True, but is he worth that much more in a trade than some of the others? I don't mean the out and out duds, but some others who show promise. Is the #1 pick tag relevant to other clubs?

rightly or wrongly i think it is.

it equates to some as unrequited potential and appeals to their arrogance to be able to switch him on

maybe they could, who knows, but he is going nowhere with us and his trade value is diminishing each year

In the voting options there was no good option to tick to explain why I voted 'keep unless a really good trade is offered'.

I voted that way not because he has been hard done by (he has, but that in itself is not sufficient), or can be reprogrammed (no idea), or is playing well. But because he is far from being on a list of our worst players. (I'd accept he may have a better trade value than some of them however.) His detractors say he is not hard at the contest etc, but some good clubs have a player who is like that - they play outside and have good skills like he does.

I see a lot of others ticked 'not applicable' and I wonder if it was for the same reason? Or because sadly in this modern era 'keep unless a really good trade is offered' is a position we'd take on almost every player bar some long serving hero.

Firstly, in the main those that ticked N/A for keeping do so because the poll requires an answer to all questions. So if you ARE trade, not Keeping the option thats valid to that question is...ta-daaaa Not Applicable.

I would have thought Sue that the closest to your thinking to keeping is that all things considered he's playing 'OK"

gift wrapped games?

He plays every single week.

He has been playing AFL for 6 seasons. There are plenty of recruits and players that have come to poor teams and played well. He is a downhill skier.......

This is where the view of many , to me , falls down. Hes not the best. He WAS a #1 draft pick but thats only a number and a supposition based upon obviously dubious criteria.

He is a skilled but very average footballer. No where near the best

I just want to see him treated like any other player and see how he responds. Forget the whole #1 pick stuff. Get dropped if you don't contribute enough. Earn your spot back in the side. No kid gloves. Have to fight for a game, and to keep being selected.

It seems that Jack hasn't had to learn the lessons of life in the real world of football. That's when we would see if he is worth keeping or should be traded.

Have some guts footy department, Roos and selectors. Stop playing favourites with Jack. It would actually be good for his character and hopefully great for his contribution and development on the footy field.

I just want to see him treated like any other player and see how he responds. Forget the whole #1 pick stuff. Get dropped if you don't contribute enough. Earn your spot back in the side. No kid gloves. Have to fight for a game, and to keep being selected.

It seems that Jack hasn't had to learn the lessons of life in the real world of football. That's when we would see if he is worth keeping or should be traded.

Have some guts footy department, Roos and selectors. Stop playing favourites with Jack. It would actually be good for his character and hopefully great for his contribution and development on the footy field.

This is where the myth needs dispelling

Once youre on a list you are that on the list. The club wont be concerning itself much , if at all about the pick number. Roos wont have cared less.

HE HAS BEEN TREATED LIKE ANOTHER PLAYER

What a sorry admission it would be to get rid of himIt would be an admission that we dont know how to get the best from the bestWe have not and are not maximising himIts not all his fault there ere other aspects of our game and our team which need to be adressedI just hope Roos has got the answers.

Even West Coast had McDougall and Hawthorn Dowler - sometimes you [censored] up the trick is knowing when to cut your losses.

got to know when to hold 'em

know when to fold 'em !!

HE HAS BEEN TREATED LIKE ANOTHER PLAYER

Disagree there bb. To my way of thinking Jack has been gifted way too many games for his form, unlike most other players on our list (with some obvious exceptions e.g. Frawley this year).

all that means is youd hope to get more for him ( than others) , not to keep him for ever and a day

I would have thought Sue that the closest to your thinking to keeping is that all things considered he's playing 'OK"

Yes, which was why I'd say trade if you can get something good and said in the modern era sadly there are almost no players you'd 'keep forever and a day'. And compared to other players he is playing 'OK' though below our hopes.

Except for the #1 tag which may attract a club which thinks it can do better than Roos with him, I'm not convinced that he is worth much more in a trade than others. I also doubt we'd have a thread on trading him in particular if he hadn't been picked at #1.

Sue. its for others to perceive a value on Watts, in so much as those wishing to trade for. Some here would perhaps cruelly accept a packet of crisps and a coke.

I think a problem in assessing players is to apply that 'smoothing' notion of standardisation. It buggered up school reports and its just as meaningless in relation to evaluating players. ( to me )

If you suspect player X of having a particular amount of ability/potential then thats what you measure against. Is he performing up to not just the club's expectations but is he fulfilling and growing into his ability. Forge other players. If a club is looking to trade for him they are looking at HIM and NO consideration is given to anyone else in the team as a way of verifying that worth

Trade.

He has a rare talent of getting outmarked my midgets.

Proof? Every second game he plays.

Seriously, he's the most frustrating player we've had on our list for the better part of 10 years. He's had some pretty stiff opposition along the way.

Sue. its for others to perceive a value on Watts, in so much as those wishing to trade for. Some here would perhaps cruelly accept a packet of crisps and a coke.

I think a problem in assessing players is to apply that 'smoothing' notion of standardisation. It buggered up school reports and its just as meaningless in relation to evaluating players. ( to me )

If you suspect player X of having a particular amount of ability/potential then thats what you measure against. Is he performing up to not just the club's expectations but is he fulfilling and growing into his ability. Forge other players. If a club is looking to trade for him they are looking at HIM and NO consideration is given to anyone else in the team as a way of verifying that worth

Forget the crisps if we can get a 1 litre Coke it is on I reckon.

Seriously he is a bust in the same way nearly all the ones from that era have turned out.

Get what is available this year the value is certain be less in twelve months time IMO

Forget the crisps if we can get a 1 litre Coke it is on I reckon.

Seriously he is a bust in the same way nearly all the ones from that era have turned out.

Get what is available this year the value is certain be less in twelve months time IMO

thats it OD..We HAVE to trade this year...for what we can muster. Next season there will be NO mystery left surrounding him

thats it OD..We HAVE to trade this year...for what we can muster. Next season there will be NO mystery left surrounding him

i'm worried bub, we might already be a year too late

i'm worried bub, we might already be a year too late

I have to agree really. My thoughts last year were...ok mate we'll find you a new home if you're not happy....win/win

now..................

Can anyone explain to me how long Tomahawk took to become a credible player?

It was about 5 years IIRC.

Not that Watts will be the same type of player but if he does have a break out season I would prefer it to be with us ,under contract,as he is.

Can anyone explain to me how long Tomahawk took to become a credible player?

It was about 5 years IIRC.

Not that Watts will be the same type of player but if he does have a break out season I would prefer it to be with us ,under contract,as he is.

hes already 6 seasons in....

hes already 6 seasons in....

Can we get him some scary neck tatts or something.

Surely that will strike fear into them.

Can we get him some scary neck tatts or something.

Surely that will strike fear into them.

probably see himself in the mirror and cack himslef !!!!

hes already 6 seasons in....

pretty revolting seasons, though - Hawkins et al never had that.

If Roos can turn the club around, perhaps he may also turn Watts around. probably why he took on the job - thinking perhaps he could get it to work.

There are skills in there somewhere in Watts - we see them a bit, from time to time. Probably the reason he keeps on getting picked. Not working as well as you'd wish, no, but that's true of the team in general. And we are waiting on Paul Roos.

If Roos has had enough, ok. but, faith in Roos is what we have, at this stage.

there may be skills...... no one's found a ticker to date though

What a sorry admission it would be to get rid of him

It would be an admission that we dont know how to get the best from the best

We have not and are not maximising him

Its not all his fault there ere other aspects of our game and our team which need to be adressed

I just hope Roos has got the answers.

imo, straight swap this >

Photo: Jack Watts of the Demons looks on after one of the Cats' 37 goals during Saturday's match at Kardinia Park. (Hamish Blair)

for this >

Even West Coast had McDougall and Hawthorn Dowler - sometimes you [censored] up the trick is knowing when to cut your losses.

This^^^^^^^^

Plenty of clubs have realised the first rounders just aren't up to it and cut their losses, the Hawks also drafted Beau Muston, Meth Coast Sampi, Pies - Egan, Cats - Tenace, Tigers -Tambling/Oakley-Nicholls you just have to make the hard decision

If he hasn't learned by now that body contact won't kill him and he has to keep his feet I don't think he will. Would make a standout state league/ammo player but you need more than talent to make it in the pros - you need the mentality and he does not have it.

the way i see it... Jack will mentally mature and realise his body is bigger than most when he's about 26/27.... He is 23... He will be a completely different player when he turns 26/27... Can we wait that long? And probably only for two or three golden years? I can... But i have trouble letting any of our players go, so of course i can...

In about round five this year, most were saying he had turned his game around and that Roos was a genius... I did like a couple his matches back then, but really they were skill based games and he managed to rack up quite a few possessions... When he mentally matures, the way he attacks games will be completely different... He will never be a bustling, bash and crash type player, who drags in pack marks over five players.. But with he's skill set, i don't think he'll have to be... Others may not agree with me... but i think Jack will mature in to a very skilful player that will control matches, floating through all parts of the ground... People tend to compare him to Goddard who plays a similar game, but for me Hird in 2000 is a better comparison...

Jack looks to lack confidence in his game and in his team mates, much like most of our team... With confidence he showed earlier this year, that he can produce some solid performances... Team confidence is a major factor here and Obviously, when the team grows in confidence so will jack... Unfortunately for us though, we will have to wait until he turns 26/27before we see the best of Jack Watts...

I just hoping that we as a club, can hold our nerve.... the media machine of the power clubs are pushing for us to move him on, and the hordes circling our fallen list... If we aren't careful we will become holding station, for the stronger clubs...

there must be better returns on investment around

The problem is not with Jack, more with our list's lack of depth and talent such that we have to play and rely on Jack week in week out. Much to our dissapointment.

He's alway suffered from that expectation, and he's not up to carrying this team. But to be fair, none on our list are, and only a few in the AFL could (i.e Ablett).

Jack will rise with the tide...