Just call me Kermit. My favourite time of year is pre season. We haven't lost a game, i'm always full of hope. My experience in following the dees has been the season usually provides more than its fair share of reality checks so i'm sticking with 11 wins in a row to start the year.

Love your optimism and hope its true.

You did say "After 5 years of rebuliding..."

First round for 2012 for MEL is 31 March when year 5 starts. And the rebuild only started in October 2007. I know thats not your reality though.

yes we are into the 5th year that's right...

Agreed. So its not "After 5 years of rebuilding..." Its not like you to walk away from a statement WYL.

I have us at 2-9 with wins over Brisbane and Richmond. Many posters here were still in nappies the last time we beat Bulldogs and St Kilda while Essendon will be a bloody tough game.

The good news is that we'll come home with a leg in the air with games against GWSx 2 and Crows, Power and GC as very winnable.

I think we'll go 7-15 next year but be more of a satisfying year than last.

2 wins i have a bit of faith that neeld can beat that.

But it is always "in a few years time" that is my point.

Results start in 2012 & beyond for me.

2011 was a big "wakey wakey" IMO. Our list is better than that.

We have been mediocre for so long that even the most one eyed supporter finds it hard to believe we can really improve.

That is why i was pleased to read Mclardy's comments in the Age on Saturday.

Let's not forget that we have a new coach setting a new agenda, new clear objectives, new personnel, new methods. Development is still gaining traction (some may argue this) and we still lack class in the midfield. I'd happily take a 5-6 result for the first half return, given the opposition and recognising where we're at. It could well turn out as some have suggested - ie 2-9 return.

Our list is only as good as our results tell us. Based on 2011, it's simply mediocre and considered far too inconsistent and lacking leadership. That's the reality. Hopefully that will change for the better.

I think anyone looking for 7+ wins in the first half are putting far too much unrealistic expectations on the team. That's top 4 contender return stuff. Take it if it comes and be pleasantly surprised if it occurred, but I very much doubt it.

Barring horrendous injury ,I'm expecting a HUGE improvement this year .

Yeah but we just wasted 4 years

Let's not forget that we have a new coach setting a new agenda, new clear objectives, new personnel, new methods. Development is still gaining traction (some may argue this) and we still lack class in the midfield. I'd happily take a 5-6 result for the first half return, given the opposition and recognising where we're at. It could well turn out as some have suggested - ie 2-9 return.

Our list is only as good as our results tell us. Based on 2011, it's simply mediocre and considered far too inconsistent and lacking leadership. That's the reality. Hopefully that will change for the better.

I think anyone looking for 7+ wins in the first half are putting far too much unrealistic expectations on the team. That's top 4 contender return stuff. Take it if it comes and be pleasantly surprised if it occurred, but I very much doubt it.

That's a fair call. I am not expecting miracles. But i do believe there are far more 50/50 games in the first 11 than many are giving this list credit for. And yes i acknowledge the opponent also wants a win.

2-9 is not acceptable, but is possible. But it will mean things are not right.

After last years "Bruise Free" games. Carlton are a beatable team at the'G.

actually I agree, I'd like to think that we now get 5 and not four wins BL, Tigers, Bombers, Pies.

but remain scared of the dogs, hawks and saints.

if we beat WCE I am deleting my vote and backing us for the eight.

as for midfield we are sparse on rolls royces but I think Neeld has a plan for this, its not going to be pretty but at least we'll see more of the players as they trudge it around the boundary line.

actually I agree, I'd like to think that we now get 5 and not four wins BL, Tigers, Bombers, Pies.

but remain scared of the dogs, hawks and saints.

if we beat WCE I am deleting my vote and backing us for the eight.

as for midfield we are sparse on rolls royces but I think Neeld has a plan for this, its not going to be pretty but at least we'll see more of the players as they trudge it around the boundary line.

Hey if we win games with low scores i will be rapt. That builds a team. Everyone is working hard particularly in defence.

That's a fair call. I am not expecting miracles. But i do believe there are far more 50/50 games in the first 11 than many are giving this list credit for. And yes i acknowledge the opponent also wants a win.

2-9 is not acceptable, but is possible. But it will mean things are not right.

It will mean that there has been no improvement, rather regression since last season.

I can't believe that every other team has the scope to improve as much as the Demons. Aside from listeneing to Melbourne radio (being Perth based) I read all available media about the club and peruse with adequate enough interest that of other clubs. I consider the changes at MFC in comparison to other clubs much more significant and I have faith that they will deliver results a lot faster than many think.

I can see four wins here. I really hope that we step up a little more than I expect and pinch a couple more, but on what I've seen so far I give us Brisbane, Richmond, Bullogs and Essendon. I'd like to say we can take the swans, but I think they'll just be hitting their stride by then. The Saints aren't going to slide anywhere near as much as people are saying, so I can't see us toppling them. I think there are a couple of smokies in there. While I don't like us against the Swans, we might knock them over. Carlton could turn into something of a grudge match if we play up the"bruise-free" angle, but ti think they have too much quality on the park for us atm.

Obviously things can change in a heartbeat if key players go down in any of these sides, so it's all speculative right now.

I have us at 2-9 with wins over Brisbane and Richmond. Many posters here were still in nappies the last time we beat Bulldogs and St Kilda while Essendon will be a bloody tough game.

The good news is that we'll come home with a leg in the air with games against GWSx 2 and Crows, Power and GC as very winnable.

I think we'll go 7-15 next year but be more of a satisfying year than last.

I have us at 2 wins beating brisbane and the doggies. It's been a great off season but the new game plan will take plenty of time and there is no way we can realistically say that we can beat a top 5 team in carlton. Tigers game is a coin flip, bombers game not so much if they have a full list and sydney is always going to be a hard ask.

Of course we can beat a top 5 team . We expect to be a top 5 team .

Thanks for the range of opinions and reasons for our start to the season fellow posters - very informative.

My 2 win assessment was Brisbane and Richmond (just).

My approach is always that we can win any game, but I was trying to take an impartial assessment at a very early stage.

I am certainly hoping that we can do much better than 2 wins, but my underlying reason for my original post was that we shouldn't become negative if it is a slow start to the year - the journey to the top is a long one with a lot of learning along the way - just look at any of the recent successful teams.

I just think it's going to take longer to turn the ship around than what people are imagining. Just seeing Clark run in and spoil Watts, or those easy goals over the back to GC as a result of getting the structures and press wrong - sure, like many, I believe that we have the cattle to start moving forward. But they need to learn to play together - which is going to take time.

People talk about Richmond's midfield - those guys are starting to have a few seasons together, and under the same coach.

2 wins for me, but then the second half of the season should start to see things come together ... as long as we don't get any/many injuries to key players.

I ended up with 6 wins.

But realistically I would be happy with 4-6.

I remember doing something like this last Oct-Nov.

And coming up with 3-4 in the first half but finishing with about 9 in the 2nd half.

That would mean about 12-13 total (7th or 8th position)

That would make me extremely happy!

cowboy_from_hell, on 27 February 2012 - 07:26 PM, said:

I have us at 2 wins beating brisbane and the doggies. It's been a great off season but the new game plan will take plenty of time and there is no way we can realistically say that we can beat a top 5 team in carlton. Tigers game is a coin flip, bombers game not so much if they have a full list and sydney is always going to be a hard ask.

bing181, on 27 February 2012 - 09:16 PM, said:

I just think it's going to take longer to turn the ship around than what people are imagining. Just seeing Clark run in and spoil Watts, or those easy goals over the back to GC as a result of getting the structures and press wrong - sure, like many, I believe that we have the cattle to start moving forward. But they need to learn to play together - which is going to take time.

People talk about Richmond's midfield - those guys are starting to have a few seasons together, and under the same coach.

2 wins for me, but then the second half of the season should start to see things come together ... as long as we don't get any/many injuries to key players.

If you think like this you have a very low view of our side we have 16 top 20 draft picks along with some really good rookies we should really be looking to stop thinking like we are along way off or less than any side between 4th and 8th we have alot of talent and now the best football department in the game that will finally bring structure and dare i say it a strong culture with great young men as leaders i can see why you can think like that but teams like the bulldogs and saints have had there chance its our time to shine and as for the tigers we need to put them were they belong below us. Our rise is starting in 2012 top 8 and nothing less jump on board the glory train boys and girls. THE DEMONS ARE HUNGRY............cant wait First course is roast magpie Main course is fried swan wings and for dessert blues berry ice cream and dont forget to scully your giant beer.

P.S scully can pick up the tab when your done

Considering they Carlscum were tanking around the same time that we were percieved to be doing the same thing. I don't think we should be way behind Carlscum at all. Yes they are ahead but not by that much.

If you want to know why we are behind Carlton look at our use of top5 picks compared to them

Judd (was worth 2 picks) Murphy, Kruezer, Gibbs, Walker

Watts, McLean, Sylvia, Trengove, Scully, Morton

If you want to know why we are behind Carlton look at our use of top5 picks compared to them

Judd (was worth 2 picks) Murphy, Kruezer, Gibbs, Walker

Watts, McLean, Sylvia, Trengove, Scully, Morton

Yes i know. We took a hit there. Carlscum have got maximum bang out of those picks, but i still believe a well taught and fit MFC midfield can still do some damage, and i rate our defence better than the blues. It won't be easy, but i refuse to mark it as an automatic loss.

Yes i know. We took a hit there. Carlscum have got maximum bang out of those picks, but i still believe a well taught and fit MFC midfield can still do some damage, and i rate our defence better than the blues. It won't be easy, but i refuse to mark it as an automatic loss.

I hate carlton so me 2

If you want to know why we are behind Carlton look at our use of top5 picks compared to them

Judd (was worth 2 picks) Murphy, Kruezer, Gibbs, Walker

Watts, McLean, Sylvia, Trengove, Scully, Morton

Epic fail.....

Its going to be a good start to the season I believe if we keep to our structures. All of the good work will come undone when we play Geelong. I think that Sydney is a possibility. Strong side yes but still vulnerable on their day and we seem to match up very well with them, just look at our past 2 fixtures. A win against the Blues would be good but atm it is unrealistic. Essendon should be a win as we have a knack of beating them these days which I love cos I hate their two faced supporters. Then the Pies. Queens Birthday will be a real big game this year with a real pre game banter match between both clubs and McGuire will go on and on about how much we've poached their staff and Neeld knows the gameplan like the back of his hand so we could be a rough chance of a win. 6 wins would be great. Under 4 would be a terrible start and question marks will begin to be raised.

Should be a great 12 or so rounds to see where the club is at and how effective our structures and gameplan is against quality and mid tiered teams. But as someone else said I think it may be a week by week poroposition. Go Dees! The first real test begins this Sat. Night just quietly.....

Epic fail.....

In relation to our drafting or the opinion of the poster because I believe that he is right. We still need another classy midfielder and if results this year improve watch out Scott Pendlebury........ I know its a big call but with Green more than likely on his last year and cloggers like Spencer and Dunn moving on I think that a really big trade move will again be on the cards because of large cap room. Gee i love it when speculation surrounds opposition players.....

I got 6, but only because I cannot bring myself to think that we will lose to the scum of the earth Carlton. Again.

If we win one match the whole year, please please please let it be against those arrogant filth.

I don't think St Kilda or the Dogs are in for a good season, so we're a good chance.

Geelong, WCE, Collingwood and Hawthorn are almost guaranteed losses, and Sydney seem set for another good year, so that's a probable loss too.

Hoping to best Richmond, Brisbane, Saints, Dogs and Essendon. Carlton the priority though.