NFL

[Macca 16,603]

Bobby Wagner (Seattle LB) ... "We've got Marshawn Lynch ... one of the best running backs in the league. Everyone makes their decisions and unfortunately we didn't give him the ball"

The more you look at 'that' play, the more you see the danger ...

• The ball almost certainly has to be thrown hard
• There's a ridiculous amount of pressure (about one minute of play left)
• There's no one that's really open
• The ball can easily be bobbled or tipped in that tight situation
• Wilson & his offense may have been in a somewhat confused state because of the call
• The alternative is to hand it off to beast mode (they were on the 1 yard line)

All the great plans of mice and men.

[Macca 16,603]

Seeing we're on a new page, I'll bump this post ...

And we have joints winners in the playoff tipping comp ... congratulations to JV7 & Go the Biff

Well played to all and thanks for participating

Playoff tipping comp leaderboard (final tally)

11 - JV7, Go the Biff

10 - pantaloons

7 - Gorgoroth, Macca

6 - Georgiou R.R. Martin

3 - cowboy_from_hell

Regular Season Tipping Competition

Year Winner Runners up 3rd place

2013 cowboy_from_hell/ pantaloons/ Gorgoroth

Strafford Macca

2014 Dappa Dan Georgiou R.R Martin Gorgoroth

Post Season Tipping Competition

Year Winner Runners up 3rd place

2013 titan_uranus DemonDave cowboy_from_hell/

Macca

2014 JV7/ pantaloons Gorgoroth/

Go the Biff Macca

[Go the Biff 3,360]

A question: was that Craig Hutchison (the famed "Hutchy") out on the ground patting Kurt Warner on the back as he carried the Vince Lombardi Trophy through the milling Patriots? If not, his doppelgänger.

It certainly was. The fat bastid is mad on US sports & usually gets over there for the SB

No excuse for him getting his bonce on my TV without prior warning though

[Gorgoroth 12,701]

If they put him in the Grand Canyon it would be then known as the shallow hole.

[Macca 16,603]

The biggest issue for Seattle going forward is how can they possibly pay Wilson & Lynch enough money and stay within the salary cap. Wilson is currently earning a pittance (less than 1 mil) whilst Lynch is on about 7.5 mil a year.

There's talk that Wilson might take a discount because he can make so much money off the field but in an open market he'd be worth 20 million plus a year and Lynch would command big big figures as well.

Also, they really need to spend some money on some decent WR's. After today, other teams might come bidding for Matthews as well (Matthews salary is less than a mil a year) ... Seattle Seahawks Contracts

Last year they lost Tate to the Lions because they couldn't pay him enough and they were quick to offload Percy Harvin (which would have eased pressure on their cap)

[titan_uranus 24,562]

I'm not the biggest Patriots fan (I really don't like them, to be honest), but between them and Seattle it was a no brainer as to who I wanted to see win, so I'm quite happy with the result.

The play call on the INT was terrible. At the very least, by throwing it there they were clearly going for the TD which would have left NE with, what, 25 seconds? Why not run the ball (it was only 2nd down), if you don't get in so be it, use up some more time and run it again the next down (or throw it if you're that overly keen to throw it). Especially given how Lynch was running (and that Wilson wasn't exactly dominating).

In the end, the best two sides of the year played one of the best games of the year and that's how you always want it to be (even if I hate Seattle).

Also, Tom Brady surely has to go down as one of the best of all time. Rogers gets the MVPs, Manning gets the records, but Brady wins Superbowls (and if it hadn't been for some miraculous plays, would have two more instead of two losses to the Giants).

[DeeSpencer 24,687]

The biggest issue for Seattle going forward is how can they possibly pay Wilson & Lynch enough money and stay within the salary cap. Wilson is currently earning a pittance (less than 1 mil) whilst Lynch is on about 7.5 mil a year.

There's talk that Wilson might take a discount because he can make so much money off the field but in an open market he'd be worth 20 million plus a year and Lynch would command big big figures as well.

Also, they really need to spend some money on some decent WR's. After today, other teams might come bidding for Matthews as well (Matthews salary is less than a mil a year) ... Seattle Seahawks Contracts

Last year they lost Tate to the Lions because they couldn't pay him enough and they were quick to offload Percy Harvin (which would have eased pressure on their cap)

Offense difference makers: Russ Wilson, Lynch, Russ Okung (LT), Unger ©

Defense difference makers: Earl Thomas, Sherman, Bennett, Chancellor, Avril, Mebane, KJ Wright, Bobby Wagner

Of that list they've signed most of the key defensive starters long term. It's at least half a defense of champions signed up. Bobby Wagner is the big one they'll need to get and will be hard to fit in. He's looming as the cap casualty.

Wilson will get his 18-20 mil maybe with a little discount or flexibility at least. Lynch will probably get 1-2 mil extra tapped on for next year after he holds out. They'll be cool with that. But I don't expect he'll be back for the next year (ie 2016). He'll be the wrong side of 30. Their ability to stay as a good to great offense will depend on finding a superstar to replace Lynch, but it doesn't matter if it's a WR, TE or RB. The best QB's only need 1 star guy to take focus and perform and then they can work with a cast of bums if coached up efficiently.

Edelman was the best WR out there today. I think that's a message that the smart guys in this league aren't overspending on receivers. The SeaHawks already spent a 2nd round pick on a good young guy last year to groom up. I think these teams proved that WR's are overrated. Heck a guy on debut had 100 yards on his first ever 3 catches!

What they have is a luxury of young quality signed up for their prime. They'll have to keep drafting and developing to stay at the top once Wilson's contract comes in. But I think they already know that and they'll follow the Pats lead - pay the QB, pay the defensive superstars if you have them and pay at least 1 offensive superstar (Gronk v Lynch) and don't waste money on receivers and running backs otherwise.

Edited February 2, 2015 by Georgiou R.R. Martin

[DeeSpencer 24,687]

A question: was that Craig Hutchison (the famed "Hutchy") out on the ground patting Kurt Warner on the back as he carried the Vince Lombardi Trophy through the milling Patriots? If not, his doppelgänger.

He's managed to get his media company set up over there. Who knows what they are doing. But he's obviously found a media pass as well. It's ridiculous how many people they let on the field after the game and the presentation is just a mess. The grand final does it much better!

Exaggeration?

I don't care what their plan was ... they had to go with Lynch. Carroll is already putting his hand up and so he should. It's a stuff up of monumental proportions and even when the dust settles, that's how it will be viewed.

They got too cute and should have gone for the kill - without hesitation. They had the best RB in that situation and they blew it. Pure and simple.

Russell Wilson's pass was the 109th time a QB has passed from the 1 yard line this year and the first to be intercepted.

Marshawn Lynch is 1 from 5 from the 1 yard line this year.

[Gorgoroth 12,701]

Agree, the handing of the trophy to the winning team was poor, very poor.

There was no massive cheer as the captain and coach lift the trophy, it went to the owner first FFS.

[Macca 16,603]

He's managed to get his media company set up over there. Who knows what they are doing. But he's obviously found a media pass as well. It's ridiculous how many people they let on the field after the game and the presentation is just a mess. The grand final does it much better!

Russell Wilson's pass was the 109th time a QB has passed from the 1 yard line this year and the first to be intercepted.

Marshawn Lynch is 1 from 5 from the 1 yard line this year.

All the more reason to hand it to off to Lynch - he was overdue.

Stats are often meaningless anyway - a coach often needs to go with his natural instincts, regardless of the plan of his OC. Lynch was having a top game and it was a no-brainer to hand it off to him in that situation. He'd already ran in a TD in from 6 or 7 yards.

Seattle are often renowned for doing what they do in a fairly obvious manner and asking the opposition to beat them at it ... they went away from that thinking at a critical moment and it cost them a chance at a title.

This is not hindsight stuff either - at the time it was happening, I, along with probably millions of others thought it was a no-brainer to hand it off to Lynch. Try anything else and live with the consequences.

And they are going to have to live with the consequences of their decision.

Edited February 2, 2015 by Macca

[cowboy_from_hell 2,390]

Man what a game. I had to work a long day so I didn't get to watch it until last night. Yeah it's obvious hand the freakin' to beast mode. Just a dumb call. I agree with Georgiou about seattles defense. Early on it was obvious the pats were going to run crossing routes underneath and use their speed to get yards. Gronk was the only deep threat if he has a mismatch. Seattle didn't press though and Brady was able to not only get yards but he didn't have to worry about the pass rush as much cause he got rid of the ball so quick.

I'm gonna say it. I think Wilson is a little over rated. He is unbelievable at evading a rush and can extend plays but apart from the big throws to a receiver who was working at foot locker last year (awesome story) Wilson doesn't fill me with confidence that he will win the game for you. He needs help with some receivers that defense and beast mode. I think he ranks 3rd in most important to seattle winning. I'm not saying he is Christian Ponder im jus sayin he isn't brady like.

I'm starting to think Richard Sherman is a [censored]. His bragging about Revis getting a TD caught on him annoyed me. It ain't all about him. He is a gun but most don't throw his way so his stats always look good. Or maybe I'm getting old and grumpy.

[Gorgoroth 12,701]

Nah Sherman is a arrogant fllog.

Glad they lost just to shut him up a bit #youmadbro?

[Macca 16,603]

The Pats would have counted themselves unlucky to lose whilst Seattle would have been counting their lucky stars if they'd won (courtesy of a freak catch)

However, Seattle still should have won ... they were gifted an opportunity and blew it

[Gorgoroth 12,701]

Good to see some class on the field with Warner handing over the trophy.

[DeeSpencer 24,687]

This sums up my thoughts on the play:

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2015/02/02/analysis-notebook-super-bowl-xlix-that-play/

Not saying it was the right play. But I think it's ignorant of some of the top NFL minds if they feed the public with the idea that it was some kind of grossly stupid play that was always destined to fail. Smart preparation by the Pats, a super play the young corner and maybe even some luck made the play happen. Who knows, maybe the corner wasn't even meant to break on the slant so hard and got lucky that it wasn't a fake and the WR didn't catch the ball in 10m of space by himself after he faked in and ran out. That's one of the great things about the NFL and I think it applies to the AFL as well, particularly a Paul Roos team. Disciplined defense will only get you so far and some times it's the player who has the courage to commit to instinct who wins the day. I want to see more of that from our defenders this year.

[Macca 16,603]

The play they chose can probably be "explained" a hundred different ways but it's the play they chose not to use which will be talked about (for a long time I'm reckoning)

You nearly always need to do what the opposition doesn't want you to do ... handing it off to Lynch was the play. 3rd & 4th down plays might have been a different story as they'd already used 2 of their time-outs (some are saying they used them needlessly)

There's also talk that the Pats knew about the play that they did use. Malcolm Butler made mention that they'd been practicing that play in that exact type goal line situation. Belichick probably should be getting the credit if that is the case.

Edited February 3, 2015 by Macca

[cowboy_from_hell 2,390]

I miss the NFL already. This sucks.

[JV7 2,348]

I miss the NFL already. This sucks.

I tell ya what, I almost love the NFL as much as the AFL.. I get more excited to watch the Falcons games then the dees sometimes. Maybe it's the novelty of getting up at 5am to watch or something but I absolutely love the sport now. Usually by December-Janurary im dying for the footy to start, not as much this year. I'm already counting the days down till September haha.

[JV7 2,348]

Btw pretty happy with Dan Quinn as Falcons coach, although it was the worst kept secret in sport. Also Georgiou touching on what you had to say about WR and paying them big $$$ few Falcons fans are saying that wouldn't offer Julio Jones big $$ or the franchise tag when he comes out of contract at seasons end... They sold the house for him in terms of draft picks and now they have a decent offense but dont have the players on defense to stop the oppositions offense.. I for one would pay jones decent money, with roddy white coming to the end they need at least one star WR but I agree WR can be overpaid!

Edited February 3, 2015 by JV7

[cowboy_from_hell 2,390]

I tell ya what, I almost love the NFL as much as the AFL.. I get more excited to watch the Falcons games then the dees sometimes. Maybe it's the novelty of getting up at 5am to watch or something but I absolutely love the sport now. Usually by December-Janurary im dying for the footy to start, not as much this year. I'm already counting the days down till September haha.

Over the last 3-4 years the NFL has become my favourite game. We've had discussions about it on here before. It has nothing to do with Melbourne being very poor for me it's the fact that I will watch any game of NFL. I can't say the same for the AFL anymore. I still enjoy going to Melbourne games and I try to go every week with my membership but I would much rather the NFL come along again very soon.

[cowboy_from_hell 2,390]

Btw pretty happy with Dan Quinn as Falcons coach, although it was the worst kept secret in sport. Also Georgiou touching on what you had to say about WR and paying them big $$$ few Falcons fans are saying that wouldn't offer Julio Jones big $$ or the franchise tag when he comes out of contract at seasons end... They sold the house for him in terms of draft picks and now they have a decent offense but dont have the players on defense to stop the oppositions offense.. I for one would pay jones decent money, with roddy white coming to the end they need at least one star WR but I agree WR can be overpaid!

Dan Quinn is a great hire. I think being in the NFC South means you could bounce back pretty quick. Receivers can get over paid. Does a good QB make a receiver look better? Maybe so but I'm sure cam newton would want Steve smith back. To me brady and Rodgers are the only two QB's that could win with any receiving group. They make average receivers look so much better.

[Macca 16,603]

Don't ya just love stats ...

Apparently the Pats faced 6 rushes on the 1 yard line this season and allowed 5 TD's ... that's right 5 TD's (and none of them were from 'beast mode')

I guess they were overdue to stop one

Anyway, for a bit of lighthearted entertainment, here's this mornings episode of 'Highly Questionable' (with Dan Le Batard, his Dad & Bomani Jones) For the first 10-12 minutes they chat about the SB ('that' play is discussed with both sides of the story given fair hearing)

They also go back in time and look at their over reaction to the Pats plight after their loss in KC (about 4 minutes in) ... Highly Questionable Podcast

[Macca 16,603]

Over the last 3-4 years the NFL has become my favourite game. We've had discussions about it on here before. It has nothing to do with Melbourne being very poor for me it's the fact that I will watch any game of NFL. I can't say the same for the AFL anymore. I still enjoy going to Melbourne games and I try to go every week with my membership but I would much rather the NFL come along again very soon.

I tell ya what, I almost love the NFL as much as the AFL.. I get more excited to watch the Falcons games then the dees sometimes. Maybe it's the novelty of getting up at 5am to watch or something but I absolutely love the sport now. Usually by December-Janurary im dying for the footy to start, not as much this year. I'm already counting the days down till September haha.

Footy as an overall sport might become more enjoyable again if our blokes can start getting in the winners circle ... when you perform as poorly as we have it's easy to switch off the sport. We need to be able to realistically compare ourselves to the better teams instead of looking at those teams with pure envy.

As unambitious as this sounds, even if we were able to win 1 in 3 games on a regular basis, we'd probably be relatively pleased (more so as a first step)

When Roos was appointed my main ambition for him was for him to build a proper list ... in the last 4 or 5 years I'd be usually ruling a line through a dozen players or so - not this year though. I can only find 3 or 4 this year - that's gotta be a good thing

Edited February 3, 2015 by Macca

[Gorgoroth 12,701]

Agree on the call of I'll watch any NFL game but won't sit down and watch say GWS and saints.

Foles to the Rams is still a decent rumour. I'm not sure what he would cost us all up and if he would be worth our pick 10 plus prob more.

[DeeSpencer 24,687]

Agree on the call of I'll watch any NFL game but won't sit down and watch say GWS and saints.

Foles to the Rams is still a decent rumour. I'm not sure what he would cost us all up and if he would be worth our pick 10 plus prob more.

I'd probably rather use pick 10 on him than not have a QB or to take a flier on anyone after the top 2 this year.

The question for the Eagles is what would pick 10 plus their first pick get them? It's not getting them pick 1 or pick 2 either. They'll likely need to add next years first as well. Plus I don't think we've got a read on Mariota and Winston definitively being the first 2 picks.