Frawley wants to know...

[Ungarieboy 443]

Seems like common sense to me.

Who'd blame him if he decided to leave after a 3 win season. The only player who I reckon would truly stay loyal at the club for his whole career would be Grimes.

And I don't believe we'd match any other offers if he wants out. No other club has matched an offer since FA has come in. Would be the equivalent of keeping a disgruntled girlfriend who has the hots for someone far more attractive (ie -Hawthorn)

Free agency is still in its infancy, clubs will match offers on restricted free agents in the future, and clubs have shown in the past that they are willing to keep players who have wanted to leave - O'keefe at the swans being a great example.

The disgruntled girlfriend might love and respond to the attention of a more attractive suitor, but when that attention quickly disappears or changes to another potential catch; then there is no attraction. Still if treated poorly, then she may seek other suitors!

[Ungarieboy 443]

My dad plays golf with Danny Frawley, well at least at the same club. Danny told him, that James being a country boy is very loyal to the team that gave him a shot, however his dream is deep finals football. If he sees any possibility of playing it with Melbourne he'll stick around for life, but if there's no progression he won't risk his dream for a team who in 7 years has really not delivered.

I am perfectly fine with this opinion, and in the same position I would do the same.

He's stood up for alot of blokes in the last 7 years, and it's time for them to repay him. If they do that, he'll be a dee for life.

Sounds like the type of player you want at your club, loyal but not to the point of being self destrucitve

[Guest]

The club is NO longer the toxic place it was.

Chips entitled to look around.. So are we.

He we go another one.

Lets se if he gets back to his A game and no injuries. If not he is free to go.

Again. Not end of the world.

Hes just one cog in a far bigger machine. Our fortunes hardly revolve around him.

Hes good...not brilliant.

I agree to an extent about the club culture.

It's being cleaned up as we speak. I, nor anyone outside the club, can say if it's mission completed. At least this time the people in charge of the clean up mission are qualified.

Are they good enough to bring real change to the club? Time will tell.

I agree with you on Chip. Good clubs find a way to cover lost stars. Hawthorn have lost Buddy but they still play well without him. They are also still among the favorites for the flag. We need to aim to be similar to that.

[Machsy 2,858]

The thing with Chip, is that I struggle to think of a player we could bring in via trade or FA that would be a better replacement.

The fact he'll be so sought after by top teams also indicates those teams will have a weakness at his position.

One we also look to be able to exploit with our forward line riches.

Frawley's staying is completely dependent on our midfield showing enough progress to properly utilise the capabilities of our attack and defense. It rests on guys like Vince, Michie, Cross and Tyson, and the young ones to develop quickly.

[daisycutter 29,707]

my understanding was chip said he wanted first to see that the club was heading in the right direction

no mention of number of wins or making finals

i'm a bit like chip. i too am waiting to see "proof" on the field that we are headed in the right direction

I've asked myself what should that proof be (in 2014)

unless it's a big number of wins like PA (which would be too exceptional) i don't think wins per se is the answer

then i though of %, lack of blowouts, possessions and other key stats

In the end I decided I will just know, bearing in mind what I see with my own two eyes

not scientific i know, but i'm just talking about 2014 and turning the ship around

I hope chip is prepared to use his own judgement too and not some arbitrary stat

[DemonFrog 1,356]

[DeeSpencer 26,070]

I understand the logic but my greatest concern is that one of our best players and a guy who can be elite at his position is waiting for the club to turn around. Why is there not belief already that things have changed? Where is his confidence that through on field deeds and leadership he can change things?

Now part of that is also as a full back his main job is to limit the oppositions best forward and he's not the ball winning midfielder who can get 10 clearances and 30 plus touches and really break open a contest. And the other concern is that we've been through this all before when Neeld replaced Bailey.

But compare it to Travis Boak who in Port's darkest hour had faith in his team mates and faith in the club.

If Frawley truly isn't sure that things will change then doesn't that say a lot about the psyche of the players. If a gun like Frawley isn't sure how things are going to go how are lesser players meant to be confident to perform?

[daisycutter 29,707]

I understand the logic but my greatest concern is that one of our best players and a guy who can be elite at his position is waiting for the club to turn around. Why is there not belief already that things have changed? Where is his confidence that through on field deeds and leadership he can change things?

Now part of that is also as a full back his main job is to limit the oppositions best forward and he's not the ball winning midfielder who can get 10 clearances and 30 plus touches and really break open a contest. And the other concern is that we've been through this all before when Neeld replaced Bailey.

But compare it to Travis Boak who in Port's darkest hour had faith in his team mates and faith in the club.

If Frawley truly isn't sure that things will change then doesn't that say a lot about the psyche of the players. If a gun like Frawley isn't sure how things are going to go how are lesser players meant to be confident to perform?

maybe he wants to be assured that the current changes are indeed permanent

but the current changes (good that seem to be) are only a means to the real objective, which is a change on the field, and maybe that is what he is waiting for

you really only have a difference of timing (as far as we know)

Travis Boak was a very brave fellow and not typical of the modern footballer. It happened to have a good ending for him.

[jumbo returns 6,741]

The thing with Chip, is that I struggle to think of a player we could bring in via trade or FA that would be a better replacement.

The fact he'll be so sought after by top teams also indicates those teams will have a weakness at his position.

One we also look to be able to exploit with our forward line riches.

Frawley's staying is completely dependent on our midfield showing enough progress to properly utilise the capabilities of our attack and defense. It rests on guys like Vince, Michie, Cross and Tyson, and the young ones to develop quickly.

Therein lies a problem within itself.

The boys we've selected in the trade period haven't played top level footy for a long time.....it might take 10-12 games for them to find their feet.

What if we're 2-10 at the halfwayish time of the year?

[KingDingAling 3,758]

I understand the logic but my greatest concern is that one of our best players and a guy who can be elite at his position is waiting for the club to turn around. Why is there not belief already that things have changed? Where is his confidence that through on field deeds and leadership he can change things?

Now part of that is also as a full back his main job is to limit the oppositions best forward and he's not the ball winning midfielder who can get 10 clearances and 30 plus touches and really break open a contest. And the other concern is that we've been through this all before when Neeld replaced Bailey.

But compare it to Travis Boak who in Port's darkest hour had faith in his team mates and faith in the club.

If Frawley truly isn't sure that things will change then doesn't that say a lot about the psyche of the players. If a gun like Frawley isn't sure how things are going to go how are lesser players meant to be confident to perform?

Boak nearly signed at Geelong, I've heard no legitimate mutterings about Frawley speaking to other clubs.

Frawley is just waiting it out and good on him, the MFC has been a rabble the majority of the time he has been here.

[rjay 25,063]

I understand the logic but my greatest concern is that one of our best players and a guy who can be elite at his position is waiting for the club to turn around. Why is there not belief already that things have changed? Where is his confidence that through on field deeds and leadership he can change things?

Now part of that is also as a full back his main job is to limit the oppositions best forward and he's not the ball winning midfielder who can get 10 clearances and 30 plus touches and really break open a contest. And the other concern is that we've been through this all before when Neeld replaced Bailey.

But compare it to Travis Boak who in Port's darkest hour had faith in his team mates and faith in the club.

If Frawley truly isn't sure that things will change then doesn't that say a lot about the psyche of the players. If a gun like Frawley isn't sure how things are going to go how are lesser players meant to be confident to perform?

You are reading far to much into this 'master' and our position is different to Ports. It wasn't long ago they won a flag, they were stable with one coach (Williams) at the helm. Admittedly most of their players weren't around for the flag but some of their senior players were. The problem was their new coach (Primus) wanted to move the premiership players on and this created instability. Coach gone, problem fixed. Well of course there were the off ground issues as well. I just don't see our situation as being anything like Ports. We hadn't won a flag under Danners and we've had 2 poor appointments since in Bailey and Neeld along with a disaster in CS back for a 2nd go.

Edited February 2, 2014 by rjay

[dee-luded 2,959]

Sounds like he's gone to me...

could be a direct swap for,,, $cully.

[dee-luded 2,959]

I agree to an extent about the club culture.

It's being cleaned up as we speak. I, nor anyone outside the club, can say if it's mission completed. At least this time the people in charge of the clean up mission are qualified.

Are they good enough to bring real change to the club? Time will tell.

I agree with you on Chip. Good clubs find a way to cover lost stars. Hawthorn have lost Buddy but they still play well without him. They are also still among the favorites for the flag. We need to aim to be similar to that.

Hollywood Boulevard, cleaned up-out?

[Wormburner 674]

Chip has got 9mths before his Contract is up. I cannot blame him for wanting to see how we're traveling before signing an extension...

The poor backline has been slaughtered the past 2 seasons by oppositions inside 50's. If things don't improve, why would you sign up for that constant bombardment again!

[Hannibal 5,814]

I understand the logic but my greatest concern is that one of our best players and a guy who can be elite at his position is waiting for the club to turn around. Why is there not belief already that things have changed? Where is his confidence that through on field deeds and leadership he can change things?

But compare it to Travis Boak who in Port's darkest hour had faith in his team mates and faith in the club.

You're using Boak as a pinup boy, but seem to be overlooking the fact that Boak re-signed for 2 years in September 2012. He made Port wait the entire year for his signature as he was out of contract at the end of 2012. Frawley's last year in contract hasn't even started. At the death knock Boak decided to stay, but you're wanting Frawley to do it now.

If it was me and I'd been promised all and sundry for years I'd at least wait until we were kicking the footy around before I rushed in and signed. There's no earthly reason for him to do it now other than have the conversation go away.

[beelzebub 23,382]

Whilst I do understand where Frawley is coming from in the main, there are elements to "the Masters' post which bear commenting upon.

So am I to understand that someone who makes motions and utterances about leadership is now waiting to be led ?

I dont quite get this idea....didnt get it either wen good ol' Watts questioned where the leaders were... Look in the [censored] mirror ...same goes for Frawley..Hes waiting.... ??? to see a direction ?? He OUGHT TO BE INSTIGATING THAT DIRECTION.

If you really want to understand why we've been easy beats its this lack of mental hardness.

To paraphrase a well known utterance:

CHip do not ask what your club will do for you, ask what you can do for your club.

[mjt 640]

Whilst I do understand where Frawley is coming from in the main, there are elements to "the Masters' post which bear commenting upon.

So am I to understand that someone who makes motions and utterances about leadership is now waiting to be led ?

I dont quite get this idea....didnt get it either wen good ol' Watts questioned where the leaders were... Look in the [censored] mirror ...same goes for Frawley..Hes waiting.... ??? to see a direction ?? He OUGHT TO BE INSTIGATING THAT DIRECTION.

If you really want to understand why we've been easy beats its this lack of mental hardness.

To paraphrase a well known utterance:

CHip do not ask what your club will do for you, ask what you can do for your club.

Hes had 7 coaches in 8 years, he's probably had enough.

[daisycutter 29,707]

Whilst I do understand where Frawley is coming from in the main, there are elements to "the Masters' post which bear commenting upon.

So am I to understand that someone who makes motions and utterances about leadership is now waiting to be led ?

I dont quite get this idea....didnt get it either wen good ol' Watts questioned where the leaders were... Look in the [censored] mirror ...same goes for Frawley..Hes waiting.... ??? to see a direction ?? He OUGHT TO BE INSTIGATING THAT DIRECTION.

If you really want to understand why we've been easy beats its this lack of mental hardness.

To paraphrase a well known utterance:

CHip do not ask what your club will do for you, ask what you can do for your club.

LOL - that's soooo 60's BB

but i do see where you are coming from

[Machsy 2,858]

I understand the logic but my greatest concern is that one of our best players and a guy who can be elite at his position is waiting for the club to turn around. Why is there not belief already that things have changed? Where is his confidence that through on field deeds and leadership he can change things?

Now part of that is also as a full back his main job is to limit the oppositions best forward and he's not the ball winning midfielder who can get 10 clearances and 30 plus touches and really break open a contest. And the other concern is that we've been through this all before when Neeld replaced Bailey.

But compare it to Travis Boak who in Port's darkest hour had faith in his team mates and faith in the club.

If Frawley truly isn't sure that things will change then doesn't that say a lot about the psyche of the players. If a gun like Frawley isn't sure how things are going to go how are lesser players meant to be confident to perform?

We've been through many false dawns before.

He's experienced a few of them directly himself.

I think in the past Frawley would feel like he has performed as well as he possibly could, exerting the greatest possible influence on a match that he could, and it has all come to nought.

He knows he can't do it alone, needs his teammates to step up, and is smart enough to realise that preseason intra-club form doesn't always translate.

I can't blame him.

Having said that, I fully expect him to stay.

We also don't have a time reference for his decision to hold off.

It was Josh Mahoney who brought this to public attention, not Frawley.

The decision may be dated back to late last season when we would have been mad not to attempt to re-sign him.

Chances are the wheel is slowly turning for Frawley personally, but he'd be a fool to make a rash decision prior to a H&A match being played.

[Machsy 2,858]

Therein lies a problem within itself.

The boys we've selected in the trade period haven't played top level footy for a long time.....it might take 10-12 games for them to find their feet.

What if we're 2-10 at the halfwayish time of the year?

I think Frawley is smart enough to know it won't happen straight away.

He'd also be remiss to make a hard and fast decision at the halfway point of the season.

Chances are we will start relatively slowly, but gain momentum as the season progresses, a la the bulldogs in 2013.

Such a turnaround in form should be enough imho.

[rjay 25,063]

Whilst I do understand where Frawley is coming from in the main, there are elements to "the Masters' post which bear commenting upon.

So am I to understand that someone who makes motions and utterances about leadership is now waiting to be led ?

I dont quite get this idea....didnt get it either wen good ol' Watts questioned where the leaders were... Look in the [censored] mirror ...same goes for Frawley..Hes waiting.... ??? to see a direction ?? He OUGHT TO BE INSTIGATING THAT DIRECTION.

If you really want to understand why we've been easy beats its this lack of mental hardness.

To paraphrase a well known utterance:

CHip do not ask what your club will do for you, ask what you can do for your club.

I reckon 'Chip' has done his bit for the club and I hope he keeps on doing it for years to come. I also reckon he and many of his mates have been let down badly by the club. Even the new CEO acknowledged that the environment needed to change to allow the players their best opportunity to develop.

From the times I've been at training this year he seems to be doing his bit, working hard on the ground as a leader should. He's not only one of the best players at the club he is well liked by the playing group and anyone that's had anything to do with him. Lets hope the support from the other side of the fence is as we hope it is. The on-field leaders can't do it if the whole club isn't pulling it's weight.

[Machsy 2,858]

Whilst I do understand where Frawley is coming from in the main, there are elements to "the Masters' post which bear commenting upon.

So am I to understand that someone who makes motions and utterances about leadership is now waiting to be led ?

I dont quite get this idea....didnt get it either wen good ol' Watts questioned where the leaders were... Look in the [censored] mirror ...same goes for Frawley..Hes waiting.... ??? to see a direction ?? He OUGHT TO BE INSTIGATING THAT DIRECTION.

If you really want to understand why we've been easy beats its this lack of mental hardness.

To paraphrase a well known utterance:

CHip do not ask what your club will do for you, ask what you can do for your club.

This isn't about leadership.

When direction is discussed, it is in terms of the team's performance.

He is only one man and only has so much influence.

He needs his teammates to get on board and deliver.

If that happens, or if it doesn't, I'm sure it'll make his decision for him.

[beelzebub 23,382]

direction...leadership influence outcome

people not see the flow ?

You dont wait, you make

its everything about leadership

[mjt 640]

direction...leadership influence outcome

people not see the flow ?

You dont wait, you make

its everything about leadership

Your making a fool of yourself like I just said he's had 7 coaches in 8 yrs. Edited February 2, 2014 by mjt

[Marty 419]

In his AA year his greatest asset was that not only would he win the contest.

Then he would tuck the ball under his arm and take the game on!

He needs a lot of support from the rest of the team to get this back.

A midfield that can break hard to space and a team mate to cover him if there is a quick turnover.

the last few years he hasn't had that.

If it only takes 1 player to stand up and lead then what happened to Gold Coast?

Based on Garys year they should have made the finals at very least.

If we can play competitive footy, and Chip can get that confidence back to take the game on, he will show the leadership we need.