Watching football on TV from the GWS home ground is painful.

The person who thought up the idea of all that orange seating should be marched out of the country. Without crowds to fill the seats, you can't track an orange football in the air against the sea of orange. And the orange they chose is the most hideous, bright orange.

Spare a thought for what life's like for the GW$ orange-boy!

The other thing to remember about GWS is their crowd numbers are all bullshite. I had a mate at the game who was adamant there would have been no more than 5000 there tops.

And most of them are opposition supporters.

The other thing to remember about GWS is their crowd numbers are all bullshite. I had a mate at the game who was adamant there would have been no more than 5000 there tops.

i think they count the ground staff too...lol

The Great Contribution from Andrew Demetrio.

Rennovating linton St Princess Park and Vic Park would have been a far better strategy in my view.

The Great Contribution from Andrew Demetrio.

Rennovating linton St Princess Park and Vic Park would have been a far better strategy in my view.

Princes Park had at least the foundations of a good AFL ground. The Legends stand was a financial black hole at the time but at least they had a digital scoreboard.

Waverley was dead in the water, no doubt but if the AFL had bothered to service it what might have happened? The bulk of Melbourne's population lives in Eastern Melbourne.

Now, we are left with two grounds in Melbourne. No one expected Glenferrie Oval or Brunswick Street to be hosting games after 1980 but why did all the others get shut down?

i think they count the ground staff too...lol

I think they include anything with a beating heart at the ground. The crowd figures are more of a farce than a Zimbabwe "election".

I think they include anything with a beating heart at the ground. The crowd figures are more of a farce than a Zimbabwe "election".

not sure if 'beating' is actually required

Princes Park had at least the foundations of a good AFL ground. The Legends stand was a financial black hole at the time but at least they had a digital scoreboard.

Waverley was dead in the water, no doubt but if the AFL had bothered to service it what might have happened? The bulk of Melbourne's population lives in Eastern Melbourne.

Now, we are left with two grounds in Melbourne. No one expected Glenferrie Oval or Brunswick Street to be hosting games after 1980 but why did all the others get shut down?

Victorian clubs got shadted up the aisle so badly...and right under their stupid noses.

For them all, apart from Drug Den to agree to play home games at a privately owned stadium is just pathetic

Princess park still has the bones to be a good 'smaller' ground

Princess park still has the bones to be a good 'smaller' ground

I was there about two years ago and those bones are looking extremely brittle.

Princess park still has the bones to be a good 'smaller' ground

of course it does. Needs $$$ same with Morabbin.

Kardinia Park was a dump in 1999. Look at it now

I was there about two years ago and those bones are looking extremely brittle.

not saying some serious money wouldnt be required, but theres is the foundation for a good ground still...imho

Kelly is going to be an absolute star. There are no flaws in his game.

Considering the culture problem up the GWS, Kelly will prove to be their most important player in the future.

Kelly is a leader and GWS future captain.

Yes we appear to of won the trade, but I won't be running down Josh Kelly, I think he suits GWS needs, they need a professional young kid, they get that in Kelly.

Agree with you about Kelly, be interesting to see if he does stay on and be that player for them.

I don't think we need to talk winning trades, there was initial debate and that's fair but now it's on with the game. Tyson is a great get, Kelly and Salem will be good players.

in Round 3. A lot has clicked since then

I'm not defending GWS, but geez if anyone should be counting their lucky stars underperforming, embarrassing teams don't get kicked out of the league....

I'm not defending GWS, but geez if anyone should be counting their lucky stars underperforming, embarrassing teams don't get kicked out of the league....

Not the issue Stuie.

We are a club formed in 1858.

GW$ are a shonky franchaise that at the end of the day are a Tax Relief for both the AFL & Murdoch.

Not the issue Stuie.

We are a club formed in 1858.

GW$ are a shonky franchaise that at the end of the day are a Tax Relief for both the AFL & Murdoch.

It is the issue really. You're not saying the same things about Gold Coast are you.

Why are they a "tax relief"? They're not a church or a charity, and millions have been invested by the AFL. How does that work out as a tax relief? (Honest question, not having a go)

it is often mentioned that the wise pick their battles

Western Sydney is not the battle for the AFL. Its NEVER..EVER going to win here. So after squillions of dollars and must wasted effort what will GWS achieve for the game.

Zilch

It actually devalues the brand.

It is the issue really. You're not saying the same things about Gold Coast are you.

Why are they a "tax relief"? They're not a church or a charity, and millions have been invested by the AFL. How does that work out as a tax relief? (Honest question, not having a go)

The AFL are a "non profitable" organization we are told. That means they have to transfer $$$ somewhere.

Gold Coast $un$ may yet become a trainwreck as nothing seems to last up there, but so far they have shown some fight.

GW$ are going backwards....fast.

it is often mentioned that the wise pick their battles

Western Sydney is not the battle for the AFL. Its NEVER..EVER going to win here. So after squillions of dollars and must wasted effort what will GWS achieve for the game.

Zilch

It actually devalues the brand.

Sydney is the battle. The Greater Western bit was just an excuse to keep them separate from Sydney and hopefully get a little traction in the West but really it's about having 2 Sydney teams and growing the sport in Sydney.

The AFL can't get any bigger unless it cracks Sydney. It can't crack Sydney just with the swans. 1 team alone is destined to always be a niche market that gets largely ignored until finals.

2 teams hopefully means the sport grows and kids start playing the game and it starts getting much more media attention.

Absolutely.

Does anyone despise Ablett for taking the money and the challenge? no, because he didnt go about it in a manner that deceives everybody around him

And Ablett has earned every cent he has been paid. There can't have been that many people who believed he would actually get better without having the likes of Ling, Bartell, Kelly playing second fiddle for him. You could make a reasonable argument that he has been underpaid.

As for Scully it must be difficult for him to walk around the club with head held high

It's built on success. Stuff social clubs. Hawthorn were rubbish for years and then became a power side during the 80s. That's where their supporters have come from. They were never traditionally a 'big' club, but they've made some great moves since '96. The lucky factor for them was that they'd had great success in the recent past and thus had supporters to tap into when memberships became an integral part of the AFL business.

The Hawks success was built on being at ground level with the supporters keeping them in touch rather than frolicking up above level 2. Once the club decided to buy into professionalism, the 2 aspects merged into a tough rugged culture of hard & physical football. that grounded foundation has held them in power since they started to roll in the 60's.

All for one & one for All

the foundation of representing the brood is key to their culture.

not saying some serious money wouldnt be required, but theres is the foundation for a good ground still...imho

I used to think that as well, but after having seen it I would think that starting from scratch somewhere else would be more cost-efficient.

I like watching GWS fail, because the decision to include them in the competition was based around potential revenue.

The decision to include GWS in the competition wasn't about whether it would make the AFL a better game to watch - it was instead about those missing dollars in NSW.

I'd strip 4-5 sides from the competition and have teams play each other twice.

It would make the game, better, fairer and even out the talent coming into the competition.

I wish the AFL were realistic, but instead, they include GWS, GC and just further devalue the overall game.

The AFL cares more about the brand - than the game... But, what they need to realize is that, the game is the product of the brand - devaluing that product damages the brand itself, especially in the long term..

I like watching GWS fail, because the decision to include them in the competition was based around potential revenue.

The decision to include GWS in the competition wasn't about whether it would make the AFL a better game to watch - it was instead about those missing dollars in NSW.

I'd strip 4-5 sides from the competition and have teams play each other twice.

It would make the game, better, fairer and even out the talent coming into the competition.

I wish the AFL were realistic, but instead, they include GWS, GC and just further devalue the overall game.

The AFL cares more about the brand - than the game... But, we they need to realize is that, the game is the product of the brand - devaluing that product damages the brand itself.

Here is the difference between the Freos, Ports of this world and the GWS's and the differences between the GWS's of this world and the Gold Coast.

When Freo and Port were introduced into the AFL, there was a clear demand in their home states for a second team. The Eagles and Crows were actually putting a cap on their memberships at one stage.

Gold Coast is a growth area (and has been for nigh on 40 years now). There are lots of ex-pat Victorians up there who actually like the game.

Western Sydney is a place where the Skips all follow league and the migrant community follow the A-League. It was bought on by AFL greed.

Ron Barassi made very plain that while he was coach of the Swans, he was respectful of the fact that Sydney was a rugby league town. His job wasn't to put league out of business and never would be. It would be to allow the Swans to carve their own niche out as a stand alone team in Sydney.

Putting the Giants in Western Sydney was a pretty bloody aggressive statement to the NRL. It was a case of 'game on' and I think they will come to regret it. It would be like the NRL putting a team in Geelong (a city with a rock solid football tradition). People would have no interest.