Jump to content


Recommended Posts

Posted (edited)

I'm not going to postulate on what this means...if anything.

However I calculated all the travel accrued by each team, each round for a total figure, As well as the amount of times travel occurred.

And...here are the results.

And yes, Melbourne are on top of distance and on flights taken. Is it meaningful? Perhaps.

 

 

Screen Shot 2020-09-09 at 7.43.00 am.png

Edited by Engorged Onion
  • Like 4
  • Thanks 2
  • Angry 1

Posted (edited)

Only slightly worse than Geelong who are flying and Sydney are playing better towards the end of this season, understand your point but interstate clubs do this every second week normally, West Coast go ok as do Brisbane and Port. Cairns is a 2hr flight and it is our choice to play in Alice Springs for financial reasons. I can understand if we were getting fatigued towards end of games, but that certainly hasn't been a factor in the last two games, we just don't turn up, with any sort of plan and lack effort, that's inexcusable.

Edited by SFebes
  • Like 2

Posted (edited)

Good idea, let’s give the players & supporters another excuse for the pathetic performances that have been the norm over the last 56 years

The MFC Number 1 in deflection of blame

Edited by Billy
  • Like 1
Posted (edited)

I think I've missed one.  For the 7 I could find my thoughts are:

  • Perth round 1 - we had a month or two to recover.
  • Sydney Hub - to be our 'Home' for the rest of the season.
  • Qld Hub - this wasn't in the hub plan.  We had to relocate on short notice because Qld were closing its borders to NSW,
  • Adel 2 games - the club made a good travel decision by staying in Adel for the North game. 
  • Alice - the club asked for this to get the $700k from the NT gov't.  
  • Cairns - we were one of the few teams that hadn't played both Syd and Freo who are hubbed there.  The club made a good travel decision by staying in Cairns.
  • Qld hub.

It could have been worse: Adel to Hobart as originally scheduled and if not allowed to stay in Adel and Cairns for subsequent games.

Can I ask how the count is done eg I count 4 for Carlton: Melb to Qld Hub to Perth to Darwin to Qld Hub.  And for Adelaide I count 5-6 as they have flown in/out of Adel to Qld for their away games in the latter part of the season.  Haven't looked at any others.

Some people think the AFL has messed us around but a lot of it has been out of their control.  I'm pretty sure the AFL asked clubs their preferences at different times.  The more successful teams (wins and/or members) got pandered to more.  We aren't one of those and it was bad luck we were slated to a Syd hub first up then had to move.

If the idea of the Travel Table is the impact of travel on Wins/Losses, including the # days breaks and travel of our opp in each round would give a broader base on which to draw conclusions.  Bit short of time to do that comparison this morning but might give it a go for the dees, later.

Edited by Lucifer's Hero
  • Like 1
Posted
11 minutes ago, Billy said:

Good idea, let’s give the players & supporters another excuse for the pathetic performances that have been the norm over the last 56 years

The MFC Number 1 in deflection of blame

I'm sure you're hurting @Billy - and that's ok. 

But as I'm not a staff member of the MFC - they're not deflecting blame. Actually, nor am I. 

This is a sense making tool... and it's fine that you see it as an excuse.

  • Like 6

Posted
7 minutes ago, Billy said:

Good idea, let’s give the players & supporters another excuse for the pathetic performances that have been the norm over the last 56 years

The MFC Number 1 in deflection of blame

This attitude is a bit like congratulating the Black Knight for not making excuses as his limbs are lopped off.   Of course there is always a danger of hiding behind excuses but it is equally foolish to ignore facts which may be valid reasons contributing to poor performance.   I suspect if the team bus was hit by a meteorite there'd be some saying excuses excuses.  

And I don't care if supporters want to comfort themselves by making 'excuses'. We have negligible influence and need to maintain our sanity.  Players and coaches are another matter of course.

 

  • Like 4
  • Thanks 2
Posted
10 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

I think I've missed one.  For the 7 I could find my thoughts are:

  • Perth round 1 - we had a month or two to recover.
  • Sydney Hub - to be our 'Home' for the rest of the season.
  • Qld Hub - this wasn't in the hub plan.  We had to relocate on short notice because Qld were closing its borders to NSW,
  • Adel 2 games - the club made a good travel decision by staying in Adel for the North game. 
  • Alice - the asked for this to get the $700k from the NT gov't.  
  • Cairns - we were one of the few teams that hadn't played both Syd and Freo who are hubbed there.  The club made a good travel decision by staying in Adel
  • Qld hub.

Can I ask how the count is done eg I count 4 for Carlton: Melb to Qld Hub to Perth to Darwin to Qld Hub.  And for Adelaide I count 6-7 as they have flown out of Adel to Qld for their away games in the latter part of the season.  Haven't looked at any others.

If the idea is the impact of travel on Wins/Losses, the # days breaks and travel of our opp in each round would give a broader base on which to draw conclusions.

Bit short of time to do that comparison this morning but might give it a go for the dees, later.

Lucifer - I did it quite quick and I suspect there are some inaccuracies..ie: the notion of Geelong flying to Perth, hubbing it up and then up to QLD.

Good point re: Adelaide - I merely looked at round by round fixtures to ascertain if they played in the same state. 

I guess I was looking at it in a compressed fixtures situation. Essentially Melbourne had 14 days of travel from July 6th to September 2nd.

Rubbish data in...rubbish results :) I'll spend a bit more time this afternoon- reconciling some of the data.

 

  • Like 1
Posted (edited)
24 minutes ago, Engorged Onion said:

Lucifer - I did it quite quick and I suspect there are some inaccuracies..ie: the notion of Geelong flying to Perth, hubbing it up and then up to QLD.

Good point re: Adelaide - I merely looked at round by round fixtures to ascertain if they played in the same state. 

I guess I was looking at it in a compressed fixtures situation. Essentially Melbourne had 14 days of travel from July 6th to September 2nd.

Rubbish data in...rubbish results :) I'll spend a bit more time this afternoon- reconciling some of the data.

Thanks.  Your underlying point is still valid:  I have little doubt we will have the worst travel schedule. 

I was planning to do the #breaks/travel for our opps before I saw this thread as I suspect it (and fatigue) will be a much debated topic, especially if we miss finals.  

I'll p m it to you to look at but it may not be til mid afternoon.

Edited by Lucifer's Hero
  • Like 1

Posted
1 hour ago, Billy said:

Good idea, let’s give the players & supporters another excuse for the pathetic performances that have been the norm over the last 56 years

The MFC Number 1 in deflection of blame

That's slightly harsh.  I don't think @Engorged Onion is using it as an excuse.  And I don't think any Melbourne supporter really wants excuses anymore.  What we've served up recently is inexcusable.

However, the above table is something that can't be ignored, as its fact.  Has all that travel begun to catch up with us a little, and contributed slightly to our recent performances?  Probably.

But if we miss finals, it won't save Goodwin's job I'd say.  He can't go in and complain about the travel and so forth.  He has to own it.  But, for us supporters, there is some merit in what Engorged has posted.

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 1
Posted

The players are human, and constantly moving would have a significant effect. I never sleep properly the first night anywhere away from home, and unlike other clubs, the team have pretty much not stayed in the same location for more than a week at a time.

Players in other sports such as NBA or cricket are used to it, but AFL players are not. Experienced ones like Dangerfield will deal with it better, and also clubs with a lot of experienced players (Geelong, Port, Richmond).

  • Like 4

Posted
1 hour ago, sue said:

This attitude is a bit like congratulating the Black Knight for not making excuses as his limbs are lopped off.   Of course there is always a danger of hiding behind excuses but it is equally foolish to ignore facts which may be valid reasons contributing to poor performance.   I suspect if the team bus was hit by a meteorite there'd be some saying excuses excuses.  

And I don't care if supporters want to comfort themselves by making 'excuses'. We have negligible influence and need to maintain our sanity.  Players and coaches are another matter of course.

 

Always the voice of reason sue, well said.

Posted
3 minutes ago, Clintosaurus said:

The players are human, and constantly moving would have a significant effect. I never sleep properly the first night anywhere away from home, and unlike other clubs, the team have pretty much not stayed in the same location for more than a week at a time.

Players in other sports such as NBA or cricket are used to it, but AFL players are not. Experienced ones like Dangerfield will deal with it better, and also clubs with a lot of experienced players (Geelong, Port, Richmond).

I second this, and not to mention there have been a couple of game days where they are waking at 4am or 5am, catching a bus and then a flight, and then flying back to the hub to return to the hotel by 3am. The ripple effect from huge days like that can be felt for some time.

Posted

This adds to the data I was looking at on the fixture - in addition to league-leading flights and kms covered, we had the equal most four day breaks, the most states/territories played in, the most venues played in, the least number of consecutive games in the one place, and no more than 3 games all year at any one venue.

  • Like 1
Posted
31 minutes ago, titan_uranus said:

This adds to the data I was looking at on the fixture - in addition to league-leading flights and kms covered, we had the equal most four day breaks, the most states/territories played in, the most venues played in, the least number of consecutive games in the one place, and no more than 3 games all year at any one venue.

I'd add to this the 2 teams which had a bye when they didn't need one and didn't get one when they did need it.  With these 'frenzies' it must be important to get a week off. We and EFC did not. Both have gone down the tube recently.

  • Like 1
Posted (edited)

Here is a table which summarises our travel and # days break since we had to Melbourne after round 5.  For those counting trips add round 1 to Perth.

It shows how we compare to our opp in each round rather than compare the season in total.

image.png.5f5a82d33482fb66b36550078c44c3b8.png

E&OE

Please let me know if you see any errors.

Edit:  this is intended as a discussion tool rather than a view of whether we were badly done by travel or the question of fatigue.

Edited by Lucifer's Hero
  • Like 1
  • Thanks 3

Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Here is a table which summarises our travel and # days break since we had to Melbourne after round 5.  For those counting trips add round 1 to Perth.

It shows our we compare to our opp in each round rather than compare the season in total.

image.png.20cbe015e21f19bda97c4f9e6c66ccec.png

E&OE

Please let me know if you see any errors.

So we've had 3 more days break and 1 less day of travel v opponents? Not so bad afterall eh. Also, 3 x 4day breaks for us vs 4 for our opponents. No excuse! Plus 2 of the opponents 4 day breaks have been when we've had 6.

Edited by SFebes
Posted
2 minutes ago, SFebes said:

So we've had 3 more days break and 1 less day of travel v opponents? Not so bad afterall eh.

The good news is if the '4 day break = a loss' experience for many clubs holds this week, we should beat Giants!

  • Haha 2
Posted
Just now, Lucifer's Hero said:

The good news is if the '4 day break = a loss' experience for many clubs holds this week, we should beat Giants!

Um no, we will still find a way to break that record this year!

  • Haha 1

Posted

It plays a part the short breaks and the big one in the last 5 rounds is the constant traveling and lack of continuous days in 1 spot to get into a routine.

Those saying interstate teams do it all the time, they do but that's every second week and a routine they are set in over a number of years and generally with set fixtures released the October before the season starts.

Don't get me wrong there are other issues but to say it hasn't been a factor is nonsense

  • Like 7
  • Thanks 1
Posted
42 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Here is a table which summarises our travel and # days break since we had to Melbourne after round 5.  For those counting trips add round 1 to Perth.

It shows how we compare to our opp in each round rather than compare the season in total.

image.png.5f5a82d33482fb66b36550078c44c3b8.png

E&OE

Please let me know if you see any errors.

Another thing to note is when we have played at Metricon we have traveled down the day before and stayed overnight close to the ground to avoid a 3hr+ bus trip while the Lions traveled 30 mins from Brisbane and the WB 5 mins from there hub. Not to mention the extra late nights travelling back from Bris airport to hub from Alice and Adel.

Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Grimes Times said:

Another thing to note is when we have played at Metricon we have traveled down the day before and stayed overnight close to the ground to avoid a 3hr+ bus trip while the Lions traveled 30 mins from Brisbane and the WB 5 mins from there hub. Not to mention the extra late nights travelling back from Bris airport to hub from Alice and Adel.

Agreed, there was only so much I could fit into a table. 

It is more of a discussion tool than a view on whether we were well done by or not.

Edited by Lucifer's Hero
  • Like 1
Posted

Can someone do a table on the number of beds each teams' players have slept in during the course of the season and the average number of consecutive nights slept in each bed? It's maybe tongue-in-cheek but I do think this would provide the most indicative metric of our travel burden as opposed to simply the physical boarding of flights. A two hour flight in of itself shouldn't take too much of a toll. 

Pennant hit the key word earlier in 'routine'. It would be one of the most consistent points made by champions across all sports. All teams have been disrupted this year but our schedule has more closely resembled a band on tour (or travelling circus for the cynics). Consecutive games in Adelaide and Cairns sound great, but it feels like we've been on the road for the entirety of the season. 

Compare for instance the feeling of having stayed for just four weeks alone at a single base, even with a fly-in fly-out interstate trip or two? I hadn't heard it before but I'm staggered to learn we've also been over-nighting on the Gold Coast before our Metricon games. I get that this has all come about due in part to circumstance and our own requirements - but it's a valid lens by which to assess the season. 

 

  • Like 1
  • Shocked 1
Posted
6 minutes ago, Skuit said:

Can someone do a table on the number of beds each teams' players have slept in during the course of the season and the average number of consecutive nights slept in each bed? It's maybe tongue-in-cheek but I do think this would provide the most indicative metric of our travel burden as opposed to simply the physical boarding of flights. A two hour flight in of itself shouldn't take too much of a toll. 

Pennant hit the key word earlier in 'routine'. It would be one of the most consistent points made by champions across all sports. All teams have been disrupted this year but our schedule has more closely resembled a band on tour (or travelling circus for the cynics). Consecutive games in Adelaide and Cairns sound great, but it feels like we've been on the road for the entirety of the season. 

Compare for instance the feeling of having stayed for just four weeks alone at a single base, even with a fly-in fly-out interstate trip or two? I hadn't heard it before but I'm staggered to learn we've also been over-nighting on the Gold Coast before our Metricon games. I get that this has all come about due in part to circumstance and our own requirements - but it's a valid lens by which to assess the season. 

 

We have had probably the worst run in routine of any club, changing venues and travelling more than any other club in the AFL. 

  • Like 2
Posted

Another point - and an ironic reversal of 2019: Is missing the finals last year detrimental to teams this year? It's been a bloody long season (and it seems we put in a massive pre-season too) and those teams which started their pre-seasons later are probably better placed to cope with mental fatigue right now. Small advantages make a difference in this competition. 

  • Like 1
Posted

Just read the AFL are letting the Bulldogs fly to Cairns the day before they play Freo in Round 18. What a joke. We were not allowed to, and the article says the club were furious at being forced to travel on game day. Dogs also fly to Adelaide the day before this weekend too.

Anyone think the whole thing is not rigged?

  • Thanks 2

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Unfortunately, your content contains terms that we do not allow. Please edit your content to remove the highlighted words below.
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
  • Demonland Forums  

  • Match Previews, Reports & Articles  

    2024 Player Reviews: #15 Ed Langdon

    The Demon running machine came back with a vengeance after a leaner than usual year in 2023.  Date of Birth: 1 February 1996 Height: 182cm Games MFC 2024: 22 Career Total: 179 Goals MFC 2024: 9 Career Total: 76 Brownlow Medal Votes: 5 Melbourne Football Club: 5th Best & Fairest: 352 votes

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 6

    2024 Player Reviews: #24 Trent Rivers

    The premiership defender had his best year yet as he was given the opportunity to move into the midfield and made a good fist of it. Date of Birth: 30 July 2001 Games MFC 2024: 23 Career Total: 100 Goals MFC 2024: 2 Career Total:  9 Brownlow Medal Votes: 7 Melbourne Football Club: 6th Best & Fairest: 350 votes

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 2

    TRAINING: Monday 11th November 2024

    Veteran Demonland Trackwatchers Kev Martin, Slartibartfast & Demon Wheels were on hand at Gosch's Paddock to kick off the official first training session for the 1st to 4th year players with a few elder statesmen in attendance as well. KEV MARTIN'S PRESEASON TRAINING OBSERVATIONS Beautiful morning. Joy all round, they look like they want to be there.  21 in the squad. Looks like the leadership group is TMac, Viney Chandler and Petty. They look like they have sli

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Training Reports 2

    2024 Player Reviews: #1 Steven May

    The years are rolling by but May continued to be rock solid in a key defensive position despite some injury concerns. He showed great resilience in coming back from a nasty rib injury and is expected to continue in that role for another couple of seasons. Date of Birth: 10 January 1992 Height: 193cm Games MFC 2024: 19 Career Total: 235 Goals MFC 2024: 1 Career Total: 24 Melbourne Football Club: 9th Best & Fairest: 316 votes

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons

    2024 Player Reviews: #4 Judd McVee

    It was another strong season from McVee who spent most of his time mainly at half back but he also looked at home on a few occasions when he was moved into the midfield. There could be more of that in 2025. Date of Birth: 7 August 2003 Height: 185cm Games MFC 2024: 23 Career Total: 48 Goals MFC 2024: 1 Career Total: 1 Brownlow Medal Votes: 1 Melbourne Football Club: 7th Best & Fairest: 347 votes

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 5

    2024 Player Reviews: #31 Bayley Fritsch

    Once again the club’s top goal scorer but he had a few uncharacteristic flat spots during the season and the club will be looking for much better from him in 2025. Date of Birth: 6 December 1996 Height: 188cm Games MFC 2024: 23 Career Total: 149 Goals MFC 2024: 41 Career Total: 252 Brownlow Medal Votes: 4

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 9

    2024 Player Reviews: #18 Jake Melksham

    After sustaining a torn ACL in the final match of the 2023 season Jake added a bit to the attack late in the 2024 season upon his return. He has re-signed on to the Demons for 1 more season in 2025. Date of Birth: 12 August 1991 Height: 186cm Games MFC 2024: 8 Career Total: 229 Goals MFC 2024: 8 Career Total: 188

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 7

    2024 Player Reviews: #3 Christian Salem

    The luckless Salem suffered a hamstring injury against the Lions early in the season and, after missing a number of games, he was never at his best. He was also inconvenienced by minor niggles later in the season. This was a blow for the club that sorely needed him to fill gaps in the midfield at times as well as to do his best work in defence. Date of Birth: 15 July 1995 Height: 184cm Games MFC 2024: 17 Career Total: 176 Goals MFC 2024: 1 Career Total: 26 Brownlow Meda

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 8

    2024 Player Reviews: #39 Koltyn Tholstrop

    The first round draft pick at #13 from twelve months ago the strongly built medium forward has had an impressive introduction to AFL football and is expected to spend more midfield moments as his career progresses. Date of Birth: 25 July 2005 Height: 186cm Games MFC 2024: 10 Career Total: 10 Goals MFC 2024: 5 Career Total: 5 Games CDFC 2024: 7 Goals CDFC 2024: 4

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 9
  • Tell a friend

    Love Demonland? Tell a friend!

×
×
  • Create New...