Post Match Discussion - Preliminary Final

[beelzebub 23,370]

5 minutes ago, Redleg said:

I said we need more and if he is not up to it so be it, but we need more. We had no spread Saturday and were killed because we couldn’t move the ball with skill. 

 

Move it ? Couldn't get hold of it !!

[Jones 62]

4 minutes ago, Mardo said:

Not entirely relevant but just consider _  I think the boys played 3x final games the weeks previous ( not inc our win game against depleted WCoast ). At Optus prelim they were 'cooked' ; almost literally as it got to 28 degrees on ground apparently. Add that to just an absolutely down on your luck day. The pill just was not on our side.

They should have been better prepared. It was a prelim final for goodness sake. They should have know what to expect, we all did!

[jumbo returns 6,741]

8 minutes ago, Redleg said:

I said we need more and if he is not up to it so be it, but we need more. We had no spread Saturday and were killed because we couldn’t move the ball with skill. 

 

So.....where do you think we’ll find a pacy, line breaker that can deliver with some skill? 

Right now, it ain’t Hunt

[Redleg 40,915]

3 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

Move it ? Couldn't get hold of it !!

I think we had more inside 50’s than Eagles if my memory is correct. Therefore we had chances. Ball use killed us. Lack of pace to get clear killed us. Nerves killed us. Leaders killed us.Luck also killed us with ball bouncing their way on nearly every occasion.

[Redleg 40,915]

1 minute ago, jumbo returns said:

So.....where do you think we’ll find a pacy, line breaker that can deliver with some skill? 

Right now, it ain’t Hunt

Same places other sides do.

[Mardo 46]

1 minute ago, Jones said:

They should have been better prepared. It was a prelim final for goodness sake. They should have know what to expect, we all did!

Just adding those points if they had not been mentioned - the weather I think made them look flat from the start and the ball was not on our side. All games I think have approx 20% luck with the ball. West coast got the full 20%.

The other 80% of game requiring the elements you can control : Agreed , we were mostly absent.

 

[praha 11,240]

Just now, Jones said:

It's not an excuse to lose by 11 goals and break the record to have the worse first half score in a finals game!

Absolutely embarrassing.

No one gives a [censored] about that statistic mate. Pies scored 1.5 in a half vs Geelong in 2009. They lost by 80 points and then won the flag 12 months later.

[Superunknown 4,217]

An embarrassing and sad loss yesterday. On a micro level, bad.

Feels like a death in the family.

I've felt a blanket of bleakness this year - expected to lose the PF, but the manner in which we lost was not good enough - but, again, I think sunnier times are upon us.

Take a deep breath and step back and there's a lot to like.

Yesterday will be a lesson. Not to get ahead of one's self and what it takes to win a PF.

This was a total wasted chance to snatch a flag. The disgusting ST Kilda game, add in a Geelong win (or two) and perhaps Port and we are top 4 (or two) and the finals look a lot different. Maybe a W1 win and a week's breather. Maybe no WC over there. I hope Goodwin rams that home. There may not be another one any time soon.

Anyway, would be easy to fall apart, but...

There lots of upside going forward.

Notably...

Spargo needs to get bigger and learn to kick goals in off season.

Max, Max, Max - goal kicking please.

Is it just me or is Brayshaw prolific but wasteful sometimes.?

Petracca - I honestly don't know what to do with him but I am sure Goodwin does.

Jones probably ought consider relinquishing the co captaincy with grace so that an orderly transition to retirement can be planned on his terms, and not be forced (and embarrassing). I'd like to see Lever get a VC and co captains - Gawn for the media etc and Viney mostly on field (I don't think he is a strong enough media performer which is kind of important). That's just me though and I'm sure others will disagree.

Lewis has been good in the finals but he has had some shockers this year - without listing everything, there needs to be a conversation with him.

Sort the backline out so Fritsch can get onto the wing.

Dom needs to go (sorry Dom).

There are gaps and you lot know more than me but the above has stood out a few times this year.

Looking forward to seeing what happens over the trade period.

 

Go Dees.

(And Go Pies!)

[jumbo returns 6,741]

7 minutes ago, Redleg said:

Same places other sides do.

I forgot

[jumbo returns 6,741]

7 minutes ago, praha said:

No one gives a [censored] about that statistic mate. Pies scored 1.5 in a half vs Geelong in 2009. They lost by 80 points and then won the flag 12 months later.

Yes, yes, and, to wit, that will happen with us

Can’t wait! 

[#11-TonyAnderson 774]

[beelzebub 23,370]

11 minutes ago, praha said:

No one gives a [censored] about that statistic mate. Pies scored 1.5 in a half vs Geelong in 2009. They lost by 80 points and then won the flag 12 months later.

I reckon quite a lot would care a great deal about that goal less half.

Hopefully the 22 that played ( and all that didn't ). Hopefully the coaching staff and equally those in charge of this club.

That is beyond unacceptable

 

[Redleg 40,915]

12 minutes ago, jumbo returns said:

I forgot

To be serious for a moment we have good recruiters who identify needs and try to cover them. 

We have concentrated on hard at it contested ball winners for a while and we have seen the results. To me the needs are another mature Ruckman who is ready to play and that is Preuss if we get him and then pace with skill and maybe a Garlett type.

To me they are our priorities and  we will see how the FD see it in the next couple of months by their trade targets and drafting. 

[Superunknown 4,217]

9 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

I reckon quite a lot would care a great deal about that goal less half.

Hopefully the 22 that played ( and all that didn't ). Hopefully the coaching staff and equally those in charge of this club.

That is beyond unacceptable

 

I am interested in what outcomes the first half drives. low tackle count, bad goal kicking, shocking indiscretions during disposals.

What behavioural change and team/individual improvements does it beget?

Hopefully it's turned into some constructive changes.

 

[Guest]

Anyone looking at that game in isolation in terms of game plan and list needs etc is barking up the wrong tree.  I see a lot of posts pulling the loss apart on a micro level.  It's like polishing your car when it's broken down.

We caved in mentally, the crowd, the occasion and the opposition had us beat before we hit the turf.

Nothing depicted that more than hand passes to the grass and behind players.  Sure sign of being tightened up due to fear.

I have no idea what the mental preparation was, but it didn't work.  We will be far more prepared next time.

Goodwin shows a capacity to learn.

Edited September 23, 2018 by Guest

[SFebes 4,884]

It was our 6th final in a row.

[jumbo returns 6,741]

27 minutes ago, Redleg said:

To be serious for a moment we have good recruiters who identify needs and try to cover them. 

We have concentrated on hard at it contested ball winners for a while and we have seen the results. To me the needs are another mature Ruckman who is ready to play and that is Preuss if we get him and then pace with skill and maybe a Garlett type.

To me they are our priorities and  we will see how the FD see it in the next couple of months by their trade targets and drafting. 

Hope you're right

 

[jumbo returns 6,741]

11 minutes ago, SFebes said:

It was our 6th final in a row.

Borne about by losing the unloseable game/s

[Lucifers Hero 39,779]

9 hours ago, Aus in Engerland said:

Firstly, I have to confess that I am in the enemy camp, but am a lover of good football and joined to comment on a few things.

1. Having read a few topics on here I am generally impressed with the level of knowledge and discussion here. All clubs, even mine, has some idiots as supporters. Some, such as Collingwood, Essendon, Fremantle, and Port seem to have nothing else, but it is what it is. Here it is good that most can construct a proper sentence with nouns and verbs in an English manner. Unlike the ferals at dockerland who struggle with anything resembling English.

2. Your list is not as bad as some have said. You have some good young guys who are only going to get better. Your list is in better shape than the Saints who have hovered around about the same draft positions as Melbourne. You are a few elites short of top level but are not far off. Your list age profile is better than that at Hawthorn and Geelong. I would call you as probable top 8 and possible top 4 in 2019 and will put in an early call of good chance top 4 in 2020.

3. You play a brand of football that is more enjoyable to watch than most. Entertaining, high scoring but with a decent defensive side. You'll win more than you lose with this style.

4. A couple of areas I will raise some level of exception to. 

a. Booing. All clubs do it and the new stadium is a sound trap. When Malthouse arrived at the WC one of his biggest problems was to turn around the supporters from being too nice and clapping opposition good play to being more like Victorian supporters. We learnt from you guys how to boo. Booing is also not always what it seems. There were complaints last week of WC booing an injured Collingwood player as he left the ground. Not true. They were booing the replay of the collision where Yeo was taken out below the knees but the free went to the Pies. A free kick to Yeo in 203 of the 204 games at that point of 2018. I lived in Melbourne in the late 80's/early 90's and the crowds at Vic Park and Windy Hill make the current WC crowd look like Chardonnay swilling picnickers.

b. Some have complained of the level of travel you have done. When compared to Stayathomewood that is a valid whinge. But against the most traveled team in the competition? 

5. I think 3 of the 4 prelim teams actually overachieved this year. Most pundits had the Pies as bottom 4, WC as bottom 4 (Robert Walls as spoon) and Melbourne as hanging around the 7-10 mark. So on reflection, a good season to build on. No need to make wholesale changes, but certainly a tweak here and there wouldn't hurt.

Kudos for being brave enough to come on here.  That is a fair commentary.

[poita 3,902]

Two days on, Saturday's performance is still hard to contemplate. I didn't think we'd win, but I thought we'd have a real crack. Sadly there was just zero effort or intensity from most of the team. There were signs against Hawthorn that we were getting tired, but that is no excuse for the lack of pressure and tackling that we saw. I feel so sorry for the supporters who spent thousands of dollars travelling to watch that tripe.

The main thing I took from the game, which is something that I have suspected for most of the year, is that the gap between the top three sides and the rest is enormous. The gap between fourth and twelfth (perhaps even to sixteenth) is very small, but bridging the gap to third is going to take a heap of work (and luck). Teams such as Essendon, Geelong and North have been very aggressive already this off season, and we will get left behind if we don't add some serious quality to the list.

Overall the season has been a success and a significant step forward, but we can't just assume that our next movement is up. Hopefully the players use this loss as motivation and come back bigger and better. It is imperative that we finish top four next season if we are to have any chance of winning a premiership.

[Superunknown 4,217]

2 minutes ago, poita said:

 

Overall the season has been a success and a significant step forward, but we can't just assume that our next movement is up. Hopefully the players use this loss as motivation and come back bigger and better. It is imperative that we finish top four next season if we are to have any chance of winning a premiership. 

This, this and this

[beelzebub 23,370]

1 hour ago, Redleg said:

I think we had more inside 50’s than Eagles if my memory is correct. Therefore we had chances. Ball use killed us. Lack of pace to get clear killed us. Nerves killed us. Leaders killed us.Luck also killed us with ball bouncing their way on nearly every occasion.

Them 52 Us 53 (i50)

O/all possession WC 49% us 35

The i50 is misleading in that more often than not the ball was marked by WC and returned to the other end with unrelenting monotony .

[Precard 10]

They may as well have brought white flags to the national anthem.

[Sir Why You Little 37,035]

12 hours ago, Precard said:

That’s a pretty clear one though. Good stat of a hardened team.

Not at the pointy end

We have a long way to go, and i do acknowledge that that evil stadium will be a massive win for Meth Coke going forward 

[Jones 62]

1 hour ago, SFebes said:

It was our 6th final in a row.

No, it was our 3rd. We had to win 1 of our last 2 games which we did in R22. Then we had a break! Then finals started.

No excuse.