mo64

I don't have an issue with the players. They have every right to play out their contract. My issue is with the list management, and how we got to this stage. If we look at our best 22 next year, we'll have 4 key forwards at Casey (BBB, T Mac, Schache and Jefferson) plus a hybrid forward in Melksham on the sidelines. And we don't have a mature aged ruckman to back up Max if he gets injured. Is that a healthy position to be in? Some of us don't have blind faith, and are willing to challenge club decisions. Others will never say a bad word about the club. The whole point of a forum is to discuss the issues of the club on and off the field. And BTW, the club didn't see any "cultural aspects" in off-loading Grundy, who still had 4 years to go on his contract.

I'm sure they have reasons, but that doesn't mean that they'll be proven correct. Our list management has been baffling over the past 2 years. Starting with acquiring Grundy and ending with re-signing Schache. If anything, I think we're lacking in young midfield talent.

If the only reason we don't draft or rookie list him is due to lack of a list spot, then the spotlight needs to go onto Tim Lamb. After Trade Week, he was questioned about our forward line, and didn't mention T Mac, BBB, Schache or Melksham. All of them might be considered dead wood next season. The circumstances behind BBB, T Mac and Melksham I can partially understand, but Schache getting another year is mind boggling. If the club think that Kynan Brown has AFL potential, then they have to make the call on Melksham. Edit. They've made the call on Melksham to rookie list.

If the Eagles think Curtin will fall to pick 6, then both offers are equal. We've got nothing more to offer, so it's take it or leave it.

The reality is we are no chance of getting pick 1 without North providing us pick 2 or 3, and North want Reid as much as any club. The Harley Reid dream is over as far as I'm concerned. A deal between WCE and North will get done.

Assessing the trade period is folly at this stage. 2 years ago the Pies had a fire sale for Treloar, Stephenson and Phillips, and would have been given a F-. They subsequently went on to play in a prelim, then win a flag. Things like cap space are not factored into the ratings. One can only assess the players we've gained and lost, because the draft picks can still be traded, and can be a lottery anyway. McAdam - Really rate him, and provides X factor in our forward line that we badly need. Fullarton - I like this because it addresses a need for a Forward/Ruck. In hindsight, Brandon Ryan would have been a better option. Just wish we went down this path last year and pursued McLean instead of Grundy. Billings - Has talent, not but sold on him after 2 poor years. As a high half forward, which is how Tim Lamb described his role, he's an upgrade on Spargo, who's depth anyway. With Woey and Howes, just not sure that Billings addresses a need. Fair to say that losing Grundy, Harmes and JJ won't really impact our best 22 greatly, but does free up cap space. Sad to see Harmes and JJ go, but that's footy. My biggest concern is whether we have a list spot for a mature aged ruckman like Lycett, Hayes or a state league player. That's another reason why I question the Billings trade.

Hunter was serviceable this year, but had better seasons at the Dogs.

How can you define a 20yo as "unfulfilled talent", and use Wilson as a comparison with Billings? By your definition, every player needs to fulfill their potential by the time they're 20. Billings has been in the system 10 years, and is the true definition of unfulfilled talent. A high draft pick who's shown a lot of promise over the years, but never reached the heights of expectation. IRW's point is valid when it comes to our current football department. Dunstan, Grundy, Hunter and Schache were essentially unwanted by their previous club, and none of them have reached the heights at Melbourne as they did at their previous club. Langdon, Hibberd and Melksham were not unwanted by their previous clubs. They sort a trade to us just like McAdam. I hope that Billings can buck the trend of our recent acquisitions of unwanted players.

His brother Glenn was a gun mid. Not sure how good Robert was.

What's your point? I'm saying that when Wilson and White arrived they were in the infancy of their careers, so naturally they would blossom with experience. Billings is in the twilight of his career.

Stef Martin, Darren Jolly. Toby Bedford has made a pretty good start at GWS.

Billings is 28. Wilson and White were in their early 20's and Moore had a better career at the Pies.

I strongly disagree with this. He's 28 and coming off 2 poor years, so where's his massive upside come from? We've recently brought in the likes of Dunstan, Hunter, Grundy and Schache from other clubs, and none of them improved in our supposed "elite environment". At best he's a depth player that could challenge Hunter and Langdon, but I'd prefer Woey and Howes to be given that opportunity.

108 goals from 155 games is NOT close to a goal a game average, lol.

That's what I meant by not being successful. Hunter was ok this year but didn't really make us better. Schache. Enough said. If Billings was 23, I'd be all in, but at 28 seems like his best is past him. And since we got McAdam, I don't think he addresses a need.

The post says "early days". Really? Do they want a time extension to get a trade done. Lamb's last day specials haven't exactly been a success. Billings is no different to Grundy and Hunter. Coming off a poor season, and is probably going to be cheap as chips for a reason. I'd rather have some of our kids pushing for selection than Billings. Or we may as well kept Harmes.

Manson family?

Melbs? WTF. 🤮

Where's @Nudge. Been awfully quiet. Would have thought his source would have come up with something concrete by now, seeing as though there is no reason to protect his source. Still waiting for the big fish as promised.

These stats are telling. The players who generally score from set shots have an excellent conversion rate. I haven't seen the stats across all teams, but it seems like our conversion rate against the better teams is poor. If that's the case, then it comes down to our scoring attempts in broken play. We rarely kick to the "hot spot" in broken play, instead we kick to the flank. Naturally this will lead to a lower conversion rate. So it boils down to the gameplan rather than just the players.

Yes we have enough of those types at the club in Kossie and Spargo.

It's my opinion that we don't take advantage of our midfield and defensive dominance during big games. Our transition out of defense was non existent during the finals. But that's a discussion for another thread.

We've lost Jordan but gained McAdams. 😁

I'm still bullish about our list, but you've ignored our coaching. We've lost 4 finals in a row over the last 2 seasons, and we can't keep making excuses. In 2022 the players were burnt out, and this year we were hit by injuries to our forwards. Those excuses don't cut it. Oh that's right, it's all due to loading, lol. Despite the top end talent in our team, our gamestyle is risk averse, and we have to grind out wins against the better teams. You can never question the effort of our players, but I just feel that due to Goody's gameplan, there is rarely any scoreboard reward for our efforts against better teams. Until I see some evidence of a gameplan tweak by Goody, I'll be a pessimist of our premiership chances.

No. Is on big money and really hasn't done anything for a while.