Welcome to Demonland: Jake Lever

[rpfc 28,048]

2 hours ago, Vogon Poetry said:

Most know the cost of everything and the value of nothing.

Bumper sticker. $10.

Take my goddamn money.

[Demons1858 1,716]

3 hours ago, Vogon Poetry said:

Most know the cost of everything and the value of nothing.

Thanks oh wise one.

Here is one for you, I made this one up myself.

'Most do not pay extra for value that can be gotten for less'

[TGR 1,367]

3 hours ago, Demons1858 said:

Thanks oh wise one.

Here is one for you, I made this one up myself.

'Most do not pay extra for value that can be gotten for less'

I like Fan's quote, but this one also resonates with me too.

[The Chazz 4,077]

On 14/10/2017 at 8:08 AM, Melb-A-Toast said:

Jake Lever is an excellent intercept mark and spoiler. With Tom McDonald moving forward, we have been found wanting and Lever will stop 3-4 goals per game. Defensive rotations has left shorter players like Hunt, Jetta and Lewis trying to beat their taller opponents in one on one contests. Having Lever's skill to read the play and intercept is going to make those contests harder for the opposition.

Once he has the ball, then the running power of Hunt, Hibberd and rotating midfield combined with the better delivery skills of Salem, Hibberd, Jetta and an improving Oscar McDonald will make the transition from backline to forward entries.

This is a very good acquisition for Melbourne. To get an intercept defensive player of his quality from the draft is a lottery, so points equivalent of pick 4 is the right price.

How much is stopping 3-4 goals worth?

The diamond defence will make Lever a Brownlow favourite.

Not sure if it's been raised in this thread (I haven't read this thread at all), but is there a potential of Lever floating forward?  While I'm not big on taking a player out of a position that they are dominating in, just wondered what peoples thoughts are on this (similar to what Geelong have tried with Harry Taylor).

[Moonshadow 17,551]

20 minutes ago, The Chazz said:

The diamond defence will make Lever a Brownlow favourite.

Not sure if it's been raised in this thread (I haven't read this thread at all), but is there a potential of Lever floating forward?  While I'm not big on taking a player out of a position that they are dominating in, just wondered what peoples thoughts are on this (similar to what Geelong have tried with Harry Taylor).

Do you know how many votes he polled this year? (hint: more than 0 and less than 2). Can you please tell me when the last key back or key forward won the Charlie? 

A dominating player should almost never be taken out of position, except in the event of injury eg. Danger this year, or when 15 goals down, as Neita was, to stem flood of goals.

[FarNorthernD 5,861]

23 minutes ago, The Chazz said:

The diamond defence will make Lever a Brownlow favourite.

Not sure if it's been raised in this thread (I haven't read this thread at all), but is there a potential of Lever floating forward?  While I'm not big on taking a player out of a position that they are dominating in, just wondered what peoples thoughts are on this (similar to what Geelong have tried with Harry Taylor).

I was thinking along the same lines. Unlike a few on here I’m not sold that T Mac will be capable of being a long term forward option for us. I can see him returning back to defence and could see either O.Mac or Lever given a shot up forward. 

[The Chazz 4,077]

14 minutes ago, Moonshadow said:

Do you know how many votes he polled this year? (hint: more than 0 and less than 2). Can you please tell me when the last key back or key forward won the Charlie? 

A dominating player should almost never be taken out of position, except in the event of injury eg. Danger this year, or when 15 goals down, as Neita was, to stem flood of goals.

While it was said mostly TIC, I do think that style of defensive structure will further highlight Lever's strengths.

Neita also used to dominate at CHB.  Went on to become our greatest goal kicker.

8 minutes ago, fndee said:

I was thinking along the same lines. Unlike a few on here I’m not sold that T Mac will be capable of being a long term forward option for us. I can see him returning back to defence and could see either O.Mac or Lever given a shot up forward. 

I actually don't see T McDonald failing as a forward.  He's a very disciplined player, and I would expect a summer with the forward group will see him grow in to that line very well.

Our spine is looking very, very strong.

[Adam The God 29,392]

Staggering that you'd want to move Lever anywhere else but back. Each to their own, but I'm extremely confident we'll be playing Lever permanently back.

[The Chazz 4,077]

25 minutes ago, A F said:

Staggering that you'd want to move Lever anywhere else but back. Each to their own, but I'm extremely confident we'll be playing Lever permanently back.

Contingency planning more than anything, AF.  TMc as moved forward in 2017 because of circumstances, taking our best key defender out of his preferred position.  Turned out to be a blessing in disguise.  We've tried Frost forward with minimal success at best.  OMc is suited down back.

Thoughts were that depending on match-ups, injuries, form and other circumstances, I could easily see Lever playing that swing role, adding further value to his worth.

By no means am I proposing he starts full forward, Rd 1 2018.

[Adam The God 29,392]

15 minutes ago, The Chazz said:

Contingency planning more than anything, AF.  TMc as moved forward in 2017 because of circumstances, taking our best key defender out of his preferred position.  Turned out to be a blessing in disguise.  We've tried Frost forward with minimal success at best.  OMc is suited down back.

Thoughts were that depending on match-ups, injuries, form and other circumstances, I could easily see Lever playing that swing role, adding further value to his worth.

By no means am I proposing he starts full forward, Rd 1 2018.

So is Lever, unfortunately. Don't mess with it if it isn't broken. We've just paid an extremely high price to ensure we get our defensive lynchpin that sets up our backline. 

If we're looking for contingencies, I'd be looking at Schache or going to the draft. And we have Weideman developing.

[whatwhat say what 22,165]

wasn't he originally touted as a potential midfield option when coming through the draft?

 

[Adam The God 29,392]

13 minutes ago, DemonAndrew said:

wasn't he originally touted as a potential midfield option when coming through the draft?

 

Yep, I remember reading that on here. That Roos wanted him as a big bodied mid.

[The Chazz 4,077]

6 minutes ago, A F said:

So is Lever, unfortunately. Don't mess with it if it isn't broken. We've just paid an extremely high price to ensure we get our defensive lynchpin that sets up our backline. 

If we're looking for contingencies, I'd be looking at Schache or going to the draft. And we have Weideman developing.

Let's hope we don't need contingencies then!!!

[old55 22,826]

It's going to be interesting to see whether Adelaide can get the Cameron and/or Gibbs trades done.

[DeeSpencer 24,768]

4 hours ago, A F said:

Yep, I remember reading that on here. That Roos wanted him as a big bodied mid.

He's good below his knees and has a nice side step but I don't see him being a midfielder.

I wouldn't be adverse to giving him some time on a wing against smaller teams. In anything just for some development of being around the packs and moving the ball inside 50, plus we need a wingman! That said, I'm a big fan of shuffling the magnets in general, there's almost no player on our list who I wouldn't try in different spots on occasions. 

[Adam The God 29,392]

It's crazy talk all this. Why are we even discussing the idea of player Lever anywhere else besides back? You don't bring in a gun forward and then try to work out ways to play him back or in the midfield. Play Lever in the bloody backline haha.

Edited October 17, 2017 by A F

[DeezNuts 624]

A little of topic, but has next years draw been finalised? 4 games in 18 days really broke us... with Lever in now, we might have freed up some depth. How many games did we win without Watts during his injury towards the end of the year?

[jnrmac 19,896]

On 16/10/2017 at 10:19 AM, Demons1858 said:

Can you show me one new article where an industry person has indicated we paid under's?

I can show you a heap of them that say we paid overs and that's because we did.

Also listened to SOS this morning talking about how he expects less trade value for uncontracted players than contracted players like Gibbs.

Leigh Mathews says the Crows should have asked for pick 1

[djr 1,318]

On 10/16/2017 at 10:19 AM, Demons1858 said:

Can you show me one new article where an industry person has indicated we paid under's?

I can show you a heap of them that say we paid overs and that's because we did.

Also listened to SOS this morning talking about how he expects less trade value for uncontracted players than contracted players like Gibbs.

For god's sake does it matter whether we pay overs or unders in a particular trade. The club targeted Lever and Balic all year and beyond and made a decision on JW. They got these trades done as well as having 3 2nd round draft picks. As they said on Trade Radio the MFC are gaining the reputation of a club that gets trades done swiftly as possible. We usually get the outcome what we want.

[DeeSpencer 24,768]

11 minutes ago, djr said:

For god's sake does it matter whether we pay overs or unders in a particular trade. The club targeted Lever and Balic all year and beyond and made a decision on JW. They got these trades done as well as having 3 2nd round draft picks. As they said on Trade Radio the MFC are gaining the reputation of a club that gets trades done swiftly as possible. We usually get the outcome what we want.

What does that mean? It gives us a reputation of being popular with Damian Barrett, who cares? Players join clubs for money, success and opportunity, not because they make trades quickly.

And yes it matters because every time you pay a bit more you lose in the draft order. Might only be a few picks here or there but that's the difference between getting your man or not and over time that adds up. If it's little bit by little bit eventually you end up with missing just 1 or 2 good players who might be the difference. Nailing the occasional 2nd or 3rd round pick is how you stay strong and win flags. I really feel we need to nail 2 of our picks this draft period and I hope being down the order doesn't cost us.

[Gator 17,260]

...

Edited October 18, 2017 by ProDee

[DemonLad5 1,642]

23 hours ago, DeezNuts said:

A little of topic, but has next years draw been finalised? 4 games in 18 days really broke us... with Lever in now, we might have freed up some depth. How many games did we win without Watts during his injury towards the end of the year?

Pretty sure the fixture comes out later this month  or early next month. No doubt Peter Jackson we make sure we wont get screwed with the consecutive short breaks again 

[Demons1858 1,716]

2 hours ago, djr said:

For god's sake does it matter whether we pay overs or unders in a particular trade. The club targeted Lever and Balic all year and beyond and made a decision on JW. They got these trades done as well as having 3 2nd round draft picks. As they said on Trade Radio the MFC are gaining the reputation of a club that gets trades done swiftly as possible. We usually get the outcome what we want.

Does it matter? You can't be serious. Of course it does. Why even have a draft order if it doesn't matter. We are going to get a lesser player next year because we haven't got a 1st rounder. 2nd rounders rarely get you a decent player. 

We should have got the same trades done for less so its irrelevant that we are easy to deal with. Being hard nosed doesnt seem to have hurt carlton and esse

Edited October 18, 2017 by Demons1858

[Yokozuna 1,004]

We don't CURRENTLY have a 1st round pick next year, but do Yu think we can't get one ny trading for it next year?

not sure how and who, but I am sure they would be thinking about it already!

[djr 1,318]

1 hour ago, Demons1858 said:

Does it matter? You can't be serious. Of course it does. Why even have a draft order if it doesn't matter. We are going to get a lesser player next year because we haven't got a 1st rounder. 2nd rounders rarely get you a decent player. 

We should have got the same trades done for less so its irrelevant that we are easy to deal with. Being hard nosed doesnt seem to have hurt carlton and esse

Where is Carlton on the ladder and Essendon are the same with us. So if we were hard nosed there and no trades were done would you be happy? I bet not. And don't say that Adelaide would have buckled and given what we originally put forward. It wasn't going to happen. The market said Lever was valued at 2 1st round picks. Same with JW. His market value was only a 2nd round pick.

As for next years 1st round pick we can deal with that later. No doubt we will try trade up into a 1st round pick. But as for now we have traded exactly the way we wanted. Have done so for the past 3 years. Forget the unders and overs.

 

Edited October 18, 2017 by djr