On 18/05/2018 at 08:25, Winter Dan said:

He's terrible when it's wet weather footy, shirks the body contact that comes with it. That's when he lost form.

In the dry, I think he applies good pressure.

If I were coach, I'd just not select him for the wet weather games.

 

In the slippery conditions at the Gabba against Brisbane he was superb, so I don't think that's really a problem.

As people have already said he goes missing when we can't afford him to.

No worries with 'Jeffy'. If your lagging we have a depth of good players. I want him to be playing well for sure, but rotation is a good thing anyway. There's no shame in playing in the two's, it's our club as well.

Strong second team, strong first team.

Go the Dee's!!

  On 18/05/2018 at 00:09, dl4e said:

That is exactly right. The thing about Garletts career is that he has been consistently inconsistent.

While he does seem to go through a dip in form at some point in the season, he has kicked 40+ goals in multiple seasons for both us and Carlton.  Need to have a fair bit of consitancy to do that.

  On 18/05/2018 at 02:49, praha said:

Needs to bring more defense to his game. His tackling and pressure acts have been way off this year. Only had one great game and mostly other average games. IMO he's in the twilight of his career and needs to kick 20-30 goals this season to really cement a longer deal. We're seeing now why Malthouse was keen to get rid of him. He needs to turn it around. It seems that whenever the pressure comes and the team is performing and in the sight of finals teams, he drops off.

Why?

Per above point, Malthouse was a fool to let him go to us for what he did.

Someone here made the claim that Jeffy is a front runner, which I would  vigorously dispute.  For most of his early years at the MFC, we were a team that struggled to be compeditive, yet he was a shining light within our team.  I'd also dispute that he isn't physical or defencive enough.  He lays some great run down tackles and is a great body on body mark.

I would agree that he is somewhat of a confidence player  (though most players are when it comes down to it).  In this regard, as much as I'm a Jeffy fan,  I'm also ok for him to go back down to Casey to find some form and confidence again when he seems to loose his way a bit.  I actually think his latest drop off in form had more to do with how the team was playing.  I'd hate to be a forward the way were bringing the ball in and delivering into our forward line against the Hawks and Tigers.

Edited May 18, 20186 yr by Rodney (Balls) Grinter

  On 18/05/2018 at 02:49, praha said:

Needs to bring more defense to his game. His tackling and pressure acts have been way off this year. Only had one great game and mostly other average games. IMO he's in the twilight of his career and needs to kick 20-30 goals this season to really cement a longer deal. We're seeing now why Malthouse was keen to get rid of him. He needs to turn it around. It seems that whenever the pressure comes and the team is performing and in the sight of finals teams, he drops off.

Why?

What, 4 years ago or whenever it was?

He’s been an incredibly good value pick up for us and Carlton were incredibly stupid to let him go for the price we paid. 

He’s out of form currently but that doesn’t suddenly mean Malthouse knew what he was doing. 

He needs to get his workrate and defensive pressure back up to where we know they can be. I don’t expect Spargo to hold his spot all year so when Garlett gets his chance I want to see gut-running, chasing, tackling and harrassing. Goals wil flow from that.

Edited May 18, 20186 yr by titan_uranus

  On 18/05/2018 at 09:02, DV8 said:

Another front runner.  If we want to get bejond any front running habits within this club, then we have to cut front runner types from our list,,, as soon as we can.

I climbed onto the Garlett bandwagon last year,,, but like with 'wattshisface',,,  I'm jumping back off that festival float disappointed again from the downturn in efforts.

 

The standard we look beyond, is the culture we shall receive.

mate. he's outta form. when on song, garlett kicks goals, applies pressure and is in discussions for the all australian squad. that wouldn't happen if he was a 'front-runner'. furthermore, i prefer personality and a little bit of quicksilver in my team. not boring foot soldiers with no spirit or flair. sometimes quicksilver is hard to predict and sometimes it does magical things.. i hope he is back in the first team asap. and i hope he kicks a bag in our first GF win since 1964 in the next few years.

Those writing him off, he was in the conversation at one stage last year for AA selection. He has a magic that no other player at the club pocesses, he’ll be back in and I’m confident he’ll play an important part of our push towards finals football. 

Plays scared.

  On 18/05/2018 at 19:59, Rocky said:

mate. he's outta form.

when on song, garlett kicks goals, applies pressure and is in discussions for the all australian squad. that wouldn't happen if he was a 'front-runner'. furthermore, i prefer personality and a little bit of quicksilver in my team. not boring foot soldiers with no spirit or flair. sometimes quicksilver is hard to predict and sometimes it does magical things.. i hope he is back in the first team asap. and i hope he kicks a bag in our first GF win since 1964 in the next few years.

That is the epitome of a front-runner.

When down he goes missing totally, instead of crashing in and busting a gut.

When out of form, you do not lose the ability to work harder, even if the ball isn't bouncing for you.  This is pure desperation to work your way back into it.

front runners give up on the work ethic.  see wattshisface.

  On 18/05/2018 at 22:23, Pates said:

Those writing him off, he was in the conversation at one stage last year for AA selection. He has a magic that no other player at the club pocesses, he’ll be back in and I’m confident he’ll play an important part of our push towards finals football. 

He is currently being overtaken, by young players who work hard in all weather.

  On 19/05/2018 at 01:49, DV8 said:

That is the epitome of a front-runner.

When down he goes missing totally, instead of crashing in and busting a gut.

When out of form, you do not lose the ability to work harder, even if the ball isn't bouncing for you.  This is pure desperation to work your way back into it.

front runners give up on the work ethic.  see wattshisface.

Front runner my arse. Do you even watch footy or does your quest to expose northern stand conspiracy theories chew up all your time

Here's me disagreeing with Hemingway who put forth the view that Garlett was inconsistent (don't know how to quote from another thread)

Garlett has been in the game for 10 years and over that period has been one of the most consistent small forwards around. Including his time at Carlton. His 2014 was a complete bomb but I was informed by someone at the the Blues that this was mainly due to off-field family issues. Then Malthouse had his fire sale. 

No doubt his form was off for 2 weeks. Perhaps form, desire, our crap forward setup & entries - who knows. Conditions perhaps ? When he was young I recall him being good in the wet (I always feared him when we played Carlton) but recently he's been the worst wet tracker since Let's Elope

I hope he finds touch real quick. With the forward line we could have, I would love to see Charlie and Jeffy creating havoc amongst it

Lies, damned lies & statistics. Nonetheless, here are some Garlett stats. Make of 'em what you will

Year	Games	Goals	Avge Gls	Tackles	Avge Tackles
2009	10	12	1.2	23	2.3
2010	20	39	2.0	73	3.7
2011	24	48	2.0	96	4.0
2012	22	29	1.3	72	3.3
2013	22	43	2.0	76	3.5
2014	9	12	1.3	23	2.6
2015	22	40	1.8	90	4.1
2016	17	29	1.7	54	3.2
2017	21	42	2.0	74	3.5
2018	5	9	1.8	15	3.0
	172	303	1.8	596	3.5

That is not the career of a front runner. We were lucky to get him for minimum chips and has been one of the best value investments we've made. And now that he's out of form you apply Revisionism 101 and declare him a front runner. FMD,

You type some absolute shite mate and this is just the thin edge of the wedge. I've never used the ignore function but you've got me considering it

 

  On 19/05/2018 at 02:12, Go the Biff said:

Front runner my arse. Do you even watch footy or does your quest to expose northern stand conspiracy theories chew up all your time

Here's me disagreeing with Hemingway who put forth the view that Garlett was inconsistent (don't know how to quote from another thread)

Garlett has been in the game for 10 years and over that period has been one of the most consistent small forwards around. Including his time at Carlton. His 2014 was a complete bomb but I was informed by someone at the the Blues that this was mainly due to off-field family issues. Then Malthouse had his fire sale. 

No doubt his form was off for 2 weeks. Perhaps form, desire, our crap forward setup & entries - who knows. Conditions perhaps ? When he was young I recall him being good in the wet (I always feared him when we played Carlton) but recently he's been the worst wet tracker since Let's Elope

I hope he finds touch real quick. With the forward line we could have, I would love to see Charlie and Jeffy creating havoc amongst it

Lies, damned lies & statistics. Nonetheless, here are some Garlett stats. Make of 'em what you will

Year	Games	Goals	Avge Gls	Tackles	Avge Tackles
2009	10	12	1.2	23	2.3
2010	20	39	2.0	73	3.7
2011	24	48	2.0	96	4.0
2012	22	29	1.3	72	3.3
2013	22	43	2.0	76	3.5
2014	9	12	1.3	23	2.6
2015	22	40	1.8	90	4.1
2016	17	29	1.7	54	3.2
2017	21	42	2.0	74	3.5
2018	5	9	1.8	15	3.0
	172	303	1.8	596	3.5

That is not the career of a front runner. We were lucky to get him for minimum chips and has been one of the best value investments we've made. And now that he's out of form you apply Revisionism 101 and declare him a front runner. FMD,

You type some absolute shite mate and this is just the thin edge of the wedge. I've never used the ignore function but you've got me considering it

 

Out of form does not restrict a player from Effort.

When the ball isn't on a string for you, then go at it harder, and chase harder, tackle harder, to make up for loss of skills.

When these go missing (Effort), that is the sign of front runner.

Loss of confidence is NO excuse for a drop in effort.

 

It sounds to me your an apologist for your favorite players.

Edited May 19, 20186 yr by DV8

  On 19/05/2018 at 03:43, DV8 said:

Out of form does not restrict a player from Effort.

When the ball isn't on a string for you, then go at it harder, and chase harder, tackle harder, to make up for loss of skills.

When these go missing (Effort), that is the sign of front runner.

Loss of confidence is NO excuse for a drop in effort.

 

It sounds to me your an apologist for your favorite players.

I don't think any of us standing up for Jeffy are being apologists by any stretch.  With stats like those quoted by @Go the Biff (what a lovely set of numbers) there isn't anything to apologize for.  Jeffy has been amongst or best forwards since he arrived at he club.  Don't see any lack of effort/tackling from him either.  Jeffy gets so many run down from behind tackles for us on a regular basis that most players wouldn't even get near.

The bloke would also always be attracting the oppositions best and quickest small defender, because they would all know what a gun he is and how he can tear a game apart.  I suspect that when he has his quiet spells, it's more about him being sucked away from the ball and put off his game by a smart opposition.  I'd be thinking strategies to arrest that kind of thing are one of the things that Goodwin and Co. would be getting him to work on.  Asides from that, our delivery into the forward line to this bloke is deplorable at times.  I've lost count of the times when instead of a well placed kick out in front of him to his advantage out back, which he would have run onto, burned off his opponents and easily goaled from we have turned into some rubish grubby kick which makes him stop, prop and get run down by the opposing team.  Jeffy is an absolute weapon - get him into good form, deliver it to him properly and it will be party time.

Edited May 19, 20186 yr by Rodney (Balls) Grinter

  On 19/05/2018 at 05:11, Rodney (Balls) Grinter said:

I don't think any of us standing up for Jeffy are being apologists by any stretch.  With stats like those quoted by @Go the Biff (what a lovely set of numbers) there isn't anything to apologize for.  Jeffy has been amongst or best forwards since he arrived at he club.  Do see any lack of effort/tackling from him either.  Jeffy gets so many run down from behind tackles for us on a regular basis that most players wouldn't even get near.

The bloke would also always be attracting the oppositions best and quickest small defender, because they would all know what a gun he is and how he can tear a game apart.  I suspect that when he has his quiet spells, it's more about him being sucked away from the ball and put off his game by a smart opposition.  I'd be thinking strategies to arrest that kind of thing are one of the things that Goodwin and Co. would be getting him to work on.  Asides from that, our delivery into the forward line to this bloke is deplorable at times.  I've lost count of the times when instead of a well placed kick out in front of him to his advantage out back, which he would have run onto, burned off his opponents and easily goaled from we have turned into some rubish grubby kick which makes him stop, prop and get run down by the opposing team.  Jeffy is an absolute weapon - get him into good form, deliver it to him properly and it will be party time.

But Garlett has been dropped and Spargo is still in the D's team... So what do you think your stats are not showing, for him to go back to Casey, RbG?

Edited May 19, 20186 yr by DV8

Bugg could be ahead of him now

  On 19/05/2018 at 05:13, DV8 said:

But Garlett has been dropped and Spargo is still in the d's team... So what do you think your stats are not showing, for him to go back to Casey, RbG?

I actually see this as a win-win.  Give a young player with a future who is up and about a go and get Jeffy back into form and fix and improve a few points to his game, so he comes back even better and makes the team better.  I've been quite happy with what I've seen from Spargo thus far, but nothing he has produced to date is anything near Jeffy at his best.

... and yes Jeffy is one of my favorite players too, because he's a bloody goer and super exciting when his really up and about.  I just wish he kicked less posters - must just about lead the league at that stat.  Seriously almost rather he'd kick it out on the full than hit the dam post some of the time - such a tease and a let down when it happens.

  On 19/05/2018 at 05:47, Rodney (Balls) Grinter said:

I actually see this as a win-win.  Give a young player with a future who is up and about a go and get Jeffy back into form and fix and improve a few points to his game, so he comes back even better and makes the team better.  I've been quite happy with what I've seen from Spargo thus far, but nothing he has produced to date is anything near Jeffy at his best.

... and yes Jeffy is one of my favorite players too, because he's a bloody goer and super exciting when his really up and about.  I just wish he kicked less posters - must just about lead the league at that stat.  Seriously almost rather he'd kick it out on the full than hit the dam post some of the time - such a tease and a let down when it happens.

I totally agree that Jeffy is fantastic, when he's 'ON' song.

 

But when he drops his bundle he drags the side and others with him.

Its hard enough being beaten against a inform side, but if you let your body language and efforts deteriorate, it's selfish, as a player. 

It signals to others that may follow the lead.   Especially our young.

And those off field as well, its a bad example to every part of the club.

 

Lets hope Jeffy stops sulking and starts firing up.

  On 19/05/2018 at 05:16, SFebey said:

Bugg could be ahead of him now

you may be right

  On 19/05/2018 at 06:45, Diamond_Jim said:

you may be right

If you're looking for score involvements Bugg is definitely ahead of him.

I didn't watch todays game but I would have thought he might have been on the end of a few more and hit the scoreboard.

VFL level is obviously different to AFL and its possible someone like Garlett is struggling because he really hasn't played much VFL football since he's been at Melbourne at least (not sure about Carlton). Certainly don't want to give him outright excuses but he has been in this position before where his form has dropped. I definitely think he can get out of this slump. He's been unlucky that our small forwards have played three pretty consistent games across the board.

Looking for second half of the year for Jeff(y) to find his form and hopefully be a part of a run home to finals.

I definitely don't think its time to really worry about Garlett. As with Bett's who certainly hasn't set the world on fire this season, small forwards who only really play across the forward line will have down games because they're not in and around the contest as much as the forwards who spend more time up the ground (Fritsch, Spargo, Hannan, ANB etc.)

Edited May 19, 20186 yr by mongrel

  On 19/05/2018 at 01:49, DV8 said:

That is the epitome of a front-runner.

When down he goes missing totally, instead of crashing in and busting a gut.

When out of form, you do not lose the ability to work harder, even if the ball isn't bouncing for you.  This is pure desperation to work your way back into it.

front runners give up on the work ethic.  see wattshisface.

so you're implying the kid won't get dropped? small forwards are largely dependant on stuff happening further back the field.. spargo just so happened to arrive when things were getting ironed out with regards to our game plan. it helps we have two tall forwards now as well to create a bit of chaos. if it was spargo n hogan alone in the forward line and we were bombing it in like in the first few games, people wouldn't be so excited about spargo's pressure and general game. i like him don't get me wrong, but garlett is better all round and don't even mention bugg in this conversation. if garlett kills it at casey this weekend, he's back in. 

Edited May 19, 20186 yr by Rocky

Won’t be surprised if he has played his last in the firsts. Showing nothing at VFL level. Just not worth the risk.

  On 19/05/2018 at 08:27, Rocky said:

so you're implying the kid won't get dropped? small forwards are largely dependant on stuff happening further back the field.. spargo just so happened to arrive when things were getting ironed out with regards to our game plan. it helps we have two tall forwards now as well to create a bit of chaos. if it was spargo n hogan alone in the forward line and we were bombing it in like in the first few games, people wouldn't be so excited about spargo's pressure and general game. i like him don't get me wrong, but garlett is better all round and don't even mention bugg in this conversation. if garlett kills it at casey this weekend, he's back in. 

He didn't kill it and he's had one good game in a long time.

  On 19/05/2018 at 08:27, Rocky said:

so you're implying the kid won't get dropped? small forwards are largely dependant on stuff happening further back the field.. spargo just so happened to arrive when things were getting ironed out with regards to our game plan. it helps we have two tall forwards now as well to create a bit of chaos. if it was spargo n hogan alone in the forward line and we were bombing it in like in the first few games, people wouldn't be so excited about spargo's pressure and general game. i like him don't get me wrong, but garlett is better all round and don't even mention bugg in this conversation. if garlett kills it at casey this weekend, he's back in. 

whaaat?

I guess your talking about Spargo?  Getting dropped is common, for sure he would, I expect, go through what most players go through when starting out.

I'm not implying anything about Spargo, at all.  Other than, I like the boy.

 

No, my comments have all been about Jeffy, and his efforts.

Garlett has to lift his game; he doesn't have to kick goals every game, but he has to contribute, to tackle, to chase, harass, and generally be a thorn in opposition defenders arzes.

Edited May 19, 20186 yr by DV8

  On 19/05/2018 at 01:50, DV8 said:

He is currently being overtaken, by young players who work hard in all weather.

this is why i referred to spargo in my earlier post. look. we all love seeing the dees play an exciting brand of footy and garlett is a huge part of this. he brings a joy to the game that is rare. i have not said that i think he should just stay in the team every game. i completely understand why he's been dropped, and why a player like spargo is in. but he isn't a KPB/F. he won't go back to casey and 'find form'. sometimes he's really in games and sometimes he isn't.. when i say 'in games' i'm referring to pressure, goals and everything else that comes with being a small forward. until spargo plays a poor game, garlett is probably gonna stay at casey. but as soon as spargo is ineffectual (probably next week against the crows), garlett will be straight back in, even if he has been average at casey. i don't see the point in people arguing over garlett. the thing that annoys me is that people can't just let him be a player that floats in and out of a game to provide magic. not all flag teams have had a completely even contribution from their players. i'm ok having one player that can provide that rare skill and the unexpected, just as long as he makes a passable attempt at providing pressure, tackle, etc, etc.. 

  On 19/05/2018 at 10:05, Rocky said:

this is why i referred to spargo in my earlier post. look. we all love seeing the dees play an exciting brand of footy and garlett is a huge part of this. he brings a joy to the game that is rare. i have not said that i think he should just stay in the team every game. i completely understand why he's been dropped, and why a player like spargo is in. but he isn't a KPB/F. he won't go back to casey and 'find form'. sometimes he's really in games and sometimes he isn't.. when i say 'in games' i'm referring to pressure, goals and everything else that comes with being a small forward. until spargo plays a poor game, garlett is probably gonna stay at casey. but as soon as spargo is ineffectual (probably next week against the crows), garlett will be straight back in, even if he has been average at casey. i don't see the point in people arguing over garlett. the thing that annoys me is that people can't just let him be a player that floats in and out of a game to provide magic. not all flag teams have had a completely even contribution from their players. i'm ok having one player that can provide that rare skill and the unexpected, just as long as he makes a passable attempt at providing pressure, tackle, etc, etc.. 

All very well Rocky, but we haven't had any joy in RednBlue for 54 years. and counting. we cannot carry players any longer like we did in past years, even when getting to the ladder top, all that brings is iffy workrates and amateur output and ends in teasing the support base when not really in the hunt for the Silver Cup.

Pretenders/front-runners is truly all Melbourne has been, in the past 25 years.  entertainers Yes, but the real deal, NOT.

 

This is because we like to be a club who barracks for our loved players,,, no matter what.  Instead of Expecting a Hell of a lot more, from them.

This breeds players like Watts, who want to be liked/adored, and wants to be casual about footy, as he gets paid handsomely by us all for the privilege.

We have had too many players who wanted to be show ponies, instead of Premiers.