The Melbourne Football Club Culture

[45HG 1,539]

It sure as hell didn't work in the first 4 rounds last year.

I'm not sure what the Cats have done, but i'm sure it has more to do with the 4 years of list building and gameplan management, more than a few players having coffee deciding the direction they want their club to take.

I think off field our club is heading in the right direction. It is forming links with the community, and in a professional manner is becoming more connected with supporters through their functions, emails etc.

As supporters, we need to be more united. Perhaps make it easier, or more enjoyable, to join the cheer squad.

Perhaps have more functions where fans can meet up and decide plans of their own on how to attack the image of our fans. I find that the better your support it, the more likely it is that neutral fans will jump on board. Essendon are a prime example of this, as are the Pies.

If our supporters are seen as strong, and the club fixes off its off field problems, all that needs to happen is the onfield turn around which in all honesty, we know will come eventually.

[Sir Why You Little 34,444]

It sure as hell didn't work in the first 4 rounds last year.

I'm not sure what the Cats have done, but i'm sure it has more to do with the 4 years of list building and gameplan management, more than a few players having coffee deciding the direction they want their club to take.

I think off field our club is heading in the right direction. It is forming links with the community, and in a professional manner is becoming more connected with supporters through their functions, emails etc.

As supporters, we need to be more united. Perhaps make it easier, or more enjoyable, to join the cheer squad.

Perhaps have more functions where fans can meet up and decide plans of their own on how to attack the image of our fans. I find that the better your support it, the more likely it is that neutral fans will jump on board. Essendon are a prime example of this, as are the Pies.

If our supporters are seen as strong, and the club fixes off its off field problems, all that needs to happen is the onfield turn around which in all honesty, we know will come eventually.

I agree with you but i think this problem must be addressed and not hought of as negative and swept under the carpet. If our club had a stronger Fabric TJ would have seen a flag. At present why would a young recruit want to play for melbourne. Like when Nathan Buckley spent a year at the bears (coz he had to) but was always heading to collingwood. That's what we have to get to. It's why Judd chose Carlton over us even though melbourne was his team as a kid. That killed me, i actually shed a tear at that press conference. Carlton those lousy stinking cheats will win a flag within 5 years at this rate-IT SHOULD BE US!!!

[heartbeatstrue 57]

I agree with you but i think this problem must be addressed and not hought of as negative and swept under the carpet. If our club had a stronger Fabric TJ would have seen a flag. At present why would a young recruit want to play for melbourne. Like when Nathan Buckley spent a year at the bears (coz he had to) but was always heading to collingwood. That's what we have to get to. It's why Judd chose Carlton over us even though melbourne was his team as a kid. That killed me, i actually shed a tear at that press conference. Carlton those lousy stinking cheats will win a flag within 5 years at this rate-IT SHOULD BE US!!!

WYL I love your passion! Yeah it killed me too, Juddy going to Carrrlton, he was a Melbourne supporter and had the chance to pick us. He's the best footballer in my book after watching a few of his games this year. What a pity. And I hated that eerie game last year against Carltank, they had no intention of winning. Cheats. Cost us in draft picks, costing us again this year.

I hated Friday night too, like you there was no way I was cheering them off the ground. It's still hurting, deeply. I'm still slinking around at my work trying to avoid the Geelong supporters (got quite good at this over the years). But one thing I'll say, I think the culture is changing at MFC. I sensed on Friday night that for a 100+ point thrashing, our young players actually kept coming back, having a dip, some nice skills showed even in the last few minutes (glad I stayed, even tho I missed the opening of the opening ceremony).

Bailey strikes me as someone who won't accept our tradition of a soft culture. I hope the new young bunch get more influenced by him than by the older group. I worry about Bate and Dunn. For years we've been happy with easy wins, when was the last time we got ahead then ground a team right down? As well as skills and strength, I want to see us as ruthless as Geelong on Friday night.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Bailey must to at least 2 things at the end of the year. First he must sack Meeson and Carroll they are a joke. Secondly and most importantly they must go for a young captain. He must show that our youngsters will get rewarded, there is no use selling our youth policy and then make either Green, Bruce or McDonald captain when the will have to give the captaincy back shortly anyway. Our youngsters must lead and there is no better way than giving a young player the captaincy. McLean should be captain or co captain with Miller. Bailey made a big mistake allowing Neitz to hold on to the captaincy he shouldn't make the same mistake again.

Both Meesen and Carroll are (unfortunately) contracted and apart from stretching the salary cap and the worsening the bottom line it achieves little.

The Captaincy should go to the player who deserves it and has shown the requisite leadership. At the start of the year, aside from the incumbent Neitz there was no other candidate showing the necessary leadership. At the time certainly not McLean. So it was hardly a big mistake by Bailey. Its more reflective of the leadership hole Bailey assumed when he took over

[DangerousDemon 3]

Have fans turn up to games irrespective of weather we are getting a pancing, or runaway winners by ten goals would be a sound starting point.If supporters, member of the club or otherwise are serious about its survival support in any capacity is vital. I understand it is not possible for some, through respective monetary restrictions to donate, however the most crucial donation to this great club is made through the agency of something everything has a glutious maximus ( Bum). This easy donation can be made by placing your rear end on a seat at all games in Melbourne or even interstate in 2009.The time has come to refrain from reflective thinking rootted in the glory days of the 80' when we were a super power and begin to create a culture in the new millenium, once which is lasting, is poweferfull and puncutates the symbolism of a club with such a rich history.

[H_T 2,941]

I agree with you but i think this problem must be addressed and not hought of as negative and swept under the carpet. If our club had a stronger Fabric TJ would have seen a flag. At present why would a young recruit want to play for melbourne. Like when Nathan Buckley spent a year at the bears (coz he had to) but was always heading to collingwood. That's what we have to get to. It's why Judd chose Carlton over us even though melbourne was his team as a kid. That killed me, i actually shed a tear at that press conference. Carlton those lousy stinking cheats will win a flag within 5 years at this rate-IT SHOULD BE US!!!

WYL I share and feel your pain regarding Judd. That is why we have to improve our culture and become ruthless and seen as a pillar of strength. It has to come from within. Bailey can start it by sifting the list again and appoint a new Captain(s). I would like to see Brock McLean captain. Brad Miller Vice captain. Junior and Brucey Deputies.

When the boys hit the deck running next year, they have start full of run and aggression at the pill, ruthless tackling. Over summer they need to study what the Benchmark do and implement on the ground. That Benchmark is Geelong Football Club.

What irks me is that we were on their level two years ago. We are stuck in first gear. We need to learn from them. As I say it comes from within. At Geelong, their attitude changed and clicked when the leaders told each other enough is enough. They told each other what areas they can improve on collectively and told each other their weaknesses. Since then they haven't looked back!

[iv'a worn smith 1,979]

Not to mention the Geelong's list generally has bigger and stronger bodies.

Why has it been for so long, that our conditioning and fitness team cannot get the physiques of those of those on our list to remotely look like AFL footballers.

C Morton hopefully will beef up over the summer. We all know he needs to, but surely our lack of conditioning can't just be put down to inferior facilities.

I agree though, the change of culture must come from within. To quote RDB, "if it is to be, it is up to me".

[Rogue 585]

What irks me is that we were on their level two years ago.

Our list was in a totally different shape to theirs two years ago, IMHO.

Two years ago, it was pretty clear that our flag opportunity (if we had one) was passing us by.

I imagine Geelong's list wasn't as old as ours, when it came to key players.

[H_T 2,941]

Our list was in a totally different shape to theirs two years ago, IMHO.

Two years ago, it was pretty clear that our flag opportunity (if we had one) was passing us by.

I imagine Geelong's list wasn't as old as ours, when it came to key players.

Thats fair enough. I should of elaborated a bit further ie Ladder position, wins and losses. In 2006 they were all at sea.

If you could go back to then - mid 2006, you would of not seen their dominance coming IMO. This has come from within the playing group.

[Rogue 585]

If you could go back to then - mid 2006, you would of not seen their dominance coming IMO. This has come from within the playing group.

Sure, I'm not saying I had my crystal ball out regarding Geelong's future.

However, at the end of 2006 it was pretty clear that we were going to struggle, as our key players were getting on, while we also had many players in our best 22 who were still young and inexperienced.

Thus, I don't see that it's valid to say we were at the same point as them - maybe on ladder position, as you suggest (although I thought that while we made finals week 2, they finished outside the 8), but certainly not when you looked at the lists.

[Supreme_Demon 3,009]

A change of culture at the club is what has been needed for a long time.

In many ways the cause of all this happened in 1963(?) when Norm Smith called a particular umpire a "cheat" and was in return sued by the umpire. Instead of the MFC board giving Norm Smith their full support during this time he was told "you were on your own". Then at the end of 1964 instead of the MFC moving heaven and earth to keep Ron Barassi a Demon they let him go to Carlton for the "big bucks". So basically our champion player (somebody who embodied our heart and soul) was allowed to go and play for another club. To make matters worse the MFC sacked Norm Smith mid-season in 1965 and then reinstated him again about a week later. This already soured tense relations after the issue back in 1963 which I mentioned.

From those particular points onwards thing were on the slide for this club...

So basically the culture of the MFC was being rotted out as early as 1963. When the toffs and other big-wigs who were involved with the MFC become arrogant and selfish.

After the treatment of Norm Smith it flowed onto the playing group. Of course there were many other factors which lead to the decline of the MFC including the change of recruitment zones etc. But our culture of "winning at all costs" left in 1965 in my opinion. It has showed glimpses of coming back in the 80s and 90s and 2000s. The only problem is we don't have a "hard edge" on our players. We don't punish them enough if they lose and intill into them a sense of pride and passion when wearing the Demons jumper. The dark blue and red yoke jumper should mean EVERYTHING to a player who wears it.

When it comes to club culture you need tough and uncompromising people to instill a sense of toughness. This applies from the President right down to the boot studder. I think now with Jim Stynes we are SLOWLY starting to see this.

But we need to get rid of a lot of the older playing group (via trading or delisting) and start fresh. From now on we should only draft players who are not only very skillful but also have a "mean streak" and a sense of detemination about them. (When I talk about a mean streak I should mention players like Leigh Matthews, Paul Chapman, Wayne Carey, Dean Wallis, Josh Carr, and of course Ron Barassi.) If the players we draft are young and don't have a "mean streak" or a sense of ruthlessness or determination in them it is the job of the coaching staff AND the rest of the people involved in the MFC to instill this into our players.

It should be always remembered that WINNING is the ONLY option. While coming close (but losing) and putting in a good, hard, tough, effort is admirable it is still NOT good enough!

Once we have a sense of ruthlessness, toughness and determination instilled into our club, only then will we start to create a winning culture once again here at the Melbourne Football Club.

[H_T 2,941]

Sure, I'm not saying I had my crystal ball out regarding Geelong's future.

However, at the end of 2006 it was pretty clear that we were going to struggle, as our key players were getting on, while we also had many players in our best 22 who were still young and inexperienced.

Thus, I don't see that it's valid to say we were at the same point as them - maybe on ladder position, as you suggest (although I thought that while we made finals week 2, they finished outside the 8), but certainly not when you looked at the lists.

Correction (not same point): The level I meant was...."Maybe at different spectrums of Uncertainty (similar level)" , Geelong had participated in finals previous to 2006, so had Melbourne. Its hard to gauge, we had beaten or drawn Geelong down at Skilled, both sides were inconsistent. Geelong was expected to go well 2006, so too Melbourne. Melbourne looked to go well until a dismal last half of the season before rallying late prior to the finals.

But you sort of knew where I was going.....

[Sir Why You Little 34,444]

A change of culture at the club is what has been needed for a long time.

In many ways the cause of all this happened in 1963(?) when Norm Smith called a particular umpire a "cheat" and was in return sued by the umpire. Instead of the MFC board giving Norm Smith their full support during this time he was told "you were on your own". Then at the end of 1964 instead of the MFC moving heaven and earth to keep Ron Barassi a Demon they let him go to Carlton for the "big bucks". So basically our champion player (somebody who embodied our heart and soul) was allowed to go and play for another club. To make matters worse the MFC sacked Norm Smith mid-season in 1965 and then reinstated him again about a week later. This already soured tense relations after the issue back in 1963 which I mentioned.

From those particular points onwards thing were on the slide for this club...

So basically the culture of the MFC was being rotted out as early as 1963. When the toffs and other big-wigs who were involved with the MFC become arrogant and selfish.

After the treatment of Norm Smith it flowed onto the playing group. Of course there were many other factors which lead to the decline of the MFC including the change of recruitment zones etc. But our culture of "winning at all costs" left in 1965 in my opinion. It has showed glimpses of coming back in the 80s and 90s and 2000s. The only problem is we don't have a "hard edge" on our players. We don't punish them enough if they lose and intill into them a sense of pride and passion when wearing the Demons jumper. The dark blue and red yoke jumper should mean EVERYTHING to a player who wears it.

When it comes to club culture you need tough and uncompromising people to instill a sense of toughness. This applies from the President right down to the boot studder. I think now with Jim Stynes we are SLOWLY starting to see this.

But we need to get rid of a lot of the older playing group (via trading or delisting) and start fresh. From now on we should only draft players who are not only very skillful but also have a "mean streak" and a sense of detemination about them. (When I talk about a mean streak I should mention players like Leigh Matthews, Paul Chapman, Wayne Carey, Dean Wallis, Josh Carr, and of course Ron Barassi.) If the players we draft are young and don't have a "mean streak" or a sense of ruthlessness or determination in them it is the job of the coaching staff AND the rest of the people involved in the MFC to instill this into our players.

It should be always remembered that WINNING is the ONLY option. While coming close (but losing) and putting in a good, hard, tough, effort is admirable it is still NOT good enough!

Once we have a sense of ruthlessness, toughness and determination instilled into our club, only then will we start to create a winning culture once again here at the Melbourne Football Club.

I agree with every word you say. This should be Faxed straight to Jim Stynes Office. I want the MFC to play like Rabid Demons again. Such a shame The Ox did the knee Pre-season 0f '95. Cost the Team and Balmey a Flag i believe..

[H_T 2,941]

I agree with every word you say. This should be Faxed straight to Jim Stynes Office. I want the MFC to play like Rabid Demons again. Such a shame The Ox did the knee Pre-season 0f '95. Cost the Team and Balmey a Flag i believe..

WYL, I can see attributes in players like Nathan Jones, Brock McLean, Brad Miller, Matty Whelan to some degree, Lynden Dunn that with maturity have that hard edge ruthless mean streak in them that will lead the way...that Supreme Demon speaks of.

[Sir Why You Little 34,444]

WYL, I can see attributes in players like Nathan Jones, Brock McLean, Brad Miller, Matty Whelan to some degree, Lynden Dunn that with maturity have that hard edge ruthless mean streak in them that will lead the way...that Supreme Demon speaks of.

I Hope you are right. I don't understand why this problem wasn't addressed after the '87-'88 Hawthorn Finals Campaigns. They taught us a lesson particulairly '88, and we never fully heeded it.

[H_T 2,941]

I Hope you are right. I don't understand why this problem wasn't addressed after the '87-'88 Hawthorn Finals Campaigns. They taught us a lesson particulairly '88, and we never fully heeded it.

We got the better of them in 1990, although we didnt go on with it, going down to West Coast at Waverley in the finals. I've heard some of the players including Lyon, saying that was the year that got away. Bloody Filth won that year in October.

[Sir Why You Little 34,444]

We got the better of them in 1990, although we didnt go on with it, going down to West Coast at Waverley in the finals. I've heard some of the players including Lyon, saying that was the year that got away. Bloody Filth won that year in October.

Yes Collingwood owe us Big time for that Flag, They were [censored] scared of Hawthorn that year. Got Belted. That Elimination Final against Hawthorn should have been the Blue Print for Our Club Going Forward. But We have just never been Tough enough Consistently. Thus the "soft" tag that has been thrown sporadically is fair game.

This Issue is Number 1 Priority on & off the Field i believe. This is our last chance.

[Beamer 1]

I question alot of things about Melbournes current playing list, but one of them isnt toughness.

I think we have a range of tough players. McDonald, Moloney, Whelan and Miller just examples. Not the toughest going around but I still think good enough to shake us of the 'weak' tag.

TJ, as good as he was, was soft & weak. He's gone.

[Sir Why You Little 34,444]

I question alot of things about Melbournes current playing list, but one of them isnt toughness.

I think we have a range of tough players. McDonald, Moloney, Whelan and Miller just examples. Not the toughest going around but I still think good enough to shake us of the 'weak' tag.

TJ, as good as he was, was soft & weak. He's gone.

Macca is a tough nut yes, Miller was a few years back (Fortunately that toughness is returning, Moloney can be but gets injured too often (Maybe his toughness gets him injured) but he must be more reguliar. Same with wheels, always liked him but he never strings loads of games. All the great sides had at least one tough nut per line-we must aim for that

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

All the great sides had at least one tough nut per line-we must aim for that

How about we get 22 skillful and competent players who are tough at the ball and win the contested pill. That is what a tough nut is all about.

I do know why we are lauded MFC tough nuts. We dont have them. After Friday, we are as tough as poached egg. I cant think of one side that fears playing MFC beyond boosting their percentage significantly.

[Sir Why You Little 34,444]

How about we get 22 skillful and competent players who are tough at the ball and win the contested pill. That is what a tough nut is all about.

I do know why we are lauded MFC tough nuts. We dont have them. After Friday, we are as tough as poached egg. I cant think of one side that fears playing MFC beyond boosting their percentage significantly.

Totally agree. After the cats kicked the first goal last week we were as Soft as Hot Butter. All the more sad when many Senior players were involved. Has Anyone ever seen Jeff White Get Mad and thus Fired Up. No he was the Gentle Giant.

Maybe Rod Grinter, Laurie Fowler & Ray Biffin need to have a chat to the boys one night!

[45HG 1,539]

Maybe our supporters should pull out more cliches to help lift the team out of our slump.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Maybe our supporters should pull out more cliches to help lift the team out of our slump.

Indeed 45HG.

[Swampfox 190]

Totally agree. After the cats kicked the first goal last week we were as Soft as Hot Butter. All the more sad when many Senior players were involved. Has Anyone ever seen Jeff White Get Mad and thus Fired Up. No he was the Gentle Giant.

Maybe Rod Grinter, Laurie Fowler & Ray Biffin need to have a chat to the boys one night!

We want players to develop toughness in their game (mind and body) not thuggery

2 of those you mentioned were ordinary footballers who resorted to thuggery

[Sir Why You Little 34,444]

We want players to develop toughness in their game (mind and body) not thuggery

2 of those you mentioned were ordinary footballers who resorted to thuggery

Yes i know, interested though as to which 2 Footballers you were reffering to as the thugs. I thought on their day they were all pretty good players when they concentrated on the Ball