Have goal umpires become redundant?

[Nasher 33,133]

I usually try to avoid starting emotional threads, but I can't help myself.

Has the goal umpire become redundant?

Not once but twice tonight, a goal umpire made the correct decision and got vetoed by another umpire in a worse position.

If the goal umpire does not have the authority to make rulings on goals, then what is the point of having them at all?

[Reality Bus 17]

I feel your pain. I had to consult the old man on who had the ruling vote in contentious situations. What is the point of them if they get overruled (twice), even though they were correct in the first place.

To put it simply, we were robbed, and it happened RIGHT IN FRONT OF ME!!!!

[Ho Chi Dee 0]

I usually try to avoid starting emotional threads, but I can't help myself.

Has the goal umpire become redundant?

Not once but twice tonight, a goal umpire made the correct decision and got vetoed by another umpire in a worse position.

If the goal umpire does not have the authority to make rulings on goals, then what is the point of having them at all?

Best to trust your first instinct with these types of threads.

I understand the pain, and it is a good point - what is supposed to happen if both umpires are 'certain' they have it right?

But in the end it just highlights the importance of taking your chances. Currently we don't give ourselves anywhere near the reward for our effort.

[glennycow 1]

Overuled by a boundry umpire not even the central umpire....dear me!!

[wisedog 329]

Overuled by a boundry umpire not even the central umpire....dear me!!

Can someone explain what happend?

I saw the Green decision, but have since turned off the TV.

[Nasher 33,133]

I understand the pain, and it is a good point - what is supposed to happen if both umpires are 'certain' they have it right?

Then the goal umpire should have the final say as it is his (or her) job to make calls on goals -- that's precisely my point.

Ultimately it's their jobs on the line if they make poor decisions, and they are usually the ones closest to the event. They should be granted the authority to make the final call if the umpires can't arrive at consensus.

[demon_josh_au 0]

Then the goal umpire should have the final say as it is his (or her) job to make calls on goals -- that's precisely my point.

Ultimately it's their jobs on the line if they make poor decisions, and they are usually the ones closest to the event. They should be granted the authority to make the final call if the umpires can't arrive at consensus.

Did the reply show the goal umpire was correct?? Replay on the scoreboard looked like the 1st one was punched through.

[wisedog 329]

Did the reply show the goal umpire was correct?? Replay on the scoreboard looked like the 1st one was punched through.

The replays I saw on TV were inconclusive, certainly not enough evidence to overrule the original decision.

[Jaded No More 58,659]

I'm not one to ever complain about the umpires, but... I'm REALLY struggling not to swear my heart out at the moment.

A multimillion dollar competition is being ruined by incompetent umpires who make horrendous, glaring mistakes week after week.

We had our chances no doubt, but whose dumb idea was it to put the umps in pink? and whose dumb idea was it to let some [censored] 30m away have the power to overrule a goal umpire??

ARGH!!!!!! :mad:

[Whispering_Jack 28,023]

I must add that there also seem to be problems with deliberate out of bounds and defenders deliberately pushing the ball through for a point.

The deliberate OOB paid against Frawley in the final moments was a poor decision particularly in the conditions and the right thing in those circumstances would have been to give him the benefit of the doubt. There was no doubt however, that a Bulldog defender pushed the pull through for a point deliberately. I understood that that was OK if the defender was under pressure but in this case he was well clear but didn't want to stuff up by picking up the footy. No doubt the decision to drop an umpire for paying a less obvious decision last week weighed on the minds of the umpires but that one was obvious and I doubt whether anybody is going to ever be penalised for breaching that rule again.

[Ho Chi Dee 0]

Then the goal umpire should have the final say as it is his (or her) job to make calls on goals -- that's precisely my point.

Ultimately it's their jobs on the line if they make poor decisions, and they are usually the ones closest to the event. They should be granted the authority to make the final call if the umpires can't arrive at consensus.

Of all the days for the australian network channel to fail here in Saigon, it was of course tonight. So was relying on the radio call, but it sounds odd. If the goal umpire was so sure it's strange that he'd let himself be talked out of it. How far from the goal line were the 'touches'?

My original point though still stands, if we made more of just a couple of the numerous chances we blew it'd wouldn't have mattered what the umpires screwed up.

[Jaded No More 58,659]

I must add that there also seem to be problems with deliberate out of bounds and defenders deliberately pushing the ball through for a point.

The deliberate OOB paid against Frawley in the final moments was a poor decision particularly in the conditions and the right thing in those circumstances would have been to give him the benefit of the doubt. There was no doubt however, that a Bulldog defender pushed the pull through for a point deliberately. I understood that that was OK if the defender was under pressure but in this case he was well clear but didn't want to stuff up by picking up the footy. No doubt the decision to drop an umpire for paying a less obvious decision last week weighed on the minds of the umpires but that one was obvious and I doubt whether anybody is going to ever be penalised for breaching that rule again.

Words fail me...

[Eth 4]

Words fail me...

My head's sore now.

The umpire who overruled the first one should be sacked. I was at that end, and clearly hear the smack of leather on leather, even from Level 4. The replays showed it wasn't touched as well.

And also, a paragraph from AFL.com's article on the game:

The match is likely to be remembered as much for its close finish as for a number of contentious decisions that went the Bulldogs' way, especially in the last quarter.

[Brettmcg 24]

Trust me on this, as I have been involved in umpiring, in particular goal umpiring, and am now involved in umpire coaching in a suburban league. If Peter Gonis (goal umpire in question on both incidents) had some balls he would have paid both goals. The only time a field umpire can officially overule a goal umpire is if he sees a ball touched from a downfield kick. The worst part about the two decisions is that both times they were "overruled" by Boundary umpires who were up to 30m away. Don't get carried away with video screens and replays and stopping the game. We always tell our umpires that your first instinct is mostly your best one.

[demon_josh_au 0]

Trust me on this, as I have been involved in umpiring, in particular goal umpiring, and am now involved in umpire coaching in a suburban league. If Peter Gonis (goal umpire in question on both incidents) had some balls he would have paid both goals. The only time a field umpire can officially overule a goal umpire is if he sees a ball touched from a downfield kick. The worst part about the two decisions is that both times they were "overruled" by Boundary umpires who were up to 30m away. Don't get carried away with video screens and replays and stopping the game. We always tell our umpires that your first instinct is mostly your best one.

Hit the nail on the head brett. Both times the goal umpire was going to signal a goal. NO BALLS!!!!

[Brettmcg 24]

Hit the nail on the head brett. Both times the goal umpire was going to signal a goal. NO BALLS!!!!

Mind you, why would you even bother making a tough, contentious decision these days when your "boss" comes out on Monday and tells the world you had a sh*t one. As much as I hate McLaren, I thought the way Gieschen hung him out to dry was disgraceful. No wonder McBurney didn't want to pay the blatantly obvious rushed behind down the Punt Road end in the 2nd.

[Eth 4]

Hit the nail on the head brett. Both times the goal umpire was going to signal a goal. NO BALLS!!!!

I think whoever overruled them has less brain cells than the goals that were overruled.

[olgreydingo 51]

When a team is playing poorly its the coach that gets the heat. So the focus should go to the Gesh!! and Sawyers!! It is obvisous that these guys coach and appoint the umpires and even Scott Mclaren didnt know the corret directive. teh heat should be on the Umpire coaches!!!!

[Hellaintabadplacetobe 4,098]

You can clearly hear the field umpire say``I did`nt see it touched``on the Channel 7 telecast, then the boundary ump comes in and says it was touched.

[Geddy Lee 582]

I must add that there also seem to be problems with deliberate out of bounds and defenders deliberately pushing the ball through for a point.

The deliberate OOB paid against Frawley in the final moments was a poor decision particularly in the conditions and the right thing in those circumstances would have been to give him the benefit of the doubt. There was no doubt however, that a Bulldog defender pushed the pull through for a point deliberately. I understood that that was OK if the defender was under pressure but in this case he was well clear but didn't want to stuff up by picking up the footy. No doubt the decision to drop an umpire for paying a less obvious decision last week weighed on the minds of the umpires but that one was obvious and I doubt whether anybody is going to ever be penalised for breaching that rule again.

That 'non-decision' was incredibly frustrating.

There is a f**king rule, they have read it.

Pay it.

[Jaded No More 58,659]

No wonder McBurney didn't want to pay the blatantly obvious rushed behind down the Punt Road end in the 2nd.

But he had no problems paying the [censored] deliberate against poor Frawley in the most difficult of conditions. Don't get me started on McBurney. I'd punch his face in if I could.

Please, let's not make excuses for these people. It is THEIR JOB for which they get paid to make decisions based on clearly set out rules. Nobody will complain about missed head high tackles or throws, but blatant frees which they miss or worse of all, decisions they pay which are soft and have huge consequences on the game, are unacceptable. They deserve to be named and shamed and I hope the boundary umpire who overruled those goals never umpires again. Somebody has to make these people accountable, because I'm starting to think that umpiring is the only profession in Australia that lets you get away with terrible performances.

[Brettmcg 24]

But he had no problems paying the [censored] deliberate against poor Frawley in the most difficult of conditions. Don't get me started on McBurney. I'd punch his face in if I could.

Please, let's not make excuses for these people. It is THEIR JOB for which they get paid to make decisions based on clearly set out rules. Nobody will complain about missed head high tackles or throws, but blatant frees which they miss or worse of all, decisions they pay which are soft and have huge consequences on the game, are unacceptable. They deserve to be named and shamed and I hope the boundary umpire who overruled those goals never umpires again. Somebody has to make these people accountable, because I'm starting to think that umpiring is the only profession in Australia that lets you get away with terrible performances.

You're right, and I hate hearing people yell out "up to the country for you next week Umpire XXX" because it simply isn't the case anymore. Unless there is a really dreadful decision like last week, the umpires are never made accountable. Doesn't help that they know their appointments almost 3 weeks in advance. The worst they can expect is a rotation every now and then.

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

The deliberate OOB paid against Frawley in the final moments was a poor decision particularly in the conditions and the right thing in those circumstances would have been to give him the benefit of the doubt.

Agreed, if that umpire that looks like Gollum can get a week for his mistakes there are two or three umpires from tonight who deserve a break next week.

[olgreydingo 51]

I have umpired footy for over 20 years, and yes the Gesh! will hide behind "Yes it is technically correct!" There appears to be the main thing that he does not profess to "COMMON SENCE"!!!!

[Adzman 2,085]

Goal Umps are Obsolete.

2 goals taken from off after they were called goals by the goal ump.

Just put traffic lights in for a replacement. Saves the f&cking heartache of having a goal ripped from us.

Green for goal, red for point, and amber for waiting for the [censored] with the whistle to guess which way it goes.