What is interesting is that we have the 2 McDonalds and Frost with contracts expiring the end of this year (3 key backs on the weekend) and the rumour mill into 3rd or 4th gear on Hurley.

38 minutes ago, H_T said:

What is interesting is that we have the 2 McDonalds and Frost with contracts expiring the end of this year (3 key backs on the weekend) and the rumour mill into 3rd or 4th gear on Hurley.

Frost isn't out of contract, signed for 3 when we got him

5 minutes ago, DavidNeitz9 said:

Frost isn't out of contract, signed for 3 when we got him

Well the OP needs editing then, if that is the case.

2 hours ago, DavidNeitz9 said:

Frost isn't out of contract, signed for 3 when we got him

Source? If it is decent second hand source, I will take it.

Terlich, grimes; cant see them playing next year

Lumumba can't seem to get on the track but might see the writing on the wall and fall on his sword.  Especially if we get hibberd

Matt jones is an interesting one though, seemed to be best 22 at the start of the year and has played consistantly since we picked him up

 

18 hours ago, rpfc said:

Source? If it is decent second hand source, I will take it.

A friend who works at the MFC RPFC, i was also told Bugg signed for 3

22 hours ago, H_T said:

Well the OP needs editing then, if that is the case.

 

On 15 June 2016 at 2:27 PM, billy2803 said:

Didn't Jeffy re-sign for another 3 years only a couple of weeks ago?

HT - I'm pretty sure I'm on RPFC's Ignore List, so can you please request that he updates his post with regards to Jeffy's contract status please.

Cheers.

7 hours ago, DavidNeitz9 said:

A friend who works at the MFC RPFC, i was also told Bugg signed for 3

Ok, changes made.

3 hours ago, rpfc said:

Ok, changes made.

Also, Dunn & Spencer are UFA's next season. Garlett signed untill 2019

So I was thinking about all of this talk about list management with Melbourne and Hurley/Hibbard/Prestia and thought what do we actually need. So I did a mini-depth chart with the help from the AFL player rankings of what we have and italics are out of contract: 

Key Forward	Small/Med Forward	Inside Mid	Outside Mid	Ruck	Small/ Med Defender	Key Defender
Hogan	Garlett	N. Jones	Vince	Gawn	Jetta	T. Mac
Watts	Petracca	Viney	Salem	Spencer	Bugg	Frost
Weiderman	Kent	Tyson	Stretch	King	Wagner	O. Mac
Dawes	Vanders	Brayshaw	Hunt	King	Lumumba	Dunn
Pedersen	Harmes	Oliver	Kennedy		Melksham	Garland
Hulett	JKH	Trengove	Grimes		White
		ANB	M Jones		Terlich
		Michie	Smith
			Newton

 

Key Forwards: I believe that we have the quality here and the development of Hulett in the 2's plus King is enough for me to say that we can afford to not bring on another key forward at the moment. I'd be looking for the ruck/forward though for our depth. I would be giving Dawes (28) and Pedersen (29) another contract unless we get an offer from another club that we win from (e.g. Vickery, Nankervas, late 2nd round). I would not be moving on them for nothing or next to nothing. 

Small/Medium Forwards: Love them, they are all signed on, there is enough development here and they are all young. I'd say that I'd be drafting a small forward in the rookie draft and see how they develop - no need to go out and find one or draft one as there are plenty of mids I'd like to see as resting small/medium forwards. 

Inside Mids: I thought we had enough but I really feel we are 2 short. I'd be looking to get in a class inside mid and draft in another. I'd be saying goodbye to Michie and re-signing Trenners. 

Outside Mids: I have Hunt and Salem in here because I feel they will move up to a wing next year. Vince maybe off a half back so that reduces it. Our runners are not good enough and we need to bolster this area. I think that we need an experienced outside runner here (GWS?) and again need to draft in this area. Newton is gone at the end of the year, Grimes again is great depth and I'd want to be given something good in return for him because he has a future in the AFL. As much as Matt Jones has shown development, I think that we might be able to draft someone in the 3rd round that might offer more than another year of Jones. 

Rucks: Simple, we need another. This has to come either in the draft or through trade. I'd prefer a ruck/forward but happy to see what we get. I think that we also need to do the right thing by Spencer next year and trade him to a club where he can be playing regular AFL games. He is a good ruckman, too good for VFL. 

Small/Med Defenders: Oh we need Hibbard. I can see why we got Melksham and bringing Vince off a half back is needed. I think we do need H to get back playing next year because he gives us the depth of half back. We need to re-sign White and bring in another half back in Hibbard. Sorry Terlich, thanks for the service. I believe there is a good list and depth here, but to my mind another 2 are needed. 

Key Defenders: I like the future here with the Macs and Frost. Again I'd dangle Dunn and Garland because they should be playing AFL somewhere and we'd want something equal back in return. Clearly Hurley helps in here, if not, an experienced backman such as a Brown will help with the depth and keep the pressure on. 

So what that leaves me with as some key needs: 
1. Inside mid - good 
2. Inside mid - developing 
3. Outside mind - good 
4. Outside mid - developing 
5. Ruck - developing (King?)
6. Ruck/forward - developing (King?) 
7. Small/Med defender - experienced (Hibbard?)
8. Small/Med defender - developing 
9. Key defender - experienced (Brown?)
10. Small/Med forward - rookie 

So how do we target this considering that we dont have 10 new spots on the list? Good question. I assume that Newton, Michie, Jones are off the list. Everyone else is up in the air based on need. 

I believe that in trade terms that we need to find and experienced inside and experienced outside mid first and foremost. Is this De Bour and Peerce from Freo (I hope not) as they are the only on the free agency market. I'd be looking at GWS and seeing what we can acquire there with our future first rounder. Obviously Crouch and Prestia should be at the top of our list and really this is where we need to add someone. We need an outside runner and I don't have a solution but that Josh Kelly would be nice. We cannot expect to draft a round 1 starter this year so I’d be handing over my first rounder next year for an outside mid and handing over a player (Dawes, Dunn?) for an inside mid.

From a defender standpoint, this comes down to Hurley or not. If we don't get Hurley we shouldn't trade for a key defender (hear me out). The Browns (Collingwood and WCE) are free agents and are worth the depth. If we don't get Hurley, there is not a better option that our developing key backs because we are not going to get the GC boys, Marchbank is a nice idea but he is undersized, Weitering/Lever aren’t leaving and Rance is locked away.

The ruck idea is one that I’d be interested on hearing what the Football Department think of the Kings. Essentially they are what we need, a ruck and a ruck/forward, but are they the answer. I don't know and I wouldn't mind getting Nankervas from Sydney as he is now excess for them. Max needs to have a good next three weeks, I’m assuming we can re-rookie if no one else wants him, but I cant see him moving to the senior list.

Small medium players – I think Hibbard is the answer in here and I hope so is Melksham. I feel that the others need to be more development players, but Hibbard (or player like) is a must.

1. Outside midfielder - experienced
2. Inside midfielder – experienced
3. Small/Med Defender - Hibbard
4. Outside midfielder - draft
5. Inside midfielder – draft
6. Get an experienced Brown in FA
7. Ruck – Nankervas (Sydney)
8. Small forward/defender – rookie draft

So how does bringing in 8 work, well it doenst because for a beginning, we don't have the list space:

Out Senior – Jones, Terlich, Newton
Out Rookie – King, Michie, White, Wagner

In Senior – White, Wagner,
In Rookie – 2 KPP, 1 Ruck, 1 small def/fwd

I believe that we need to say goodbye to 1 of Dunn/Garland and Dawes/Pedersen as much as I’d like to keep all 4. I think that Ahern from GWS might suit our outside needs as I’ve looked at the list of out of contract players, and there aren’t that many that scream we need you. I have also suggested Barlow as he does offer experience, hardness and seriously needs a new start. Maybe a Jack Steele (GWS), Conca (Rich), Cavka (WC), and Hvroat (WB) are options again a trade for a future pick, this years pick, or one of our KPP.

Out Senior – Jones, Terlich, Newton, Dawes, Dunn
Out Rookie – King, Michie, White, Wagner

In Senior – White, Wagner, Hibbard (2^nd rd), Ahern (GWS future 1^st? something in return), Barlow (Dawes?),
In Rookie – 2 KPP, 1 Ruck, 1 small def/fwd

 

The last idea I am going to put out there is trading something we have for something better. His name is Liam Hulett and he has shown he should have been drafted a long way ahead of his number. I’d love to keep him but I wonder if he might be of interest to Freo/Ess/WB and we could get something they have excess of. If we ended up with a Hvroat for Hulett its not a bad result for us going forward.

 

Hope this is food for thought and my questions for you are:

1. 1.    Who is the outside mid we are missing?

2. 2.     Do we need another ruckman next year?

3. 3.     Are you willing to give up our first rounder next year?

4. 4.     Is someone like Hulett (ANB, Vanders, Harmes) to get someone else who is developing.

As rfpc hasn't logged on for a while, thought I might update the contract status

If anyone can see errors please let me know. (not sure about Garlett and Kent in particular)

Wouldn't mind if we saw some 2017 OOC players wrapped up this year eg Tyson, Stretch, Salem and of course Jesse!

Edited August 10, 20168 yr by Lucifer's Hero

The likely basis for contracts:

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/sport/afl/aflpa-not-happy-with-1011-per-cent-offer-to-players/news-story/f29e3bbff423f052356dbf05e939c6ae

"Total player payments per club this year are $10.37 million, not including additional services per club of $1.022m. The average AFL player wage last year was about $300,000".  That means the salary cap incl (ASA's) will be in the around $12.5m per club (which the AFL will fund) Clubs were informed this in the last few weeks.  The new average appears to be around $330k-$350k.  .

Sounds like the AFL is playing hard ball with AFLPA demands: "The union still haven’t got to first base on their initial three phases of the pay talks. The league have not agreed to the principle of paying players a percentage share, nor has the AFL identified what revenues might be excluded such as government grants. And it certainly has not entertained an exact percentage number, which has yet to be provided by the AFLPA".  Marsh put back in his place by the look of it!  After all, the AFLPA is owned by the AFL!

In 'rfpc's' absence, this is a list of players who are still out of contract:

Who gets a contract depends on the number spots on the seniors list after trade week ends @ Oct 20. 

• Given the frequency of selection for the seniors this year the front runners are M. Jones and Wagner. 
• Would be very surprised to see Dawes, Terlich and Grimes re-contracted.  Also doubt Newton's chances.  
• That means 4-6 spots available with 1 used for Hibberd and at least 3 for new draftees. 

Extra spots could be created from 2017 OOC players being traded.  Not at all surprised to see this happen.  Who is traded out depends on how good a pick/player we want in. 

NB:  Maynard is an additional 'B' rookie for 2017.  Trengove recontracted for 2017.  I have assumed that as Pedersen has been sent for surgery its a sign he will be offered a contract of some sort.    All other contract status is as per post #36 above.

The club has done really well to sign up the players it wants to keep while minimising the players whose careers it will terminate which tbh I always find sad to lose an mfc player especially one who has played his whole career with us and given us his all. 

Edited August 29, 20168 yr by Lucifer's Hero

LH has Pedersen signed on?

12 hours ago, deanox said:

LH has Pedersen signed on?

Not yet.  He had surgery last week which suggests he will get a contract so I removed him from the 2016 OOC players in post #38.

Edited September 5, 20168 yr by Lucifer's Hero

Does anyone know for certain that Newton is out of contract. A couple of articles that listed our out of contract players mentioned all players above except Newton. I wander if he got a 3 year contract, Port did say when he left that our contract offer was much better than their offer in both dollars and years.

After today's news I thought I would update rfpc's table so people can keep track of the overall list:

The announcements today were:  Jack Grimes, Matt Jones, Dean Terlich would not be offered a contract.

I guess it was predictable but still sad to see loyal Demons go. 

Edited September 27, 20168 yr by Lucifer's Hero

Loyal but VFL standard. Nice guys.

Any idea on how long someone can stay as a B rookie. Assuming Smith gets at least a 2nd year as a B rookie before having to go to either the normal rookie list or main list. Then someone like Maynard who signed on and trained just before the end of the year, does he have 2 more years? It may not matter but just interested given clubs can now sign Indigenous and multicultural players as B rookies.

Just clearing out more deadwood.

expect some of the others to be used as trade bait. 

 

3 hours ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

After today's delistings I thought I would update rfpc's table so people can keep track of the overall list:

The delistings today were:  Jack Grimes, Matt Jones, Dean Terlich

I guess it was predictable but still sad to see loyal Demons go. 

nice informative post, luci. hope you can keep it up to date

9 hours ago, daisycutter said:

nice informative post, luci. hope you can keep it up to date

Thanks dc, glad it is useful.  Will keep it updated as events unfold.

10 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

Any idea on how long someone can stay as a B rookie. Assuming Smith gets at least a 2nd year as a B rookie before having to go to either the normal rookie list or main list. Then someone like Maynard who signed on and trained just before the end of the year, does he have 2 more years? It may not matter but just interested given clubs can now sign Indigenous and multicultural players as B rookies.

Did some googling DeeSpencer and it seems the the same retention rules apply to all classes of Rookies.  Rookies can remain on a list for up to 3 years.

A 'B' Rookie cannot go onto another Rookie list after that 2 or 3 years.  It is either the main list or off the list altogether. 

Having said that there seems to be a push to eliminate the Rookie category altogether next year and put those players on the main list.  But not sure if that will apply to 'B' rookie or if that category remains as is.

If they don't get an AFL chance elsewhere, it would be nice if the MFC could facilitate Grimes, M. Jones and Terlich staying on Casey's list (where they have all given good service this year)!

It is simply astonishing that this club keeps handing out long term deals for guys ranked 15 - 35 on the list. 4 years for Melksham, 3 for Bugg, 3 for Garland, 4 for Lumumba, 3 for Michie.

We should rank everybody on the list for their long term strategic importance and hand out contracts in bands. If you are top 15 you can have 3+ years (rising to 5 for the top handful), 15-30 get two years and everybody else gets one year at a time.

 

 

 

10 minutes ago, poita said:

It is simply astonishing that this club keeps handing out long term deals for guys ranked 15 - 35 on the list. 4 years for Melksham, 3 for Bugg, 3 for Garland, 4 for Lumumba, 3 for Michie.

We should rank everybody on the list for their long term strategic importance and hand out contracts in bands. If you are top 15 you can have 3+ years (rising to 5 for the top handful), 15-30 get two years and everybody else gets one year at a time.

 

 

 

A very good idea in theory but I suppose you have to match the market place and as MFC you may be required to better it. In principle however I very much support your idea. Moreover in that 15-35 group the contracts should be highly incentivised with a reasonable base (say $150k) and then the rest based on senior selection.

It won't happen however while teams are desperate to attract  mid level talent from any source.