Leaderboard

Three days ago I wrote that I thought Garry Lyon had done a wonderful job. On reflection, after reading through this thread one more time, I think I might have underestimated his contribution. I wasn't previously aware, but accept the word of those who claim that in the aftermath of the Geelong game, Lyon convinced the Board that the proper course was to retain Cameron Schwab as CEO and to terminate Dean Bailey's contract as coach. In other words, Garry intervened to put the case for Schwab and against Bailey to the key personnel on the Board on that fateful Sunday after the Geelong game. It's not clear whether or not he was invited to do so but he convinced enough of them to take the tough decisions which, given the accolades now being heaped on Schwab and the almost universal view that Bailey had to go sometime soon, then the outcome has been to the club's benefit notwithstanding that it might have been carried out clumsily and poorly. Such a conclusion will inevitably lead to argument about whether the end is justified by the means and, as we've already seen, the historians and revisionists on this site have already joined in the rush to judgement. Was Lyon entitled to enter into the "inner sanctum" and offer his advice on the coaching position? I think one could mount a strong argument in his favour whether he was invited to do so or not. Lyon is a friend of Stynes, a former captain, club champion who played in excess of 200 games. In 2007, the previous board invited him to take part in the selection process to recommend a new coach after Neale Daniher. On Footy Classified he had expressed the view that he wouldn't relish being involved in such a process again. His views as to whether Bailey had lived up to his expectations would have been relevant and valuable to Board members in their deliberations at a time when the club was in crisis. Some might have a problem with that but I don't - we keep getting reminded that the club deliberately tanked for draft choices and handled the dismissal of a former captain poorly. We even once unceremoniously boned a club president in mid-term who had kicked $2.7m into the club. Compared to that where is the problem with taking advice from a former club icon at a time of crisis? Was the club placed at a disadvantage in doing so? But that's not all. The fact that every man and his dog seems to know that Garry was definitely involved somehow in the process that led to the decisions of 31 July 2011 is a prime example of the insidious process of information being leaked from the board - something that has been systemic at this club since the 60s. The failure to keep things "in house" is generally indicative of an organisation that is run poorly and it doesn't give me much pleasure to say this but over the years we've had many boards and administrations that have been poorly run and some were totally dysfunctional. And guess what? During those 5½ months with Lyon in charge, the decisions taken were, by and large, announced by the club without prior leaks to the media. A number of the appointments caught the media by surprise. Lyon was honest and transparent when questioned by the media but never gave them too much. He said we weren't after Ross Lyon and we weren't but the media continued to speculate. They got most of it wrong. Garry and co got things right. After all this time I consider this to be a breath of fresh air for the club. Garry's livelihood is in the media where he is a bit of a megastar and prime property for the 9 network. Can we begrudge him the right to an income at his time of life when he has three kids and family matters to address? Not everyone's an Eddie McGuire! So I'll say again that we owe a great debt to Garry, Don, Cam and Jimmy for the inspiration behind the last half year. But they're not gods. However, that these guys have achieved so much in such a short time and yet, there are those out there wringing their hands and angry about some perceived injustices which might well be grounded in the fertile imaginations of some mischief makers suggests to me that some of our supporters need to follow the lead of our new coach and the playing group and harden up.

Unless you're close to the players then you really don't know the character traits of the players involved and therefore it's difficult for us on the outside to gauge whether a player is right from that perspective. When interviewed on SEN last weekend, Mark Neeld gave nothing away and refused to dismiss any possibility - even joint captains (which I personally don't favour). I was left in no doubt that Neeld regards this appointment as fundamental to the future direction of the club and that his decision will be based on the need to look forward and not back. In terms of the age group from which our next captain will be selected, I think it will therefore be somewhere between Jack Trengove and James Frawley. I admire the ability of Jack Grimes as a player and think he's going to make a big difference when he gets on the park regularly, something that is now well overdue. He's had to endure that difficult period on the sidelines while things came crashing down at the club and it would not surprise that this experience would have added steel to his resolve. Everyone speaks highly of his character and he's my personal favorite for the job.

This thread started out congratulating and commending a job well done to Garry Lyon and has turned into a scathing attack and load of accusations about his motives and why won't he commit to the club. Then some of you decide to put the boot into Jimmy and suggest that he should step down or forced off because he is not able to do the job. One poster even suggested that empathy for someone should not come at the price of your values. Apparently you would be lying to yourself and them, but to me that statement only means your lying about the fact you have empathy at all. To me its like premising everything with "No offence but..." Either you feel empathy for some one or you don't. Don't hide your lack of empathy behind misplaced values and what you perceive is best for the club. Furthermore the Chairperson and the role of the chairperson is a figurehead in most ways, The running of the club administratively is run by the CEO and the Football department is now being run by Neil Craig with both area's reporting to the Board as a whole. Jimmy is not a dictator the Chairperson's power and influences stem from the boards support and the rule set out by the Club. Jimmy unwell is still able to assist the club , as Jimmy also has his persona, integrity and the networks he has built and forged in Melbourne both inside and outside of football. These are what he has used in the improvement of the club off field. Kick him out and see what happens to the people Jimmy has influenced in his life. Finally, what value do people think would be displayed by this club if it asked Jimmy to step down? If Jimmy said tomorrow he would step down then so be it, but to suggest we should ask him to step down, that would be a deplorable and cut throat act.

I just wanna see a huge "GOOD TIMES GRIMES" banner in the crowd. Would make my day. Would give someone $20 to make a huge banner saying "I LOVE TRENGROVE, PETTARD AND MALONEY!!"

I have concerns of the captaincy hindering performance regardless of the stage of development of a player. Green could not have been more senior and was clearly weighed down by it. Some players I think thrive under the responsibility and become better players because of it. I do not have enough inside knowledge to understand but I am sure those that will make the decision will look at how the candidates are likely to handle themselves and seriously take this into consideration. Grimes and Trengove captained their state at under 18 level and personally excelled under the microscope of AFL recruiters whilst leading their sides. That to me is not a bad indicator.

I would guess that the photo with Roland Roccospelling is related to the 'AFL cookbook', a publication that came out mid 90s to raise funds for the Trevor Barker foundation. Roland was the coordinator and interviewed all the contributors, and obviously there where photos taken. You're regular 'in the kitchen' dea like this. Please hold the line... Yea, Todd and family are in it - Spanish Chicken with saffron and olives. Blerk, I hate olives. Had a flick through when I picked it up - Stephen Tingay's chicken cacciatore recipe got a fair bit of use, judging by the splashes. Not a bad cookbook, actually, and some of the photos are interesting in a kind of 'I remember when' way.

A lot of revisionist history here - Darling wasn't a sure thing at all. Yes, he had a very impressive bottom-age year, but his final year of U/18 competition was decidedly average, beaten by Cook to U/18 AA CHF honours, and beaten consistently on the field by taller opponents. He currently (in 2011) plays as a high HFF, so any parallels to him being a KPF success are a reach. Some called for his drafting, but they for the most part were seduced by his style of play rather than the realityof the situation.

I always wonder how much a particular pick is the Draft Managers pick or the Coaches pick I would think the Draft managers job is to find, examine and classify the draftees then based on the coaches stated requirements, narrow down the options, make recommendations, then the coach having the final say. So I always see the draft picks as a combined effort with the coach being the final arbiter where necessary. The Draft Manager is just a (important) tool in the process and shouldn't bear all the blame if picks don't work out. This would be for most of the picks esp the high end. Surprise picks at the low end however are often more due to the Draft Manager's ability to spot talent. just my 2c worth

For round 13..... "you lied to Jim stynes"

Lucas Cook has to do three things. Put on some serious muscle Improve his attack on the ball Improve his hardness at the ball He has a long way to go before he proves himself and any comparison with Jack Watts at the same stage is farcical. Also getting a regular game with Casey firsts would help.

One of my favourite bands are "The Strokes" They have a bit of a retro sound and are from New York Macca 5.0

Do you have concerns over the captaincy hindering their playing development. I do and that's my worry.

Look what it did to Gary Ablett Jnr

Apologies if people were expecting a report from me but I had to compensate for the free morning with a late shift and we've only just finished cleaning up. I didn't take notes but there was a good little crowd out there today although conditions were not as sunny as I was expecting. The simulated match practice was interesting and entertaining, especially given that it's four weeks to go before the first intraclub and several players were either absent or obviously still doing rehab work. I had great difficulty picking up who were the newer players so I will concentrate on the one newbie who I did recognise immediately and that's Mitch Clark. There have been some unfavourable comments from Brisbane suggesting he won't make it as a key forward but I think he will make it. He looks more solid than he did playing for the Lions where he was shaded by Jonathan Brown and Bradshaw. I disagree with JumpinJeremyHowe about him being a bit slow. He moves alright and he has soft hands in the marking contest. If you think that JumpinJeremyHowe is biased because of his namesake then forget it. He could become something special in a very strong forward line. Where will they fit them all because Petterd was good and Liam should also be important up forward. Stef Martin also continues to improve in leaps and bounds. He proved he was a good back up ruck last year and I think he'll go better again in 2012. The midfield will improve if the training is any indication and I agree 100% that Moloney will be important but Gysberts could step up as that ball gatherer who not only gets it out of the middle but is creative once he's in the clear. Some people have suggested that Neeld delegates to assistants. He looked pretty hands on to me and he's designed a training routine that is so much more intense than I've seen in the past. All that means nothing if they can't prove themselves when the real thing starts.

I have found these sort of comments interesting over the last month or so of training reports; it appears there is a perception that what we see on the training track fully encapsulates the training program. Reading how Neeld describes his working week he is clearly across and involved in every element of the training regime. I base this on no first hand experience but I am positive that by the time the players get out onto the track everyone knows what their respective targets are. This leaves him to oversee rather than actively participate; after all that is exactly what his myriad coaches are there for. Go Dees

The stoppage drill with umpires ect, running to positions to set up ect sounded epically great. love the real simulation type stuff, game scenario ect Also, with the Assistants, no doubt Neeld coaches them to coach alot of training, then just takes it all in rather than being distracted by being a teacher and observer. He will have made nearly every move the day before imo.

Went down to Casey this morning. Great turn out plenty of supporters i thought. Happy to answer any questions on my observations but of particular note: Spent the bulk of the session doing match simulations in regards to setups and stoppages. Neeld would yell out “ball up on the 50” or “centre bounce” or “boundary throw in forward pocket” and have players run this way and everyway to get to the stoppage and set up correct. The second the stoppage was won then – BANG – off the run 50 metres to the next stoppage. AFL umpires in attendance to coordinate it all and award free kick if needed. Involved a lot of match related running and quick thinking about YOUR role for the team in every situation. Never seen this happen before, thought it was a smart and brilliant way to combine fitness while testing player’s knowledge. Gysberts excelled at this drill, our best clearance player behind Moloney and his slight frame would be the only thing that could stop him from a big impact this season. Tapscott, J Viney, Jurrah, Evans, Bartram and McKenzie were off on their own doing running. Bate wasn’t at training Magner is a MASSIVE unit, is just Nathan Jones number II and if he has the polish that some mature aged footballers lack to take the next step, will be our Ed Curnow this season. Serviceable and an astute pick i think. Jeremy Howe really does stand out. If you never seen or knew the players at the MFC and watched today’s session as a Draft Camp, you would say Howe is in the Top 5 most talented players on display and you would draft him!! Really liked Taggert’s presence and swagger around the track, he seems confident and contributes well. Not always the case – Maric was one example of someone who always seemed to be uncertain. Its not till you go to training that you appreciate the size of players, with the height of Morton and increased size on Blease catching my eye Davey and Green are very much class acts, their super goal kicking actual embarrassed their other forwards at times. Davey trained well to my eye, and i think the forward line will change his fortunes. Do think that Green’s “bad year” may be a little exaggerated it think. Cook is very much a development player, but his talent is there. Coming off a low base due to injury. He is Watts 2 years ago, and we all know what has happened to that man since. Give him time at Casey 2012 and judge him the year after. Clark is a serious size, a little slower than i thought but probably has bulked up since Brisbane to be the gorilla i need. The old “Speccy Bag” came out towards the end for the big fellas to take hangers. Petterd, Howe and Stef Martin the standouts here. LOVED IT!!! Troy Davis trained with the midfielders, and has nice skills and pace for a KPP. Good luck to him at Casey this year, he is a debut chance in 2012 Enjoyed my morning very much. In honestly don’t recognise my Club anymore. And i am wrapt!!!! We are prepared, have talent but also the structures to ensure its not just potential. Whether the Club wants me to or not, i have Top 8 expectation this season now.

That's a big part of the concern I've got with Garry - doesn't want to commit to real ongoing involvement but wants to stick his oar in when it suits him.

Nitpicking? Hardly. Jimmy saved the club? No, he did not. Cam got sponsors. Many people threw their hard-earned at the club. Decisions about development, training and list management were already in place before Jim arrived. Jim built a facade and lots of people did the saving. Jim was a supremely effective figurehead and absolutely crucial to it all - but let's not get starry eyed. Gary saved the club? Old is bang-on. Gary gets to be responsibility-free. All glory, no cost. That might not be bad - hell, I don't know. It is worth noticing though. And now he gets to back to the dark room of melbourne intra-club politics. And comment from a distance while nestled in the inner sactum (and deny it, too). This is NOT to denigrate his efforts or decisions. I want it all to work. I also want to see it for what it is. I'll see your 'nitpicking' and raise you 'spin-free understanding'.

We need more quality expression on here Allus Monk, so I plead with you to post more. Romanticism and lyricism go hand in hand with football, and particularly as it relates to those all too emotionally invested observers........US! Heading into the realm of intangible character observation (if not spiritual fantasy), whilst I'm a huge fan of Brent Moloney and Nathan Jones as uncompromising club men, I have never, at any club, over too many decades, seen more obvious captain material than Jack Trengove. Maybe not this year, but just as next thursday is Australia Day, it is a cosmic certainty he will be captain of this football club, a premiership captain, and one of the greatest in our history.

My mail is Green wont be seriously considered to captain again. Several players including some quite senior ones, have been given the mother of all rev ups, as they are seen to be not serious enough about doing all the hard yards with the right attitude. " Tougher is better". Apathy will not be tolerated anymore and the whole playing list has been warned to lift their training efforts, BIGTIME! This spray has happened behind closed doors and not in front of supporters. The danger was that younger players would accept this mediocre attitude again................IT WONT BE ALLOWED TO HAPPEN WITHOUT CONSEQUENCES! Some with bruised egos have been told to grow up and go harder or go home! Lets see if my informer has it right.

Neeld was quite explicit about the process for selecting the captain in a radio interview on Saturday. He said that the coaching staff were drawing up a list of leadership attributes that they consider to be necessary for a club captain, and they will each rate every player under every one of these attributes. The input of the playing group will also be sought, but it sounds like it won't be as influential as it seemed to be under the Leading Teams model. The final decision will actually be Neeld's and his alone, though obviously you'd expect he'd take the views of others into account to some extent. The implication of this is that there are unlikely to be maneouverings in the captaincy - i.e. Green (for example) to be appointed captain for this year to allow Grimes & Trengove a year to "audition" for the captaincy in 2013 & beyond. Furthermore, it looks like the captain will be selected purely because of their leadership or captaincy attributes (they may or may not be the same thing) in the here and now, rather than their potential at some time in the future. Therefore, if a young captain - Grimes, Trengove, or even Jones - is selected, it will be because of their demonstrated leadership attributes as of late 2011 & early 2012 in the opinion of the coaching staff overall, and as such, they will have immediate legitimacy. This only makes the final choice even more interesting. It won't necessarily be the most popular with the players, or the one who may be the best captain in 2015. I think MFC has had enough of "selections" (in various ways) being made on future potential rather than on current form, and it seems to me that Neeld has made a strong stand against this type of thinking. This process of selecting the captain bears this out even more strongly IMHO.

Yes.

yeah i'm not writing Green off as a player just yet, still has a very goot set shot and takes a good grab. I actually dont think he played many really poor games last year. The media got on him in a big way which probably didnt help his form in the latter part of the season. Yes he didnt kick as many as the year before but he wasnt as bad as alot make out