2 minutes ago, Demonstone said:

It's a skill, not a tactic. Always has been.

Dare I say you might be conflating tactics and gameplan ?

All well and good to have the idea of what to do,but if you can't actually do it.....

Bit like wanting to make something. You have an idea and the drawings but not the necessary a abilities to craft the result desired.

This is is, unfortunately. We aspire to what we can't do.

2 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

Dare I say you might be conflating tactics and gameplan ?

What's the difference?

7 minutes ago, Demonstone said:

It's a skill, not a tactic. Always has been.

Our Forward Line is not set up correctly

That is a tactic

4 minutes ago, ElDiablo14 said:

I am of the idea that raw data is overrated, we should focus more on analytics.

Efficiency is king. Take for example the NBA.

Yeah I don’t disagree but I think Goody and co are well aware that we simply do not have that many accurate kicks on our list and we also lack any traditional dominant forwards. So efficiency without those two things is nearly impossible and therefore the only way we can compete is via volume.

**with that said, the goalkicking yesterday was shocking to the point that we could’ve had 10 more opportunities in that second half and I’m not sure we would’ve had more than one or two goals more.

Edited June 2Jun 2 by Disco InTurno

Just now, Disco InTurno said:

Yeah I don’t disagree but I think Goody and co are well aware that we simply do not have that many accurate kicks on our list and we also lack any traditional dominant forwards. So efficiency without those two things is nearly impossible and therefore the only way we can compete is via volume.

Then we are doomed to fail, no matter how much we dominate all other facets of the game.

At least try to generate goal opportunities in a different way. More chaos play around the goal square than set shots.

2 minutes ago, Sir Why You Little said:

Our Forward Line is not set up correctly

That is a tactic

That doesn't explain players missing from 30 - 40 metres out dead in front.

Refer M. Gawn, D. Turner, J. Melksham and others yesteday. It's the skill that's not up to standard.

4 minutes ago, Demonstone said:

What's the difference?

One is part of the other.

Gameplan requires tactics.

You apply various tactics to an overall strategy ( gameplan )

Other than a choreographed rehearsal you can only practice tactics and hope to bring them to bear in a game.

I don’t think using yesterday as a guide to judging us is useful. Yes it paints part of the picture but we were off. On top of that Lyon outcoached Goodwin in that his tactics worked. That doesn’t always happen. We defended transition very poorly which for me was the most disappointing aspect of the game. Nothing cost us more than this. I found Butler’s cheap goals incredibly infuriating. Windsor needs to be much better than that but he’s learning and that’s not a straight line. Now for Collingwood, it doesn’t matter how well we play if we don’t kick straight we’ll lose.

13 minutes ago, ElDiablo14 said:

At least try to generate goal opportunities in a different way. More chaos play around the goal square than set shots.

Long bombs to the goal square! 😀

29 minutes ago, Demonstone said:

It's a skill, not a tactic. Always has been.

But it can be rectified. Why do you think, as an example why Novak Djokovic, the arguable GOAT of tennis and even sports is still churning through coaches in the twilight of his career to prolong his tennis journey?

He knows his serving and net/volleying game has been an issue throughout his career and is still making conscious efforts to rectify such issus to try and win more Slams.

Djokovic has worked tirelessly to correct such weaknesses, so what evidence do we have that suggests MFC has done to correct theirs? Have we really gone above and beyond? On what we have seen consistently over the last 5 years, I would say no.

For 5 years goal kicking has been an issue. Heck, forgetting the 2 back to back straight sets exits, back in 2020, we lost to mediocre Fremantle and bottom 4 Sydney consecutively due to goal kicking which cost us a finals spot.

I really don’t mind losing, but the way in which we continually lose does my head in.

Edited June 2Jun 2 by VNightCityLegend

41 minutes ago, Disco InTurno said:

Yeah I don’t disagree but I think Goody and co are well aware that we simply do not have that many accurate kicks on our list and we also lack any traditional dominant forwards. So efficiency without those two things is nearly impossible and therefore the only way we can compete is via volume.

**with that said, the goalkicking yesterday was shocking to the point that we could’ve had 10 more opportunities in that second half and I’m not sure we would’ve had more than one or two goals more.

They were not difficult shots yesterday

Most of them were regulation, it was lazy preparation and execution

41 minutes ago, Demonstone said:

That doesn't explain players missing from 30 - 40 metres out dead in front.

Refer M. Gawn, D. Turner, J. Melksham and others yesteday. It's the skill that's not up to standard.

No that’s just plain lazy.

Alice Springs is purely a Junket and needs to be stopped

But that’s another topic

45 minutes ago, Demonstone said:

That doesn't explain players missing from 30 - 40 metres out dead in front.

Refer M. Gawn, D. Turner, J. Melksham and others yesteday. It's the skill that's not up to standard.

Can we employ an ex forward player to teach our blokes how to kick goals.?

For example D Neitz?

Just thinking on our defence, I liked that we tried Turner forward in the last, but he seemed lost after that first shot on goal.

We certainly have issues with our KPFs, but Petty is serviceable and JVR will find some form at some stage. The bigger questions for me surround our defensive set up.

I have genuine question marks over May and Lever moving forward. May because he's starting to lose 1v1s and is slowing down. Lever because he struggles to play on smalls or talls and if the game is fast, I don't trust him to win contests behind the ball.

May started to try and hit the corridor kicks yesterday and we need more of that at the right time.

Turner needs to stay back IMV and I know @Slartibartfast is a Howes fan like me and has suggested if Howes came in, Windsor could shift to the wing, perhaps Lindsay to half back to use his pace and ball use.

I also hope we get Adams into the team if there are injuries to May or Lever moving forward.

I'd structure the back half of the ground as follows:

Howes May McVee

Bowey Turner Lever / Lindsay

Windsor Oliver Langford

Langdon and Chandler to remain high half forwards. Rivers to stay in the midfield.

We were dead in the water at 0-5.

Dead.

I’ve enjoyed the wins but at no stage did I feel we were a chance to make September.

You have to bank winnable games if you’re serious about playing finals after the season we had in 24.

Season died at 0-5, became slightly undead at 5-6, became very dead in Alice again.

Sod off with the Alice Springs game.

28 minutes ago, Adam The God said:

Just thinking on our defence, I liked that we tried Turner forward in the last, but he seemed lost after that first shot on goal.

We certainly have issues with our KPFs, but Petty is serviceable and JVR will find some form at some stage. The bigger questions for me surround our defensive set up.

I have genuine question marks over May and Lever moving forward. May because he's starting to lose 1v1s and is slowing down. Lever because he struggles to play on smalls or talls and if the game is fast, I don't trust him to win contests behind the ball.

May started to try and hit the corridor kicks yesterday and we need more of that at the right time.

Turner needs to stay back IMV and I know @Slartibartfast is a Howes fan like me and has suggested if Howes came in, Windsor could shift to the wing, perhaps Lindsay to half back to use his pace and ball use.

I also hope we get Adams into the team if there are injuries to May or Lever moving forward.

I'd structure the back half of the ground as follows:

Howes May McVee

Bowey Turner Lever / Lindsay

Windsor Oliver Langford

Langdon and Chandler to remain high half forwards. Rivers to stay in the midfield.

We may as well try everything now.

The Season is shot…

7.21 F@$”? Me😡

20 minutes ago, FearTheBeard said:

Sod off with the Alice Springs game.

Agreed. Maybe we could look at instead hosting an annual pre season fixture, spend a week up there in late Feb and net a $250K sponsorship, and then ask for an increased AFL distribution to recoup the shortfall. Play the 11th home game at Marvel.

Yesterday was an immature performance against a team that shows up and plays solid footy 1 in every 3 weeks.

The club should aim to win 5 of its last 10 games and end the season at a mediocre (but not embarrassing) 10-13.

Edited June 2Jun 2 by Bring-Back-Powell

1 hour ago, Sir Why You Little said:

They were not difficult shots yesterday

Most of them were regulation, it was lazy preparation and execution

You're funny.

So it's not the coaching or the game plan or the skills that caused us to miss easy shots, it's the players' attitude.

And it's also because of the venue. (never mind we can't kick straight on the MCG either)

I think I know what you're trying to say. It's Mabo. It's the vibe.

19 minutes ago, Demonstone said:

You're funny.

So it's not the coaching or the game plan or the skills that caused us to miss easy shots, it's the players' attitude.

And it's also because of the venue. (never mind we can't kick straight on the MCG either)

I think I know what you're trying to say. It's Mabo. It's the vibe.

Just where do you think attitudes are created , then nurtured?? 🤔

42 minutes ago, Demonstone said:

You're funny.

So it's not the coaching or the game plan or the skills that caused us to miss easy shots, it's the players' attitude.

And it's also because of the venue. (never mind we can't kick straight on the MCG either)

I think I know what you're trying to say. It's Mabo. It's the vibe.

You may find all this funny, but I don’t

People spend a lot of money to get to Alice, to a game i don’t think should be there to be served up the rubbish we were given yesterday

We should go up there in the preseason in my opinion.

Skils, execution and coaching are not up to scratch, that was VFL standards yesterday

McRae will rip us to shreds next monday, the Filth know how to kick goals, last Friday they had free players everywhere

3 hours ago, VNightCityLegend said:

But it can be rectified. Why do you think, as an example why Novak Djokovic, the arguable GOAT of tennis and even sports is still churning through coaches in the twilight of his career to prolong his tennis journey?

He knows his serving and net/volleying game has been an issue throughout his career and is still making conscious efforts to rectify such issus to try and win more Slams.

Djokovic has worked tirelessly to correct such weaknesses, so what evidence do we have that suggests MFC has done to correct theirs? Have we really gone above and beyond? On what we have seen consistently over the last 5 years, I would say no.

For 5 years goal kicking has been an issue. Heck, forgetting the 2 back to back straight sets exits, back in 2020, we lost to mediocre Fremantle and bottom 4 Sydney consecutively due to goal kicking which cost us a finals spot.

I really don’t mind losing, but the way in which we continually lose does my head in.

My thought exactly. Can anyone name one player who’s hands you wanted the ball in in the last quarter.

A 5 - 7 win/loss record, a percentage below 90% and six losses of 28 points or more. That is not the profile of a finals side, nor is losing (by big margins) to all of North Melbourne, Essendon and St Kilda. Clearly our season is dead and has been for a long time.

The Brisbane game was a pleasant surprise, but the reality is that we've beaten nobody else this year and certainly not by a margin that would suggest that we have come to terms with the way we need to play.

Collingwood on Kings Birthday is not the time to throw the magnets around and take risks (it will be ugly enough with the current group), but thereafter we need to get games into that next tier of players.

That gives us 10 games to work out whether the likes of Fullarton, Henderson, Culley, Howes, Woewodin, Brown, Kentfield, Sestan and Verrall have a future before we need to make a decision regarding new contracts. Howes, Brown, Woewodin and Sestan are the key names that we have to take a look at, because none of these really justify more time on the list if they don't show some serious signs in a hurry.