On 26/09/2016 at 14:34, Akum said:

An atypical game for ANB. He was excellent in the Qual final when we smashed them by 12 goals, and the Dogs picked him out as the one to be paid special attention. And they picked right - once they stopped him, we found it really difficult to move the ball forward and get any flow going, despite Clarrie's great clearance game. He was wearing Jed Adcock like an extra shirt for much of the game. Who tags anybody in the VFL?? He's prob never been tagged in his life before. The Dogs realised far better than we did how much the Scorps' running game - which carved them up in the Qual final - and that he was the key to it, and they did a brilliant job of stopping him.

Nothing to do with the tag. All to do with his inability to hit a target by foot. 

  On 26/09/2016 at 13:44, big_red_fire_engine said:

I saw enough of ANB on the weekend to validate his decision making and execution by foot are not up to it. In contract but trade if opportunity to improve position is there.

I'm not against trading ANB, but not just for the sake of it like Dunn or Garland.

Unless we can get an early 3rd Round Pick or a player that we think would specifically help our list eg Nathan Vardy (ruck/forward) then I'd rather hold onto him.

The kids come 5th in the VFL B&F in his 2nd year, so we've clearly got something to work with.

  On 26/09/2016 at 10:04, ENYAW said:

Leehow,if we had a 1st round pick we could trade it for more later picks,keep it  or pick up someone of value and since we don't seem to have many reserve players to step up to senior level we will struggle next year. We may very well make the eight next year and would be good. Where do you expect us to finish next year?

Salem, Brayshaw, JT, Melksham, Hibberd, JKH, Weiderman, ANB, Hullet, are all players that barely played this year that should make a difference next year (some more than others obviously)

Add the improvement of Oliver and Petracca in particular and I'm bullish about our prospects of finals next year. this is not including others we might trade in.

Its not like we lost the 1st round pick, we cleverly traded it to get Oliver and Weeds in a stroke of genius

  On 26/09/2016 at 21:57, AngryAtCasey said:

I'm not against trading ANB, but not just for the sake of it like Dunn or Garland.

Unless we can get an early 3rd Round Pick or a player that we think would specifically help our list eg Nathan Vardy (ruck/forward) then I'd rather hold onto him.

The kids come 5th in the VFL B&F in his 2nd year, so we've clearly got something to work with.

ANB needs a run of games and assurance he'll get a good run at it.

In one game, out for 11, in for another one, out again....never going to work for him.

  On 26/09/2016 at 22:26, jumbo returns said:

ANB needs a run of games and assurance he'll get a good run at it.

In one game, out for 11, in for another one, out again....never going to work for him.

But you cannot afford to keep underachieving midfielders in teams, they do more harm than good.  Maybe get away with it in the forward pocket but you cant play him there as I believe it is not his natural position.

I know what you are saying but it's like the 1 more preseason argument, how long do you leave him in the team in hope that he will find form?

  On 26/09/2016 at 22:33, AzzKikA said:

But you cannot afford to keep underachieving midfielders in teams, they do more harm than good.  Maybe get away with it in the forward pocket but you cant play him there as I believe it is not his natural position.

I know what you are saying but it's like the 1 more preseason argument, how long do you leave him in the team in hope that he will find form?

Fair enough, but there's a difference between mids who underachieved with another team before coming to us, and then in their 4th year have still underachieved with us (Newton, Michie & probably BenKen) and mids that we drafted who hasn't achieved much yet (ANB, perhaps JKH), especially if they've been injured.

Surely the former are ahead of the latter in the queue to be traded or delisted? 

  On 26/09/2016 at 21:20, big_red_fire_engine said:

Nothing to do with the tag. All to do with his inability to hit a target by foot. 

Unfortunately I now agree.

His disposal was and is terrible. He can certainly get possessions in the VFL. That is a great start.

You can also see when he gets the ball, he is a poor decision maker and appears like a rabbit in the headlights.

Happy to keep him and work on his disposal, but if it doesn't improve, he won't be a regular AFL player.

  On 26/09/2016 at 22:40, Akum said:

Fair enough, but there's a difference between mids who underachieved with another team before coming to us, and then in their 4th year have still underachieved with us (Newton, Michie & probably BenKen) and mids that we drafted who hasn't achieved much yet (ANB, perhaps JKH), especially if they've been injured.

Surely the former are ahead of the latter in the queue to be traded or delisted? 

In this case with the above players I agree Akum, in this case. I see more in JKH (am not buying into the hype around him on this site but see potential) & ANB than the other 3 you mentioned.  Generally the traded in players are older and have had more opportunities to prove their worth and will be delisted before the drafted ones, if you can't make the Seniors team at 2 separate clubs you have had your chance.

  On 26/09/2016 at 22:33, AzzKikA said:

But you cannot afford to keep underachieving midfielders in teams, they do more harm than good.  Maybe get away with it in the forward pocket but you cant play him there as I believe it is not his natural position.

I know what you are saying but it's like the 1 more preseason argument, how long do you leave him in the team in hope that he will find form?

I agree with all the commentary about ANB. If he's retained, he'll have to work his butt off to get a regular gig...

I hope he succeeds.

  On 26/09/2016 at 23:17, jumbo returns said:

I agree with all the commentary about ANB. If he's retained, he'll have to work his butt off to get a regular gig...

I hope he succeeds.

As do I, and the rest of the players that are left on our list on the fringe of selection.

  On 26/09/2016 at 21:57, AngryAtCasey said:

I'm not against trading ANB, but not just for the sake of it like Dunn or Garland.

Unless we can get an early 3rd Round Pick or a player that we think would specifically help our list eg Nathan Vardy (ruck/forward) then I'd rather hold onto him.

The kids come 5th in the VFL B&F in his 2nd year, so we've clearly got something to work with.

I agree with BRFE that he's tradeable, but I also agree with AAC that unless we can get something meaningful for him we should persist.  We don't need to off to free list space, there's plenty of candidates ahead of him in the queue this year.

I understand the comments about ANB's weaknesses etc, but I don't understand the mentality around wanting to trade or delist someone because they're not "best 22". That's a heck of a lot of players we're going to be getting rid of it that was the case. Reality is we need depth players, we have a salary cap, he's 20 and has shown enough to work with.

Heard from very reliable sources he understands his place in the pecking order and is working really hard to improve his game. Deserves more credit, especially seeing he finished 5th in the Liston after playing in a new position this year.

Bit of patience required I think, it's called "development" for a reason.

 

  On 26/09/2016 at 10:21, AngryAtCasey said:

Michie (Rookie), Max King (rookie),  Terlich, Newton, Matt Jones, Pedersen, Dawes = delist

Grimes = walk as free agent

Dunn, Garland = trade for what we can get

Hogan traded in worst case scenario and Nibbler if we get offered something good for him

Wagner upgraded

White to get a 3rd year on rookie list & Smith a 2nd year

So that gives us 7 senior list vacancies (if Hogan & Nibbler stay) & 3 rookie list spots. Would allow us to trade in Hibberd and possibly one more experienced player, 4 picks at the draft and maybe a DFA. Or someone like Matt Jones may in fact get a 1 year extension.

I'd retain one of Michie/Matt Jones (rookie so frees a primary list space), Pedersen/Dawes (not injured), Dunn/Garland (Dunn more tradeable), I think we need to retain some depth and we would still have plenty of list vacancies.

  On 26/09/2016 at 06:33, Wiseblood said:

So you're suggesting that they had a crack till half time, remembered that they had been told they were being delisted, and came out flat after half time?

What sort of logic is that?

It's the grassy knoll logic that is sometimes prevalent on this board.

I wonder how long it will be before the club make a few announcements - you would assume that, regardless of the fact that Casey played on the weekend, that internally they would have made up their minds on at least some players.  Dean Terlich, for example, won't be at the club next year.  Everyone knows that.  Do they give them the week, or do they get on with the list changes as soon as possible?

  On 27/09/2016 at 01:26, Wiseblood said:

I wonder how long it will be before the club make a few announcements - you would assume that, regardless of the fact that Casey played on the weekend, that internally they would have made up their minds on at least some players.  Dean Terlich, for example, won't be at the club next year.  Everyone knows that.  Do they give them the week, or do they get on with the list changes as soon as possible?

Most likely tomorrow 

  On 27/09/2016 at 01:28, dazzledavey36 said:

Most likely tomorrow 

You're probably right dazzle.  I can't see the club staying silent this week now that Casey's season is over.  I doubt we'll see many surprises in the announcements, though.

Given Grimes status as a free agent, i assume we don't delist him just incase we somehow get a compo pick for him?

  On 27/09/2016 at 01:28, dazzledavey36 said:

Most likely tomorrow 

I would imagine the players not involved in Casey finals would have had their exit interviews.

So if another 16-18 had to be done after sunday, that should at least take a couple of days to complete.

Expect announcements later in the week.

 

  On 27/09/2016 at 01:50, Abe said:

Given Grimes status as a free agent, i assume we don't delist him just incase we somehow get a compo pick for him?

With all due respect, I'm not sure it would amount to much more than a 4th rounder at best

  On 27/09/2016 at 01:58, Moonshadow said:

With all due respect, I'm not sure it would amount to much more than a 4th rounder at best

That's true, but given we have no first round pick, and we're likely trading our second round pick and have to use 3 picks in the draft a second 4th round pick would be an upgrade on a fifth round pick, depending on what our intentions are with that pick

will grimes get another go at a different afl club?

 

watching him on sunday was sad.

 

trengove and spencer got new one-year deals so will be on the list in 2017.

 

i'll go with the following:

dawes - wait and see depending upon hogan

lumumba - pay him out

dunn - is he a trade option? would have more value to another club than garland as defensive coverage

newton - gone

garland - is he a trade option? would have less value to another club than dunn as defensive coverage, and we somehow gave him three years

pedersen - i'd keep him as coverage

michie - gone

jkh - trade option

anb - trade option

grimes - gone

mitch white - gone / re-rookie

terlich - gone

Edited September 27, 20168 yr by DemonAndrew

  On 27/09/2016 at 02:12, DemonAndrew said:

will grimes get another go at a different afl club?..........

 

The only option springing readily to mind is Gold Coast. They have silk at either end of the paddock but no midfield. They might think it's worth throwing Grimes a lifeline. He would want to stock up on the sunscreen though.

  On 27/09/2016 at 01:26, Wiseblood said:

I wonder how long it will be before the club make a few announcements - you would assume that, regardless of the fact that Casey played on the weekend, that internally they would have made up their minds on at least some players.  Dean Terlich, for example, won't be at the club next year.  Everyone knows that.  Do they give them the week, or do they get on with the list changes as soon as possible?

Casey B&F is Thursday night I think, so possibly Friday or into Monday,

  On 27/09/2016 at 03:03, AngryAtCasey said:

Casey B&F is Thursday night I think, so possibly Friday or into Monday,

With all due respect to Casey, I would hope that doesn't matter.  Making our list decisions and moving forward is far more important in the overall context of our club.

But, you may well be right too.