Moving past the credibility of any one of us and our observations at training - all I am referencing is the fact that Hogan had a back complaint before playing a practice match and then he is out for at least 8 weeks.

I am not claiming any inside knowledge, only the opinion that we got the decision to play him in that game wrong.

How you can argue the opposite I don't know.

Sure, if he hadn't played that particular minute of that particular game he wouldn't have had that particular knee in that particular part of his back.

Just has Strauss not played that particular minute of that particular game v Carltank he wouldn't have broken his leg. Was it a poor decision to not have him on the bench at that particular moment?

Injuries happen: he got unlucky and a knee exacerbated his back injury. Had the knee not been there right then who knows, we may not be having the conversation and instead be celebrating being 4 and 1 ?

Along with the management of Trengove - both of them were injuries that were not caused but exacerbated by the poor management of the club.

You can be Hogan's Heroes new sidekick at the club ! Without any insight into how injuries presented themselves, ongoing investigation or management you conclude poor management by the club - astounding.

With Trenner, Hoges, Salem and the Toump building themselevs up, Garlo a full pre season, Gawn not gawn, Dawes ready to go round one, one plug and play gun recruit and an early draft pick we will have a great side round 1 next season. can't wait

Only on a Melbourne forum are people getting excited about round 1 when we haven't even reached round 6 yet.

I am somewhat gobsmacked by the criticism of the medical and fitness staff on here.

I will state categorically that the criticism may be well justified but that is if and only if you have insight into the management of injured players and no one here does.

We can criticise our coach for not making a move or not playing a player because we have enough insight to give an opinion. We can criticise a player for the way he plays ( even though we don't the coaches instructions) because we have a fair understanding of the game and how we perceive it should be played.

But to criticise the medical and fitness with no knowledge of how injuries were actually sustained, identified, input from the players themselves ( how many times do you hear players admit after the event that there were less than honest about the extent of soreness or an injury) and management of the injuries is an opinion without any foundation whatsoever.

You can be Hogan's Heroes new sidekick at the club ! Without any insight into how injuries presented themselves, ongoing investigation or management you conclude poor management by the club - astounding.

The club told us how the injuries pesented themselves. I am basing my conclusions off information received through Josh Mahoney.

The club told us how the injuries pesented themselves. I am basing my conclusions off information received through Josh Mahoney.

I really don't think you are...

I'd imagine that they would want Hogan to play at Casey for at least a couple of weeks to build his fitness up which would delay his availability for Melbourne

I really don't think you are...

What you think is irrelevant...

What you think is irrelevant...

Same goes for you, princess.

He's at training so he's still alive, some positive news.

Easily:

"Hogan damaged his back in a recent NAB Challenge match when a knee from an opponent forced him from the field. "

I didn't see that hit, did you?

I think that is BS.

He exacerbated an injury to his back and it was a mistake to play him.

I didn't see that hit, did you?

I think that is BS.

He exacerbated an injury to his back and it was a mistake to play him.

Spot on. I think it was the Footy Show where Hogan mumbled that his back was a bit sore before the Geelong match and it flared up after the match.

You can't really blame conditioning/medical staff for such injuries in my opinion. I've worked in the TAC Cup, and sometimes the players just don't present their injuries until it's too late.

I've seen it happen before... 2 blokes both had stress related foot injuries:

- Player 1 went to the medical staff at first sign of symptom and was diagnosed with a stress related 'hot spot' on the navicular bone. He spent about 5-6weeks in rehab at training and was eventually given the all clear. Played the rest of the season and dominated.

- Player 2 went to the medical staff after trying to play through pain for a fortnight (and concealing it from the club) and was then diagnosed with a fractured navicular bone didn't play for the rest of the season. Luckily enough he had another year in the system and dominated in his final season.

Unfortunately some players are just so competitive and driven that they continue to play with discomfort and don't present their injuries until it is too late.

Well all he's doing is walking, which was what he doing 8 weeks ago.

So no progression.

Disappointing.

Hogan actually has couple of cracked vertabrae in his back - they will mend with time. It is best left to the conditioning guys to decide when he will be right to play.

If it is not this year then that is the correct decision. He will be gun forward for us next year.

I didn't see that hit, did you?

I think that is BS.

He exacerbated an injury to his back and it was a mistake to play him.

I find it staggering that some have such a black and/or white view of topics, to the point where they will write off any other suggestion/view as incorrect, based on absolutely zero evidence, other than what they think.

At times it feels that some supporters are hoping the MFC does something wrong, so that they can unzip their fly and try to start length competitions again.

I am somewhat gobsmacked by the criticism of the medical and fitness staff on here.

I will state categorically that the criticism may be well justified but that is if and only if you have insight into the management of injured players and no one here does.

We can criticise our coach for not making a move or not playing a player because we have enough insight to give an opinion. We can criticise a player for the way he plays ( even though we don't the coaches instructions) because we have a fair understanding of the game and how we perceive it should be played.

But to criticise the medical and fitness with no knowledge of how injuries were actually sustained, identified, input from the players themselves ( how many times do you hear players admit after the event that there were less than honest about the extent of soreness or an injury) and management of the injuries is an opinion without any foundation whatsoever.

While I wouldn't criticise the recent handling of Trengove and Hogan there is enough information for the club to conduct a further investigation.

I would expect the club to make any judgements based on info from independent experts.

Let's see what we can learn from these things rather than hang people out to dry.

Edited April 24, 201411 yr by jabberwocky

The club told us how the injuries pesented themselves. I am basing my conclusions off information received through Josh Mahoney.

Yup - presented with a sore back. Please advise on medical treatment and management and more importantly the injuries responses to the management. Please also advise on Hogan's responses to questions on treatment and management and his injuries responsiveness to the treatments as patient feedback plays an enormous part in ongoing management. Then we are in a position to make some form of conclusion, notwithstanding that we are not medical professionals nor factoring in that two people with the same injuries don't necessarily respond to treatment and recover the same way.

Hogan actually has couple of cracked vertabrae in his back

Pretty sure we haven't heard that before..

Source?

While I wouldn't criticise the recent handling of Trengove and Hogan there is enough information for the club to conduct a further investigation.

I have no problem with that. I could speculate that the investigation will turn up that you follow a certain course of action and most players respond to it and some just don't but that is falling into the same trap as others on here. We do not have full insight into presentation, management, player discussions with the medical staff and actual responsiveness to the treatment.

It may turn out that full investigation reveals that the medico's completely mishandled these two players or it may turn out that they were handled correctly and certain things did not present ( Trengoves first scan ?), players were less than forthcoming on the extent of the problem, or the injuries didn't reveal themselves and when they did they didnt respond.

My point is that when it comes to the injury room it is all pure guesswork and opinions based on vapor.

Hogan actually has couple of cracked vertabrae in his back - they will mend with time. It is best left to the conditioning guys to decide when he will be right to play.

If it is not this year then that is the correct decision. He will be gun forward for us next year.

This wouldn't surprise me, but then why are they continuing to put forward the "4 weeks" on official injury reports. If his back is cooked they should just tell us.

Step 1) Trade Hogan + 2nd round pick or player to Fremantle for Fyfe

Step 2) Draft Peter Wright with pick number 1

Step 1) Trade Hogan + 2nd round pick or player to Fremantle for Fyfe

Step 2) Draft Peter Wright with pick number 1

As crazy as this sounds, i wouldnt hate this.

I'd be shattered to lose hogan though

I find it staggering that some have such a black and/or white view of topics, to the point where they will write off any other suggestion/view as incorrect, based on absolutely zero evidence, other than what they think.

At times it feels that some supporters are hoping the MFC does something wrong, so that they can unzip their fly and try to start length competitions again.

Excuse me?

I am not hanging anyone here, I have already maintained that it is an understandable error.

But it is a frustrating error and one that continues to annoy me for the fact that they did not tell us that he had a sore back before the game when he evidently did.

Nothing is ever black and white, Billy.

But this is a dark shade of grey - he shouldn't have played.

But it is a frustrating error and one that continues to annoy me for the fact that they did not tell us that he had a sore back before the game when he evidently did.

What we don't know is exactly what the medical staff was told by Hogan before the game.

My question ( I genuinely don't know the answer) is to what degree Hogan highlighted the problem before playing.

Players are being rubbed down before during and after games to iron out sore spots. You see players who come off with knee injuries running the boundary line to see if they can run the injury out - even go back out on the ground.

If indeed Hogan told the staff he had a sore back and they sent him on then it is an error indeed. What if Hogan said "I have a sore spot - rub me down and Ill see if i can run it out ?"

We dont know what we dont know.