could describe as good and above.

So it was not hard to find poor players.

Grimes is one of our better players, where he is best played is the $64 question.

I think off the half back line but while we have very few midfield players I think he will be played there

for better or worse.

Stuie after the last six years it is fairly evident that at the end of 2012 we had what maybe the worst list in the AFL.

That being the case there were not many on the list we could describe as good and above.

So it was not hard to find poor players.

Grimes is one of our better players, where he is best played is the $64 question.

I think off the half back line but while we have very few midfield players I think he will be played there

for better or worse.

Don't get me wrong OD, I don't think we have an awesome list by any stretch, but i think we're focusing our angst on the wrong guys.

Lately, these are the players everyone has been bagging: Grimes, Watts, McKenzie, Tapscott. Those guys are 23, 21, 22, and 21. Sure, none of them have set the world on fire YET, but in most other teams they would be developing players not the crux of a team.

IMO we should be putting the pressure on guys like Sylvia, Jamar, Davey, Frawley, Garland, and Dunn to carry the team instead.

Binman......I might be one of the usual suspects...but I enjoy the sport of it...

God this constant bickering is boring guys.

Can we all leave our problems in the bottom draw and discuss Grimes.

I don't care how much you dislike each other.

Forlorn hope I suppose

What and miss out on your posts, no not really, bit rich coming from you OD, like I get told, don't read it........just trying to defend one of the captains of MFC....shield at the ready

Still a major problem with comprehension by many on this site.

There is a major difference between "assessing" a player in a frank and honest manner and "bagging".

Some great contributions by some good footy observers on Grimes. Glenn Archer was a fairly effective straight line player along with countless other great backmen.

Grimes is a natural backman, the sooner we can afford to get him back there the better.

Don't get me wrong OD, I don't think we have an awesome list by any stretch, but i think we're focusing our angst on the wrong guys.

Lately, these are the players everyone has been bagging: Grimes, Watts, McKenzie, Tapscott. Those guys are 23, 21, 22, and 21. Sure, none of them have set the world on fire YET, but in most other teams they would be developing players not the crux of a team.

IMO we should be putting the pressure on guys like Sylvia, Jamar, Davey, Frawley, Garland, and Dunn to carry the team instead.

I think I have had my share bagging some from both groups stuie.

IMO in 2007 we had a poor group of experienced senior players, during the bailey era we seemed to put onto our list wave after wave of kids and the expense of older players.

The result by 2012 was very few good senior players and a whole bunch of kids.

A large number of those kids have proved to be not up to the job and a few that are left have not shown to be what was hoped so far.

I think there are couple left that won't make it and a few that will be good players at best.

Our list has a long way to go yet.

At the start of 2013 I hope I am surprised but I do not see one "game changer" amongst the list.

Lets hope a few surprise me.

I think we will see another large number of changes at the end of this year and some you suggest will be for the high jump.

The hardest part is watching this progression because the last 5 years have been the most painful I have witnessed for the majority of the last 48 years.

And I think that explains why a number of demonlanders are so frustrated with our lack of improvement.

Someone is to blame and it is not us out here on the outside of the fence.

Binman......I might be one of the usual suspects...but I enjoy the sport of it...

What ever floats your boat i suppose.

I agree with you DemonWA but I don't think he is a midfield player.

I think he is being used there because we have bugger all alternatives.

Not sure myself 'old', last year was his first real hit up in the middle and first almost injury free season. Would like to see some further development this season and also see how his kicking is with some forward targets.

What ever floats your boat i suppose.

Binman, not so much as float my boat, as a more senior citiizen, wasn't really into the social media thingy until I discovered this site and twitter a couple of years ago.

Being a Melbourne supporter it gives me an outlet, not like some to make me feel important or to vent some spleen, but to discuss in a sensible manner the Footy Club.

As you can see from my posts not really into the 'bagging' of players, we all watch the games and we have all seen the performances of the last couple of years, bit pointless in my view to either keep rehashing or assuming we are going to see more of the same before a real ball has been kicked in anger

This topic is about a player who as another poster says, non MFC supporters rate and the MFC Footy Dept must as well as they have made him co-captain, the sometimes rather spiteful way some posters opinions are expressed can annoy me, they are entitled to that but also to have my 'opinion' given as well

If a poster like BH, who seems to think the rest of us are beneath him, makes a post asserting what he thinks to be a totally correct assessment of Jack Grimes, then other posters are allowed to disagree

I actually have to listen to similar during the games, from so called supporters who in between going to bar to refuel with the overpriced and watered down alcohol at the G, spend 2 hrs shouting abuse at "their" team......I sometimes wonder if it is to cover their own percieved inadequacies

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2013-03-14/waters-v-grimes

Grimes gets a nice review in this article!

Boy does this thread need to be cleaned up.

This thread is called 'Jack Grimes'...

And I don't know how many times I have to say this of 'a 10 year member' in BH - but mods can you please tell him to keep his politics off the Footy board?

I don't care what people who think rationally say about politics so I certainly don't care about what BH says.

It sounds like Ben Hur must have a 10 year membership pin. Thats fantastic.

Maybe he can change his monika to Needles to reflect the achievement.

I'm hoping he can get through at least one game this year without kicking it out on the full.

Its hard to kick it out on the full when you are playing in the middle of the ground

I'm not at all offended by Ben Hur's posts. But if you are the forum has a block function for a reason

What and miss out on your posts, no not really, bit rich coming from you OD, like I get told, don't read it........just trying to defend one of the captains of MFC....shield at the ready

I am not suggesting you don't defend Grimes Sat.

I was just railing against constant personal attacks that have little to do with the thread.

I don't mind what position any one holds about almost any subject.

But slagging each other off is like two little kids in primary school calling each other names.

Surely we are a little above that level.

I'm not at all offended by Ben Hur's posts. But if you are the forum has a block function for a reason

Yes, but I am not so little as to block someone based on the occassional post that offends the senses.

I appreciate the views of the vast majority of the community here, including what BH has to say about football. Some of it is incomplete, and self-admittedly unevolved, but I am not going to pretend he doesn't exist because at times he can be onerous.

I appreciate all my subjects.

Yes, but I am not so little as to block someone based on the occassional post that offends the senses.

I appreciate the views of the vast majority of the community here, including what BH has to say about football. Some of it is incomplete, and self-admittedly unevolved, but I am not going to pretend he doesn't exist because at times he can be onerous.

I appreciate all my subjects.

Very gracious of you oh great one .

Your subjects are forever indebted.

Its hard to kick it out on the full when you are playing in the middle of the ground

If there's a way for it to happen, JG will find it jnr.

Yes, but I am not so little as to block someone based on the occassional post that offends the senses.

I appreciate the views of the vast majority of the community here, including what BH has to say about football. Some of it is incomplete, and self-admittedly unevolved, but I am not going to pretend he doesn't exist because at times he can be onerous.

I appreciate all my subjects.

Totally agree, i wouldnt ever use the block function either

you cant say reading topic after topic of people crying at each other doesnt get old though

I'm not sure it is really possible yet to say that JG is best suited to one particular position, or to say that he is an poor, average or good player. This is based simply on the fact he has not yet had a decent stretch of games injury free in which we could possibly give a valid case one way or the other. By decent stretch, I mean at least 2 seasons with a couple of uninterrupted preseasons. Neeld rates him highly and his team mates wanted him as captain, to me that's the best indication so far of his value. I'm looking forward to watching him become a very good player (injury free) over the next 2-3 years

Have to say I agree with BH, Dandeeman, OldDee and others on Grimes. He's a natural backman. That's where he belongs, floating courageously in front of forwards to intercept, followed by dashing penetrating runs. The chink in his armour back there until now has been his overuse of dinky sideways kicks. There's a time and place for those, but I'd much rather see him take blokes on, spot up a Dawes or a Clark and hoof it long to advantage. He has the tools to be a modern day Alan Johnson.

But that'll have to wait. He is absolutely needed in the middle for 2013 and probably for most of 2014 while the young turks develop. I expect him to provide capable support to Jones but he'll never be a top-tier midfielder for reasons stated by others. But he can be B to B+ and that's okay.

Edited March 14, 201312 yr by Range Rover