Mach5

I think that rjay has put it really well in another thread, when he said that these other clubs we're currently comparing ourselves with (St Kilda, Bulldogs) have ageing champion players still on the list who provide the experience and drag the kids along with them. We haven't had that, due to needing to rebuild from a dramatically failed rebuild, rather than rebuilding from a failed premiership tilt. Our experience has largely been brought in as cast-offs from elsewhere, meaning lesser quality, or we've had to pay for it, lessening our ability to draft in quality young talent. We have it, but the depth is still wanting. Also, it's worth remembering that although we have been competitive at times, a great chunk of the players we are relying on are only in their first or 2nd seasons of AFL footy: Brayshaw, Stretch, ANB, Harmes, JKH, Vandenberg, Salem, Hogan. Even Michie, Riley & Newton came to the club having played 1, 12 & 4 career AFL games respectively. Where should our expectations reasonably be? I'd also be cautious of overestimating the opposition, despite some of their impressive performances, much like most do at this point with us.

Rookie at best.

. Fair enough. I don't agree. I think our worst is better, but only marginally. I think the key is weeding out the turnover merchants that bring everybody else down to their level. As Roos has stated a few times recently, one of Hawthorn's greatest assets is the value each of their players puts on their disposal. They generally don't fumble and they don't put their teammates under pressure with rushed, messy disposals. We often grass handballs or kicks through sloppy execution, and it snowballs.

Many here still getting confused between what they would have reasonably expected and what they want.

Even some of the top 4 teams don't have great consistency. Sydney have been putrid of late. Freo lacklustre. Hawthorn FCS have lost to Essendon, Port, GWS, It wasn't until Round 10 when they won 2 games in a row. Consistency is the holy grail, and something we should be striving for, but we shouldn't be shocked into outrage when we don't get it.

I can. Fyfe, Judd, Rioli, Ablett, Selwood, Mundy, Heppell...

Do some supporters really expect us to consistently compete only a season and a half removed from the Neeld/Craig era? How can any not see some form of progress when we defeated Geelong in Geelong, for so long an impossibly ridiculous notion? Defeated certain finalists Richmond? Smashed the super impressive Bulldogs? I keep hearing/reading that we we have witnessed this season is "simply not good enough." What do supporters really expect?

Hilarious.

I definitely noticed that. And Roos made note of it briefly on radio before the game, based on the other games he had seen this weekend. It was like I was watching a game with different rules today.

Clarkson also has the advantage of all the resources that Hawthorn has to offer. I don't think Norm had quite the relatively advantageous resources at his disposal.

By the way, heard yesterday that Darling has a 15-year-old cousin in outer Melbourne who is tearing it up as a junior. Apparently Richmond have been out to see him a few times and are in his ear already about taking him in 2018. And Friday was the 24th.

Not already obvious?

It's not the same opinion. You've seen a comment that could be construed as slightly negative, and then run with it in the ridiculous fashion that you do, so that you can incessantly pot another player without basis, as is your bizarre wont... Attention starved much..?

Like most draft write-ups, it is ridiculously hyperbolic.

Pig headedly stuck in the "offload Garland" camp, by the looks of it. Willing to cut off his nose to spite his face.

Haha you're so... malleable. Don't be afraid to use your eyes and think for yourself once in a while. We'd all be better off for it.

Let's not waste our time and energy.

Underwhelmed. I like Francis, but most years he'd be on the edge of the top 10, this year he's out of our reach. Weitering is blue chip. Balic or Curnow for mine.

I can see Parish having a similar career trajectory as Toumpas. Happy to have him, but there are better choices to be made.

Exactly. The aims and objectives of the AFL executive are inherently leading us to imbalance. It needs an overhaul.

Name an elite player that wasn't already elite at the age of 25.

Only 25? What players has become elite after the age of 25?

Oh Christ, we've got a rampant religious zealot derailing threads. Honestly, religious discrimination is not ok. If you're stupid enough to believe fairy stories, you should be pitied. We shouldn't make fun of those with low intelligence.

They expect to get both Danger & Selwood.

Interestingly Geelong has also asked Motlop for a final decision this week. Wonder if they could trade places..?