OK we had a miserable season finishing ahead of just four clubs. BUT, we did not lower our colours to 8 teams this season. Gold Coast, Adelaide, Fremantle, Brisbane, Essendon, Sydney , Richmond ( On aggregate), Port (On aggregate). Will this cheer us up? I don't think so.

The problem is that the other 8 clubs not only lowered our colours, they then tore them off, wiped themselves with them, tossed them aside and went on by chuckling.

I thought the follow-up was going to be something like '...you need to close your eyes, becuase there's nothing to see with rose-coloured glasses on'.

I'm dissappointed in the way we lost games this year but what do you expect when we have such a huge reliance on players that have played under 50 games. Nearly all our games this season we would of had around 12 players with less than 50 AFL games. The other issue is the players we have that have played over 50 games we have no stars, we have one bloke with all the ability to be a star and teases us like his game against Richmond.

The future is still positive, the talent is there we just need structure and someone how will get the maximum out if our players.

Absolutely nothing rose coloured about being the worst performed Victorian based club yet again. That's 3 of the last 4 years (including twice when we were clearly worst performed of everyone). These last 7 weeks in particular have been diabolical.

2010 8 wins 13 losses 1 draw finished 12th out of 16

2011 8 wins 13 losses 1 draw finish 13th out of 17 teams

Strangely and eerily the seasons nearly mirror each other. However in 2010 our net loss to the premiers was 1 single solitary point. This year 88 points and thank god we only played them once !!. We were afforded gift games agaisnt the newbies this year.

We went backwards

This little clutch of years (2007-2010) returns us to the badlands of 1965-1986. At least up until recently we wouldn't go more than three years without making the finals and giving our supporters hope. We haven't recovered from the retirement of David Neitz, having no gorilla forward to channel our mids. Now we have 'system failure' where blokes chase kicks and results are based on individual effort. With most of the other teams, esp. the higher ones you can almost see a hidden hand directing movement on the playing field. with us it is just kick and hope. Having followed Melbourne this long I am happy to say that my support is in no way diminished and I will renew membership again for 2012.

2010 8 wins 13 losses 1 draw finished 12th out of 16

2011 8 wins 13 losses 1 draw finish 13th out of 17 teams

Strangely and eerily the seasons nearly mirror each other. However in 2010 our net loss to the premiers was 1 single solitary point. This year 88 points and thank god we only played them once !!. We were afforded gift games agaisnt the newbies this year.

We went backwards

In a big way this year we lost 6 games by 9+ goals including a 31 goal loss.

In 2010 we had only 2 losses of 9+ goals.

Whatever way I look at it this year has been a disaster.

In a big way this year we lost 6 games by 9+ goals including a 31 goal loss.

In 2010 we had only 2 losses of 9+ goals.

Whatever way I look at it this year has been a disaster.

Judging this year as I saw it, it was an absolute embarrassing shocker

But looking at it through my rose-coloured glasses it was only pathetic

S'pose though we'll just front up again next year old dee hoping again for a miracle

I am so glad this season is over....The Worst i can ever remember.

This little clutch of years (2007-2010) returns us to the badlands of 1965-1986. At least up until recently we wouldn't go more than three years without making the finals and giving our supporters hope.

I disagree that it's that bad right now.

I'm much more satisfied/optimistic about the future than I was at the end of 2006, despite us making the second week of finals in that year...

Judging this year as I saw it, it was an absolute embarrassing shocker

But looking at it through my rose-coloured glasses it was only pathetic

S'pose though we'll just front up again next year old dee hoping again for a miracle

the bad part is they do not happen very often.

The one statt i am never going to look up is how often I have fronted up hoping for a miracle.

I got up this morning and thought "how do I get myself up for 2012"? 'what is there to improve my thoughts over the next few months.

- Draft , oh no we will pick another choir boy as no good seasoned player will come to us ( see Hale last year )

- New coach, the only decent one will either stay at the pies, move to Carlton or retire to look after his grand kids.

- Good news stories, Fighting within management, CEO leaves.

- New captain, we cannot find one so Green stays on.

The list goes on.

However I did have a good dream last night.

Subject: MFC gives up its licence through no one caring any longer.

Now I can forget about AFL and spend the time with my Grand daughter.

All jokes aside the future is depressing!

I'm quite optimistic about next season. One of the biggest positives from 2011 has been the emergence of Stephan Martin. If nothing else, 2011 has given us a pretty formidable ruck duo, with Gawn developing nicely in the reserves.

Our foward line seems to be where our defence was at in 2008 to 2009: Garland and Frawley had their break-out seasons, but it didn't begin to gel until 2010.

With Watts, Petterd, Jurrah and Howe all showing what they're capable of - there's just so much raw talent there, and I think it will come together in 2012.

I'm quite optimistic about next season. One of the biggest positives from 2011 has been the emergence of Stephan Martin. If nothing else, 2011 has given us a pretty formidable ruck duo, with Gawn developing nicely in the reserves.

Our foward line seems to be where our defence was at in 2008 to 2009: Garland and Frawley had their break-out seasons, but it didn't begin to gel until 2010.

With Watts, Petterd, Jurrah and Howe all showing what they're capable of - there's just so much raw talent there, and I think it will come together in 2012.

All of what you say makes perfect sense.

But I have heard it all 100 times before "wisedog".

From 2012 on "the proof of the pudding is in the eating" for me.

Enough of the promise and more on the results.

After we have won 10 games next year and reduced the big losses to a couple will I say we are a good team.

Until then we are a poor team in the bottom 30% of teams.

Talking optimistically about Melbourne going forward reminds me of Real Estate speak whereby , if one was to hang off the chimney and contort themselves sieways and upward and squint really hard and given the tree in front is blowing over sufficiently then you can see the water. ..i.e For Sale, Home with Bayviews !!

This is how we go about evaluating Melbourne....you have to get very keen about not much to sniff even the modicum of anything.

Its deja vu all over again !!

Talking optimistically about Melbourne going forward reminds me of Real Estate speak whereby , if one was to hang off the chimney and contort themselves sieways and upward and squint really hard and given the tree in front is blowing over sufficiently then you can see the water. ..i.e For Sale, Home with Bayviews !!

This is how we go about evaluating Melbourne....you have to get very keen about not much to sniff even the modicum of anything.

Its deja vu all over again !!

There are always those that struggle to see the undervalued properties, bb.

In the years to come we'll see whether you're right, or whether I've spotted something in this renovator's delight.

(I'm prepared for OMR to bump this at the end of 2013 ).

2010 8 wins 13 losses 1 draw finished 12th out of 16

2011 8 wins 13 losses 1 draw finish 13th out of 17 teams

Strangely and eerily the seasons nearly mirror each other. However in 2010 our net loss to the premiers was 1 single solitary point. This year 88 points and thank god we only played them once !!. We were afforded gift games agaisnt the newbies this year.

We went backwards

Agree totally - we had a favourable draw, another year into the young guns, yet no development in defensive strategy, no ability to withstand pressure, and a general lack of leadership and fight. We need a change in attitude and some basic hardness as much as anything.

Only positives from this year is the form of Stef Martin and Jones and the development of two of the three Jacks.

Bennell and Jetta showed a bit during stages of the year. And the big back three were serviceable.

But apart from that the year was a disaster. Generally the team played as individuals, and the better teams out muscled and systematically broke down the Melbourne game plan. And I don't think that there is another team in the league with worse foot skills, which are a prerequisite for the modern game. And the lack of ability to win centre clearances when games are in the balance is a real concern (even GCS were better at this, with Ablett and Rischitelli).

Only positives from this year is the form of Stef Martin and Jones and the development of two of the three Jacks.

Bennell and Jetta showed a bit during stages of the year. And the big back three were serviceable.

But apart from that the year was a disaster. Generally the team played as individuals, and the better teams out muscled and systematically broke down the Melbourne game plan. And I don't think that there is another team in the league with worse foot skills, which are a prerequisite for the modern game. And the lack of ability to win centre clearances when games are in the balance is a real concern (even GCS were better at this, with Ablett and Rischitelli).

I think you have it covered ickey

Bennell and Jetta showed a bit during stages of the year. And the big back three were serviceable.

If by 'a bit' you mean about five or ten minutes of each game they play do they look up to league standard, then yes they showed 'a bit'. Apart

from the Darwin game last year I'd love to know what our win/loss ratio is with these two in the team compared to our normal w/l ratio. They offer

very little to our side, and I'd dare suggest neither have improved much from when they started, given they've been in the system three years now.

I'm afraid I have misplaced my rose coloured glasses, think I left them on the ledge of the premiership window that I was gazing out of after Neale

gave one of those powerpoint presentations. By all measures, I think our season has been an unmitigated disaster.

Our 8 1/2 wins have consisted of five wins against teams below us, two wins against the next two teams above us (one an interstate team at the G),

and a draw and a win against teams in the finals (again, one against an interstate team at the G, and another in the middle of a form slump).

All this from what was supposed to be a 'dream draw'. Heaven help us if we draw a few more of the top 5-6 twice next year.

Given that we got eighteen games or more out of these players:

Moloney, Watts, Jones, Frawley, Martin, Green, Rivers, Trengove, Sylvia, Garland & Jurrah

we can hardly use injuries as an excuse either.

We'd need to win 10+ games next year to be seen to be progressing

There are always those that struggle to see the undervalued properties, bb.

In the years to come we'll see whether you're right, or whether I've spotted something in this renovator's delight.

(I'm prepared for OMR to bump this at the end of 2013 ).

Going to be interesting to see how the new Coach ( and assoc FD ) go about any reno. Is gong to be a reno ? ..or a rebuild. I.e take much back to scratch and reload.

Taking the nalogu further you have to reveal the true and sound founcations in order to get anywhere. Well anywhere that will last longer than 5 min.

Much of our footy ability is not there. The no -compromise tackling , teh play as a team stuff. The sense of purpose and direction. All missing. Lots of 'individuals" with some show of ability but no cohesion really. The coach will have to go back to basics.. reinforce the structure and then worry about the trimmings. Where will we be come 2013's end ? A the start of this year I made a bet with my wife ( A MAggie ) that Melbourne would be in the GF come 2014. Thought is was a reasonable idea back then.. Looking a bit shaky at present.

Id be happy enough if we werent constantly revisiting the same rubbish and the end of every season. Oh its fine, weve got a couple of likely lads showing promise...a few more seasons and we'll be cranking.

Its like a broken record

We'd need to win 10+ games next year to be seen to be progressing

Again with the wins and losses...

If we had kicked two more goals against Richmond and Port, we would have won 10 and a half games.

Yay! Progress!

We need to be more consistent with effort and performances.

Wins will take care of themselves.

Again with the wins and losses...

If we had kicked two more goals against Richmond and Port, we would have won 10 and a half games.

Yay! Progress!

We need to be more consistent with effort and performances.

Wins will take care of themselves.

So would you be happy next year if we were more consistent but still won 8 1/2 games? I dont look at the

1975 or 1992 ladder, see our win-loss record and think "If only we'd kicked 2 more goals against Fitzroy in '75

and St Kilda in '93 we wouldve had two more wins and moved up two spots". I look at our end of year win-loss record.

Its win-loss ratios that coaches are judged on, and what perceptions on playing lists mental fragilities and

leadership deficiencies are assesed.

If we hadve won those two games, Id still be disappointed in our season as a whole, and expected us to win more games

the year after.

Going to be interesting to see how the new Coach ( and assoc FD ) go about any reno. Is gong to be a reno ? ..or a rebuild. I.e take much back to scratch and reload.

Taking the nalogu further you have to reveal the true and sound founcations in order to get anywhere. Well anywhere that will last longer than 5 min.

This list passes my builder's inspection.

A the start of this year I made a bet with my wife ( A MAggie ) that Melbourne would be in the GF come 2014. Thought is was a reasonable idea back then.. Looking a bit shaky at present.

Don't tell your wife you're having misgivings.

- Draft , oh no we will pick another choir boy as no good seasoned player will come to us ( see Hale last year )

Hale didn't come to us, not because he didn't want to, but because Hawthorn were prepared to give North a higher pick in exchange than we were. Simple as that.

Not to mention, there were many (a majority I would say) round here who didn't want Hale at all, and saw it as yet another sign of the perceived mediocrity of Melbourne in going for another team's reject. Now suddenly it's become in your eyes a measure of our lack of ability to attract "good seasoned players".

As for the "choir boy" remark ...