Conspiracy Theory

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

There is a difference between tanking and winning not being your top priority. Any time a team "plays the kids", winning is not their top priority.

[Redleg 40,858]

If I may have a go at answering your question. And for those of you who are still scratching your heads ...

1. My estimation is that alarm bells were going off at the club around about the time $cully flew the coop in China. Surely someone at the MFC would've twigged to the correlation between his homecoming and the GW$ window for talking to uncontracted players.

2. Nothing can be proven of course, but then you have Eddie McGuire coming out in March with his on-air rumour mongering setting the whole publicity train in motion.

3. The club, now seriously worried (but still in the dark), confronts the player who - on the instruction of his manager - lies to Stynes and Schwab is then pressured into making that ill-advised press conference.

4. A few weeks go by and, presumably having difficulty looking at himself in the mirror having lied to a football legend battling cancer, $cully comes clean in a private meeting with Stynes and a select few club brass. My guess is that this happened as early as May.

5. The MFC, gobsmacked that it has been blindsided in such spectacular fashion, goes into damage control. They are cool-headed enough to understand the ramifications of the situation and so we play out the charade accordingly. Our only interest from there on in was to lobby for the highest band of compensation, while keeping individual reputations (including their own) intact.

6. How do we go about doing this? We manufacture a phony $3 million/5 year offer for the player, showing how massively we rate $cully and then have it leaked to the media (which has already had details of GW$ $5 million offer leaked to it). In addition, Schwab goes into bat for $cully live on SEN, defending the guy's reputation ... an act mirrored by $cully's manager who gives a bizarre set of interviews doing exactly the same thing.

7. Finally, we witness the final scene in the whole sorry drama, complete with the bogus 'last minute upping of the offer' from GW$ and intelligence-insulting 'touring of the facilities' by the boy wonder himself.

8. Schwab goes before the cameras to hammer home our case for compensation, careful not to bite the AFL hand that feeds him but insistent that $cully will become the highest paid player in history and therefore we deserve top tier compo (which we are duly awarded, as much for playing along with Vlad's Circus as we are for actually being dudded of our number one draft pick).

* Someone above alluded to the fact that the MFC have remained eerily silent on events that have unfolded in recent weeks. I think the version of events I've given above would explain why.

That also makes sense. Fits in with mine nicely.

[daisycutter 29,605]

If you really want a conspiracy theory then there is evidence that HWFUA was secretly planned from birth to be a GWS player. It seems his parents even timed his birth to ensure he would end up being a Giants player. It is no coincidence that his birthdate of 15.5.1991 (15+5+1991= 2011=4) sums to the exact numeric value as do the initials GWS ( 7+23+19=49=13=4). This family has been planning this for a very long time. Shoddy, Grubby and Dimwit were just pawns in a bigger conspiracy.

[Chelly 810]

That also makes sense. Fits in with mine nicely.

Agreed.

Helps me understand some of the things I've heard which were used to explain Scully's abrupt departure from the China tour. Even explains the incredible comment by Alistair Lynch in mid season on On The Couch that Demon fans should be feeling optimistic about the Scully situation. Just another part of the Great Deception.

We're best off to get rid of him. On Footy Classified Grant Thomas started to make a comment about how aloof Scully was, that he had few friends at the club and even commented about the lack of Demons invited to his 20th (what a pi55 up that would have been). Garry Lyon put a stop to that very quickly.

I wonder if our role in the conspiracy was influenced by our knowledge of the prognosis on Scully's knee.

PS: My surname is Zapruder and I was born inside the Texas Book Depository on 22 November, 1963.

[Chook 15,012]

SCULLY (About this thread): That's ridiculous, Mulder! There is nothing to support that. I'll buy that Scully wanted to leave, but to say that he planned it years in advance - it's, it's crazy!

[Lutz 76]

I don't think there's any merit in the theory that Demetriou think he "owes us" and targeted us for having to publicly defend us in allegations against tanking.

But I do believe it removed any real desire to defend us against having Scully taken by GWS (possibly because he knew GWS had already set their strategy on poaching him before it occurred to us he may be a target, or even before he was on the list), or to give us any equitable compensation.

Whether reasonable or not, I think he adopted an attitude of "you made your bed, now lie in it."

In any case, I don't really care.

I think there's every chance the players we get with compo picks could outweigh what we've lost.

Especially if we can trade them to GWS for a kid like Jack Martin.

Any puerile desire to prevent GWS from ending up with the picks doesn't interest me one iota - it's all about the best net result for MFC and MFC alone.

[Swampfox 190]

I'm sorry, but this thread screams 'MOON LANDING WAS FAKED!!!' to me. Let's all just get on with our lives and leave Tom Scully to his comfortable, likely chaste - and certainly sober - life.

Moon Landing was not faked

I was the cameraman

As for Scully

I am over it loooooong ago

Be funny if Patton was a Demon in 3 years

Hmm wonder what his dad does

[Bossdog 2,002]

When were these games?? 3&4 years ago Move on

[Harrisonrules 273]

This suggestion is a wayward theory and just shows how badly we can all begin to imagine things when we are duded by someone. However, what I would support is a criticism of Vlad because he has slowly changed the entire ethos of the AFL so that collectively people can so unwittingly misuse a system that examples like the Scully debacle can happen. Vlad is responsible for the horses bolting and it was way beyond him to draw them back in. In this ethos the Scully's were able to get far to far ahead of themselves and the offers were far to good for themselves to knock the opportunities back. They were not the type of characters who could see the problems that would ensue. They will get their fill but at a price. Their reputations have been sullied and they will have to live with the knowledge that others will always find a way to speak ill of them. In my opinion the conspiracy theory is way off but it was certainly an incompetancy issue on Demetriou's part.

[Macca 16,941]

If I may have a go at answering your question. And for those of you who are still scratching your heads ...

1. My estimation is that alarm bells were going off at the club around about the time $cully flew the coop in China. Surely someone at the MFC would've twigged to the correlation between his homecoming and the GW$ window for talking to uncontracted players.

2. Nothing can be proven of course, but then you have Eddie McGuire coming out in March with his on-air rumour mongering setting the whole publicity train in motion.

3. The club, now seriously worried (but still in the dark), confronts the player who - on the instruction of his manager - lies to Stynes and Schwab is then pressured into making that ill-advised press conference.

4. A few weeks go by and, presumably having difficulty looking at himself in the mirror having lied to a football legend battling cancer, $cully comes clean in a private meeting with Stynes and a select few club brass. My guess is that this happened as early as May.

5. The MFC, gobsmacked that it has been blindsided in such spectacular fashion, goes into damage control. They are cool-headed enough to understand the ramifications of the situation and so we play out the charade accordingly. Our only interest from there on in was to lobby for the highest band of compensation, while keeping individual reputations (including their own) intact.

6. How do we go about doing this? We manufacture a phony $3 million/5 year offer for the player, showing how massively we rate $cully and then have it leaked to the media (which has already had details of GW$ $5 million offer leaked to it). In addition, Schwab goes into bat for $cully live on SEN, defending the guy's reputation ... an act mirrored by $cully's manager who gives a bizarre set of interviews doing exactly the same thing.

7. Finally, we witness the final scene in the whole sorry drama, complete with the bogus 'last minute upping of the offer' from GW$ and intelligence-insulting 'touring of the facilities' by the boy wonder himself.

8. Schwab goes before the cameras to hammer home our case for compensation, careful not to bite the AFL hand that feeds him but insistent that $cully will become the highest paid player in history and therefore we deserve top tier compo (which we are duly awarded, as much for playing along with Vlad's Circus as we are for actually being dudded of our number one draft pick).

* Someone above alluded to the fact that the MFC have remained eerily silent on events that have unfolded in recent weeks. I think the version of events I've given above would explain why.

Your theory points the finger firmly at our Club as being complicit in the whole $cully affair . It means that our Club has been telling lies just so we could get the same compensation picks as Geelong ( which , according to the rules we were always going to get anyway ) . Your theory makes our Club just as guilty as the $cully's , Vlad etc etc .

Our Clubs silence on this matter is typical of how we have usually operated in the past . We are not exactly a "Loud" , "Out there" Club .

It all sounds good on paper but it means that Jimmy , Schwab . Connolly , McLardy , Lyon , Bailey , Viney and the players have all been lying since May .

We all now know that T$ is a liar . A pathological one at that . And these types rarely come clean . I reckon if T$ had told the Club as early as May that he was leaving he might have made reference to it by now . In fact T$ still maintains his original story and denies that he knew of his father's signing .

It's fair to say that the Club might have had a strong inkling something was up ( just like many fans ) but I don't believe we were complicit . I genuinely believe that the Club was prepared for the worst without knowing for sure . This explains the Schwab press conference .

The red herring is $cully's dad - nobody saw that coming . $cully ran the risk of the "Old man" being exposed if he came clean in May . $cully would have been under unstruction from GW$ , his management and his father to say nothing .

T$ lied right from day 1 ( whenever that was ? ) and never came clean in my opinion .

Edited November 27, 2011 by Nuggets

[Cheesy D. Pun 1,762]

I'm not saying that the moon landing was fake but for anyone who is interested, it is on the record that Stanley Kubrick gave NASA the designs for their astronaut suits and did some post production on the footage (adding US flags to the suits etc.) in return for the use of NASA's special space camera to use on 2001: A Space Odyssey.

[rpfc 28,271]

We are ekeing every last bit out of the HWFUA (i like it DC) Saga...

We lost a talented player because of our issues, the poor character of a family and kid, and the lax rules that surrounds the expansion clubs recruiting.

Not some overblown conspiracy borne out of our tanking. We need no punishment for something that Hawthorn and Collingwood got a flag out of and Carlton got Judd out of.

Our issues left us bereft

[rpfc 28,271]

We are ekeing every last bit out of the HWFUA (i like it DC) Saga...

We lost a talented player because of our issues, the poor character of a family and kid, and the lax rules that surrounds the expansion clubs recruiting.

Not some overblown conspiracy borne out of our tanking. We need no punishment for something that Hawthorn and Collingwood got a flag out of and Carlton got Judd out of.

Our issues left us bereft of any chance to keep someone whose father was pushing out the door, but those issues led us to getting a strong former captain to give us a rudder and an impressive coaching setup and the chance to grab a tall forward that we have been crying out for.

Stop searching for excuses, face the fact that we lost someone and realize that we might just be better off for the Saga.

[dee-luded 2,959]

For all you conspiracy theorists who enjoy these, here is one to consider.

Could the AFL have masterminded the whole Scully scenario from the very time he was first chosen by Melbourne at the draft. Demetriou was clearly sick of defending tanking and it really hit the headlines as a result of some of our performances. He orchestrates GWS taking him away from us and we get compo picks that while ok are not the real worth of what was lost, a number 1 draft pick player two years into his development.

The headlines early on when Scully announces he is off are massive publicity for the new club and he hurts Melbourne for blatant tanking. He then praises an illegal act by the GWS in trying to hide the father's contract with GWS at a heavily inflated price and duration, even though the league investigator has called the deal a total sham.

It all has a ring of truth to it now, doesn't it?

But what if he was a failure, Dud?

I think most likely it happened that Sheedy, SOS & GWS watched all young players of good character and ability who would be learders, and decided soon after who they would approach. I think the first was Dustin Martin with his strength and Polynesian heritage, plus tatts. Would have been a good fit. Unless that was a red herring?

So when GWS decided on Who they wanted, The AFL would give all support to the fledgling club.

I'm glad he's gone.

We'll be better off ourselves for it all & 2 picks.

[Sir Why You Little 36,990]

We are ekeing every last bit out of the HWFUA (i like it DC) Saga...

We lost a talented player because of our issues, the poor character of a family and kid, and the lax rules that surrounds the expansion clubs recruiting.

Not some overblown conspiracy borne out of our tanking. We need no punishment for something that Hawthorn and Collingwood got a flag out of and Carlton got Judd out of.

Our issues left us bereft of any chance to keep someone whose father was pushing out the door, but those issues led us to getting a strong former captain to give us a rudder and an impressive coaching setup and the chance to grab a tall forward that we have been crying out for.

Stop searching for excuses, face the fact that we lost someone and realize that we might just be better off for the Saga.

This saga was well under way before any MFC "issues" presented themselves. In fact the $cully issue may have caused most of them. It will be interesting in future years if Bails decides to tell his side of the story. Even after he left he told the media $cully would be a 10 year player. A very diplomatic man is Dean, but as head coach he would have known more.

[Hellaintabadplacetobe 4,294]

Interesting post Range Rover!

2 other events are also intriguing.

1)The swiftness of AA to sweep DBs tanking comments at his dismissal press conference under the carpet!

2) The press conference mid season that MFC reportedly asked TS to hold which he declined?

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,706]

If you have a choice between conspiracy and [censored]-up, go with [censored]-up every time.

I'm not saying conspiracies don't occur. Of course they do. But if you spend all your time looking for conspiracies, you'll end up wasting a lot of time and energy.

So, by all means those who want to can continue to imagine a conspiracy. I'll just accept it was a [censored]-up.

[rpfc 28,271]

This saga was well under way before any MFC "issues" presented themselves. In fact the $cully issue may have caused most of them. It will be interesting in future years if Bails decides to tell his side of the story. Even after he left he told the media $cully would be a 10 year player. A very diplomatic man is Dean, but as head coach he would have known more.

Wait, what?

HWFUA is to blame for our other issues?

Well, here we go.

Sweep all your problems to the door of the Dishonest Simpletons and we all sleep well at night...

A whole confuence of events occurred that led us to losing a talented young player. But let's not kid ourselves that we didn't play a role in that.

And I am not alluding to the nonsense that we played a part in some grand charade, I am talking about the fact that we had enormous issues within the club that led us to ask Garry Lyon for some direction and assistance.

Those issues, plus the AFL's desire for expansion, plus $2m, plus a lack of moral backbone of one Punxsutawney Phil, and the naivete and lack of character of a young fool led us to the situation we found ourselves in.

The conspiracy is great copy - it's a good read.

But let's not let ourselves off the hook by blaming The Grand Conspiracy on all our troubles...

Edited November 27, 2011 by rpfc

[Range Rover 1,935]

Wait, what?

HWFUA is to blame for our other issues?

Well, here we go.

Sweep all your problems to the door of the Dishonest Simpletons and we all sleep well at night...

A whole confuence of events occurred that led us to losing a talented young player. But let's not kid ourselves that we didn't play a role in that.

And I am not alluding to the nonsense that we played a part in some grand charade, I am talking about the fact that we had enormous issues within the club that led us to ask Garry Lyon for some direction and assistance.

Those issues, plus the AFL's desire for expansion, plus $2m, plus a lack of moral backbone of one Punxsutawney Phil, and the naivete and lack of character of a young fool led us to the situation we found ourselves in.

The conspiracy is great copy - it's a good read.

But let's not let ourselves off the hook by blaming The Grand Conspiracy on all our troubles...

The word 'conspiracy' is innacurate to describe what occurred because, essentially, no unlawful act took place.

What occurred was a series of competing actors making self-interested decisions under a cloud of secrecy. Don't you read your Machiavelli?

The naive view is that which demonizes the Scullys while refusing to accept the likelihood that - God forbid - other actors in the play lied as well!

[Sir Why You Little 36,990]

Wait, what?

HWFUA is to blame for our other issues?

Well, here we go.

Sweep all your problems to the door of the Dishonest Simpletons and we all sleep well at night...

A whole confuence of events occurred that led us to losing a talented young player. But let's not kid ourselves that we didn't play a role in that.

And I am not alluding to the nonsense that we played a part in some grand charade, I am talking about the fact that we had enormous issues within the club that led us to ask Garry Lyon for some direction and assistance.

Those issues, plus the AFL's desire for expansion, plus $2m, plus a lack of moral backbone of one Punxsutawney Phil, and the naivete and lack of character of a young fool led us to the situation we found ourselves in.

The conspiracy is great copy - it's a good read.

But let's not let ourselves off the hook by blaming The Grand Conspiracy on all our troubles...

I have not once said that $cully was a "sole" reason rpfc....but if the AFL had anything to do with the MFC keeping quiet about the upcoming events then that could very easily had detrimental effects on the FD...The Grand Conspiracy as you call it was never the reason for all our troubles...but it may have accelerated some of them.

After $cully left things settled down pretty quickly.

[rpfc 28,271]

The word 'conspiracy' is innacurate to describe what occurred because, essentially, no unlawful act took place.

What occurred was a series of competing actors making self-interested decisions under a cloud of secrecy. Don't you read your Machiavelli?

The naive view is that which demonizes the Scullys while refusing to accept the likelihood that - God forbid - other actors in the play lied as well!

I have condemned and admonished a wide range of actors in this machiavellian play;

The Expansion Rules are shambolic and self-defeating as they are intended to get the clubs to win a handful of games in the first few years - GWS will not get near a win in the first season.

Graeme Allan is a shifty and unethical disappointment to modern social mores.

Andrew Demetriou is floundering and drowning in his own hubris and inability to reflect on his words and the negative effect of his administration on the AFL.

But I am also going to mention the Melbourne Football Club in the causal chain of this mess. We had a tough 2011 and we were not an attractive place to stay at. That is not to say that HWFUA and his father made the wrong decision and made it in such a way that it lacked moral fortitude and character but we still played our role in this mess.

But we move on, don't we?

We have a 200cm CHF we would not have had if 2011 didn't occur the way it did and we have an impressive coaching group that would not be there if 2011 didn't occur the way it did.

C'est la vie.

[Range Rover 1,935]

But we move on, don't we?

We do. But it does seem amiss that those responsible at the MFC for their role in the mess seem to have slid through it without being held to account or, in my opinion, adequately scrutinized.

Perhaps Dean Bailey or some other disaffected inner-sanctum member will have something to say about that at some point down the track.

Until then ...

[rpfc 28,271]

We do. But it does seem amiss that those responsible at the MFC for their role in the mess seem to have slid through it without being held to account or, in my opinion, adequately scrutinized.

Perhaps Dean Bailey or some other disaffected inner-sanctum member will have something to say about that at some point down the track.

Until then ...

Held to account?

Who is left?

Schwab and the board are the only ones who survived The Great Admin Issues at the Demons 2011.

As an aside, I hope you are not implying, once again, that the MFC was complicit with The Great Conspiracy?

I refuse to believe that Cam Schwab or CC would be involved in any BS. And I am sure I would told to 'f... off' if I asked them if they were involved in any BS.

The MFC doesn't do that.

[Sir Why You Little 36,990]

Held to account?

Who is left?

Schwab and the board are the only ones who survived The Great Admin Issues at the Demons 2011.

As an aside, I hope you are not implying, once again, that the MFC was complicit with The Great Conspiracy?

I refuse to believe that Cam Schwab or CC would be involved in any BS. And I am sure I would told to 'f... off' if I asked them if they were involved in any BS.

The MFC doesn't do that.

so rpfc how do we explain the background to Jimmy's mid year news article where he stated regret that "young kids had to lie in the current environment of the AFL"

It was this article that always bothered me far more than the march press conferencel..the hands of jimmy were tied it seems, he said what he could in a slightly cryptic way.

[rpfc 28,271]

so rpfc how do we explain the background to Jimmy's mid year news article where he stated regret that "young kids had to lie in the current environment of the AFL"

It was this article that always bothered me far more than the march press conferencel..the hands of jimmy were tied it seems, he said what he could in a slightly cryptic way.

You go to Jimmy and you tell him that you think he and Cam and the rest of the motley crue not only had knowledge of this farce but that we actively participated in a charade that played with our club adn our fans.

What kind of reception do you think that would get?