do you mean this game >

Melbourne v Richmond MCG, Sunday 21 August, 4.40pm (AEST)

TEAMS

MELBOURNE

B: Colin Garland, James Frawley, Clint Bartram

HB: Aaron Davey, Jared Rivers, Joel Macdonald

C: Sam Blease, Tom Scully

HF: Jack Trengove, Stefan Martin, Jeremy Howe

F: Ricky Petterd, Jack Watts, Brad Green

Foll: Mark Jamar, Colin Sylvia, Nathan Jones

I/C: Lynden Dunn, Cale Morton, Jamie Bennell, Neville Jetta, Liam Jurrah, Jordie McKenzie, Daniel Nicholson

In: Brad Green, Jamie Bennell, Neville Jetta, Liam Jurrah

Out: Luke Tapscott (soreness)

OUT:Clint Bartram, Brad Green (retired), Jared Rivers, Brent Moloney (free agency), Stefan Martin Ricky Petterd Cale Morton Jamie Bennell Liam Jurrah, Tom Scully (),

RICHMOND

B: Bachar Houli, Alex Rance, Will Thursfield

HB: Brett Deledio, Jayden Post, Matt Dea

C: Trent Cotchin, Dustin Martin, Shaun Grigg

HF: Daniel Jackson, Tyrone Vickery, Shane Edwards

F: Robin Nahas, Jack Riewoldt, Jake King

Foll: Angus Graham, Shane Tuck, Nathan Foley

I/C: Matthew White, Mitch Morton, Mitchell Farmer, Jeromey Webberley, Ben Nason, Jamie O'Reilly, Brad Miller

In: Matthew White, Jeromey Webberley, Ben Nason, Jamie O'Reilly

Out: Jake Batchelor (shoulder)

Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-match-preview/melbourne-v-richmond-20110818-1ize7.html#ixzz2Tn9LrRIXNo Round 13, 2012

No, that is a 2010 game. I am comparing to Round 13, 2011

http://au.sports.yahoo.com/afl/scoreboard/20110141403/2011014/14/

so thats it ,

all over no more for you, no improvement

are talking about the cs memorial wall.

i do not accept a 5 year plan if that is what you mean.

Chris Dawes was right.

I again call on the board to immediately terminate the dud of all duds, Mark Neeld.

Not having a crack just giving you an idea for a new thread GNF

I think the problem with what you're saying is that current board approved Neelds appointment and I beleive have also green lighted a full list reubild...

So if you want to get the coach sacked you'll need to get the current board fired first..... I believe if Neeld can keep his job post the Pies game (unless there are real problems/floggings etc in the second half of the season) i don't see Neeld losing his job in 2013

I also firmly believe 2013 post season will be the most important this club has had in a long time - it will decide

Coaches and FD restructure

Players who want out will go

Brining blokes in (mids and having a fit list)

Development of current list

Hogan on to the list

Board and admin changes (including FD restructure)

I reckon these things are the most imporant to get right and plans should be being made now by the Head admin

Not having a crack just giving you an idea for a new thread GNF

I think the problem with what you're saying is that current board approved Neelds appointment and I beleive have also green lighted a full list reubild...

I do not believe this statement.

Like many here I have my connections inside the club. I am certain the board was not of the view that we needed a complete re-build when Neeld took over in 2011. If you believe this you are falling for Neelds spin. In 2011 the board believed we needed to harden up and needed to be more defensive and accountable. They did not want our kids to develop without accountability and believed a tougher coach would be better in developing our young, early draft picks. I agree with this. Unfortunately the board chose the wrong coach. They did not expect this level of redundancy, no one expected our team to deliver this level of ineptness. The red flags appeared for me from the very first press conference. The problem is that until now the board has had its hands tied. Simply you can't dump a new coach without giving him an opportunity. Most of us saw what was going on and have gasped, and have chosen to look away or put our head in the sand, wanting, wishing ,willing that the board was right, that the Neeld experiment would work. That Neeld knew what he was doing and positive results would soon be seen. What we have instead is a complete, utter and absolute train wreck. Pretending it is anything else is denying blatant reality.

Let me remind you in late 2011 when we were looking for a new coach, so were 3 other teams. It was widely considered that of the four, Melbourne had the best young list and was the most advanced in any re-build. We were 4 years into a re-build, our list was full of young 1st and 2nd round draft picks and numerous top 5 picks completed with a smothering of older experienced players with finals experiance. We had won 8.5 games for the previous two seasons, with some tinkering we were set to continue our progress up the ladder.

What has happened, the performances that we have now become accustomed to, are a result of poor coaching at every level. From developing an appropriate on-field game plan that matches the strengths and weaknesses of the list, to developing confidence and self belief, to recruiting and list management. Ultimately everything on-field is the responsibility of the head coach. Neeld has failed terribly at all performance indicators. The results are there for everyone to see. This disaster is of Neelds doing. It is time for those who still have their head in the sand and have blind faith to wake up. Our club is at the cross roads. Make no mistake if we are this pathetic in 3 years time the AFL will look to merge or relocate us in time for the next broadcast deal. Neeld saying the club is 5 years away from finals may well be true, but its true because Neeld has lead us into the abyss. The game against Richmond has again highlighted to all the horror story Neeld has developed and how far backwards we have gone since he became head coach. It is now a good performance to only lose by 7 goals to a mid-tier team who only two years ago, before Neeld s appointment was considered in a very similar position and stage of development to Melbourne. Neeld has literally driven us over a cliff and if he does not go soon he will drive us to extinction.

The board is no longer in a position that they must give Neeld a go before firing him. The writing is well and truly on the wall for all to see. They must take responsibility and accountability for their poor decision. It is now time the board do what they must do and rid us of this cancer. As I have said now for over 12 months, appointing Neeld is the single biggest mistake since sacking Norm Smith.

I do not believe this statement.

Like many here I have my connections inside the club. I am certain the board was not of the view that we needed a complete re-build when Neeld took over in 2011. If you believe this you are falling for Neelds spin. In 2011 the board believed we needed to harden up and needed to be more defensive and accountable. They did not want our kids to develop without accountability and believed a tougher coach would be better in developing our young, early draft picks. I agree with this. Unfortunately the board chose the wrong coach. They did not expect this level of redundancy, no one expected our team to deliver this level of ineptness. The red flags appeared for me from the very first press conference. The problem is that until now the board has had its hands tied. Simply you can't dump a new coach without giving him an opportunity. Most of us saw what was going on and have gasped, and have chosen to look away or put your head in the sand, wanting, wishing ,willing that the board was right, that the Neeld experiment would work. That Neeld knew what he was doing and positive results would soon be seen. What we have instead is a complete, utter and absolute train wreck. Pretending it is anything else is denying blatant reality.

Let me remind you In late 2011 when we were looking for a new coach, so were 3 other teams. It was widely considered that of the three, Melbourne had the best young list and was the most advanced in any re-build. We were 4 years into a re-build, our list was full of young 1st and 2nd round draft picks and numerous top 5 picks. We had won 8.5 games for the previous two seasons, with some tinkering we were set to continue our progress up the ladder.

What has happened, the performances that we have now become accustomed to, are a result of poor coaching at every level. From developing an appropriate on-field game plan that matches the strengths and weaknesses of the list, to developing confidence and self belief, to recruiting and list management. Ultimately everything on-field is the responsibility of the head coach. Neeld has failed terribly at all performance indicators. The results are there for everyone to see. It is time for those who still have their head in the sand and have blind faith to wake up, our club is at the cross roads. Make no mistake if we are this pathetic in 3 years time the AFL will look to merge or relocate us in time for the next broadcast deal. Neeld saying the club is 5 years away from finals may well be true, but it true because Neeld has lead us into the abyss. The game against Richmond has highlighted to all the horror story Neeld has developed. He has literally driven us over a cliff and if he does not go soon he will drive us to extinction.

The board is no longer in a position that they must give Neeld a go before firing him. They must take responsibility for their poor decision. The writing is well and truly on the wall. It is now time the board do what they must do and rid us of this cancer. The single biggest mistake since sacking Norm Smith.

I know for a fact they felt at the end of 2011 with the right coach they could play finals in 2012 especially with the addition of Mitch Clark, that's how far backwards Neeld has taken us

Mere speculation on my behalf but i believe Neeld has had a long discussion with his manager and they have decided that the Rebuild of a Rebuild, 5 year plan is the best way to buy time.

Neeld never spoke like this when he started, he was hard as nails, now he is soft as a chocolate mousse.

Dawes was on the money last night. Have never seen a coach get over ruled like that before.

When Barassi - a legend of the club, premiership captain and four time premiership coach - spoke, players listened with reverence, respect and awe.

When Neeld speaks...

Tell that to Shane Zantuck

As I have said now for over 12 months, appointing Neeld is the single biggest mistake since sacking Norm Smith.

Excuse me?

So we are throwing 23 years of irrelevance on that fateful decision on Smith. And nothing unrelated to that or since then has had more repercussions than hiring Neeld?

Talk about hyperbole. Our issue isn't the one obvious decision that we screw up - it's the death by a thousand cuts that we have chosen since 65.

We stayed at the Junction too long. We didn't move into Olympic before Collingwood when we could. We allowed ourselves to be run like the other amateur clubs aligned with the MCC, we went over the salary cap and got hit with penalties that led to our cliff falling in 2007, we went into debt, we fired a CEO then the coach and kept the CEO - all in the same day, we let go of James McDonald, we have spent picks on players for little return in 2007, 8, 9, and 10.

This malaise meant that we were the last club to get decent facilities, we have an small, ageing supporter base, we have a dearth of good players 25 - 29 that we drafted, we have a number of kids that have not made it because they were never up to it, and had a administration that has been all over the place and is now being run by an AFL-assisted appointee.

Neeld doesn't get a look in as a cause of our troubles.

The players have a lack of confidence in each other and themselves, and our drafting and trading has had mixed results.

These are hardly debilitating or unrectifiable.

Neeld needs another three months of what we showed yesterday to keep his job, but don't tell me he is the reason for all our ills.

If the club could kick the backside of those that are to blame for its issues - it would have a very sore behind.

Yeah it was awesome, and you bet that guys like Dawes, Clark and Jones are not gonna sit there and takes this 5 year [censored].

I bet they want Neeld gone just like we do.

I bet they are embarrassed by where our club is at and want to do better - whoever the coach is.

Would you allow such an attitude to a coach you like?

Yeah it was awesome, and you bet that guys like Dawes, Clark and Jones are not gonna sit there and takes this 5 year [censored].

I bet they want Neeld gone just like we do.

Like YOU do, Dawes is in the leadership group, Neeld wouldn't mind him speaking up, Neeld is being cautious, do you really think he is hoping it takes 5 years, of course not, he would inwardly hoping it turns after the bye, there are really some nuff nuffs posting on here lately

I do not believe this statement.

Like many here I have my connections inside the club. I am certain the board was not of the view that we needed a complete re-build when Neeld took over in 2011. If you believe this you are falling for Neelds spin. In 2011 the board believed we needed to harden up and needed to be more defensive and accountable. They did not want our kids to develop without accountability and believed a tougher coach would be better in developing our young, early draft picks. I agree with this. Unfortunately the board chose the wrong coach. They did not expect this level of redundancy, no one expected our team to deliver this level of ineptness. The red flags appeared for me from the very first press conference. The problem is that until now the board has had its hands tied. Simply you can't dump a new coach without giving him an opportunity. Most of us saw what was going on and have gasped, and have chosen to look away or put our head in the sand, wanting, wishing ,willing that the board was right, that the Neeld experiment would work. That Neeld knew what he was doing and positive results would soon be seen. What we have instead is a complete, utter and absolute train wreck. Pretending it is anything else is denying blatant reality.

Let me remind you in late 2011 when we were looking for a new coach, so were 3 other teams. It was widely considered that of the four, Melbourne had the best young list and was the most advanced in any re-build. We were 4 years into a re-build, our list was full of young 1st and 2nd round draft picks and numerous top 5 picks completed with a smothering of older experienced players with finals experiance. We had won 8.5 games for the previous two seasons, with some tinkering we were set to continue our progress up the ladder.

What has happened, the performances that we have now become accustomed to, are a result of poor coaching at every level. From developing an appropriate on-field game plan that matches the strengths and weaknesses of the list, to developing confidence and self belief, to recruiting and list management. Ultimately everything on-field is the responsibility of the head coach. Neeld has failed terribly at all performance indicators. The results are there for everyone to see. This disaster is of Neelds doing. It is time for those who still have their head in the sand and have blind faith to wake up. Our club is at the cross roads. Make no mistake if we are this pathetic in 3 years time the AFL will look to merge or relocate us in time for the next broadcast deal. Neeld saying the club is 5 years away from finals may well be true, but its true because Neeld has lead us into the abyss. The game against Richmond has again highlighted to all the horror story Neeld has developed and how far backwards we have gone since he became head coach. It is now a good performance to only lose by 7 goals to a mid-tier team who only two years ago, before Neeld s appointment was considered in a very similar position and stage of development to Melbourne. Neeld has literally driven us over a cliff and if he does not go soon he will drive us to extinction.

The board is no longer in a position that they must give Neeld a go before firing him. The writing is well and truly on the wall for all to see. They must take responsibility and accountability for their poor decision. It is now time the board do what they must do and rid us of this cancer. As I have said now for over 12 months, appointing Neeld is the single biggest mistake since sacking Norm Smith.

Great post

Excuse me?

So we are throwing 23 years of irrelevance on that fateful decision on Smith. And nothing unrelated to that or since then has had more repercussions than hiring Neeld?

Talk about hyperbole. Our issue isn't the one obvious decision that we screw up - it's the death by a thousand cuts that we have chosen since 65.

We stayed at the Junction too long. We didn't move into Olympic before Collingwood when we could. We allowed ourselves to be run like the other amateur clubs aligned with the MCC, we went over the salary cap and got hit with penalties that led to our cliff falling in 2007, we went into debt, we fired a CEO then the coach and kept the CEO - all in the same day, we let go of James McDonald, we have spent picks on players for little return in 2007, 8, 9, and 10.

This malaise meant that we were the last club to get decent facilities, we have an small, ageing supporter base, we have a dearth of good players 25 - 29 that we drafted, we have a number of kids that have not made it because they were never up to it, and had a administration that has been all over the place and is now being run by an AFL-assisted appointee.

Neeld doesn't get a look in as a cause of our troubles.

The players have a lack of confidence in each other and themselves, and our drafting and trading has had mixed results.

These are hardly debilitating or unrectifiable.

Neeld needs another three months of what we showed yesterday to keep his job, but don't tell me he is the reason for all our ills.

If the club could kick the backside of those that are to blame for its issues - it would have a very sore behind.

I am not arguing with any of this. Except surely you too are not know comfortable that yesterday was a pass and all Neeld needs to do to hold his position is get the team to try for the next 15 weeks?!?!

I just see your post as a completely different subject.

We are stuffed, no its not all Neelds fault, yes he is along way down the list on the horrors board.

What I am saying is that the appointment of Neeld has been an unimaginable error by the board on the same level as the firing of Norm Smith. Simply both were appalling decisions that have both cost the club untold damage.

Like YOU do, Dawes is in the leadership group, Neeld wouldn't mind him speaking up, Neeld is being cautious, do you really think he is hoping it takes 5 years, of course not, he would inwardly hoping it turns after the bye, there are really some nuff nuffs posting on here lately

I thought this would be a good well thought out post.

It shows how pathetic we are as a club when the coach says "Neeld happy Dees had a crack". part of the article reads "MELBOURNE coach Mark Neeld said he could not fault the effort of his players in the 35-point loss to Richmond at the MCG".

"But key forward Chris Dawes again put the acid on his teammates by saying that losses, regardless of effort, were unacceptable".

What the......

Why is a first yr player saying what should be said but the coach well is on another planet.

AND then in another article the heading reads "THE TACKLE: The sort of endeavour shown by Melbourne yesterday might save coach Mark"

R u kidding yourself. If Neeld survives the MFC will fold.

I am proud of my boys effort when he plays but hang on he is 9yrs old and plays Auskick NOT the #1 AFL comp in the country.

Neeld has to go NOW.

Excuse me?

So we are throwing 23 years of irrelevance on that fateful decision on Smith. And nothing unrelated to that or since then has had more repercussions than hiring Neeld?

Talk about hyperbole. Our issue isn't the one obvious decision that we screw up - it's the death by a thousand cuts that we have chosen since 65.

We stayed at the Junction too long. We didn't move into Olympic before Collingwood when we could. We allowed ourselves to be run like the other amateur clubs aligned with the MCC, we went over the salary cap and got hit with penalties that led to our cliff falling in 2007, we went into debt, we fired a CEO then the coach and kept the CEO - all in the same day, we let go of James McDonald, we have spent picks on players for little return in 2007, 8, 9, and 10.

This malaise meant that we were the last club to get decent facilities, we have an small, ageing supporter base, we have a dearth of good players 25 - 29 that we drafted, we have a number of kids that have not made it because they were never up to it, and had a administration that has been all over the place and is now being run by an AFL-assisted appointee.

Neeld doesn't get a look in as a cause of our troubles.

The players have a lack of confidence in each other and themselves, and our drafting and trading has had mixed results.

These are hardly debilitating or unrectifiable.

Neeld needs another three months of what we showed yesterday to keep his job, but don't tell me he is the reason for all our ills.

If the club could kick the backside of those that are to blame for its issues - it would have a very sore behind.

you should be ashamed of yourself

these sites are the working area of good hearted people who dislike mark neeld and want him gone

this is not the place for common sense and reason, how dare you

I do not believe this statement.

Like many here I have my connections inside the club. I am certain the board was not of the view that we needed a complete re-build when Neeld took over in 2011. If you believe this you are falling for Neelds spin. In 2011 the board believed we needed to harden up and needed to be more defensive and accountable. They did not want our kids to develop without accountability and believed a tougher coach would be better in developing our young, early draft picks. I agree with this. Unfortunately the board chose the wrong coach. They did not expect this level of redundancy, no one expected our team to deliver this level of ineptness. The red flags appeared for me from the very first press conference. The problem is that until now the board has had its hands tied. Simply you can't dump a new coach without giving him an opportunity. Most of us saw what was going on and have gasped, and have chosen to look away or put our head in the sand, wanting, wishing ,willing that the board was right, that the Neeld experiment would work. That Neeld knew what he was doing and positive results would soon be seen. What we have instead is a complete, utter and absolute train wreck. Pretending it is anything else is denying blatant reality.

Let me remind you in late 2011 when we were looking for a new coach, so were 3 other teams. It was widely considered that of the four, Melbourne had the best young list and was the most advanced in any re-build. We were 4 years into a re-build, our list was full of young 1st and 2nd round draft picks and numerous top 5 picks completed with a smothering of older experienced players with finals experiance. We had won 8.5 games for the previous two seasons, with some tinkering we were set to continue our progress up the ladder.

I think you are right. We expected to see 2011 as the year we made a serious attack at the 8 and the club stalled. Who's fault it was will be argued for ever and a day but Bailey was the fall guy.

The conventional wisdom in the football community was that we only had a one way game and needed a defensive aspect added. Unfortunately our resident genius (G Lyon) decided that we needed someone from the Collingwood coaching factory and did not show enough respect to the likes of Eade or the Geelong boys.

I think we threw the baby out with the bath water. We went from all out attack to all out defence when we needed to add a defensive aspect but not at the expense of our attacking game.

Yeah it was awesome, and you bet that guys like Dawes, Clark and Jones are not gonna sit there and takes this 5 year [censored].

I bet they want Neeld gone just like we do.

It appeared very much to me like the coach knows his limitations... & is very Honest, & is prepared to be humbled.

IMO he had Dawes there as his confide`nt, spokesperson... I reckon Neeld knows he's not a media savvy Coach, & struggles in front of

the TV camera, in an aftermatch sense.

I think the players realise that & respect it...

He's here to teach & develop. He's not up there to look good...

.

I thought this would be a good well thought out post.

Your opinion of what I post is of little concern to me, my opinion of what you post would get me banned

I am not arguing with any of this. Except surely you too are not know comfortable that yesterday was a pass and all Neeld needs to do to hold his position is get the team to try for the next 15 weeks?!?!

I just see your post as a completely different subject.

We are stuffed, no its not all Neelds fault, yes he is along way down the list on the horrors board.

What I am saying is that the appointment of Neeld has been an unimaginable error by the board on the same level as the firing of Norm Smith. Simply both were appalling decisions that have both cost the club untold damage.

Neeld is the coach - for good or bad. having 4 months of caretaker means you take the fear of having a 'lame duck' coach and merely confirm it.

I am intrigued to see how this group goes in the next three months. I know they are not going to win many games but there are about 15 players playing for their careers and I would prefer they do it with a coach that is a chance to be coaching them next year.

Craig, Viney, or Rawlings as caretaker is a waste for 5 games. If we are doing it for 12 games it becomes nuclear waste.

No, I don't think that yesterday will save Neeld, but effort like that for the next 4 months will give him a chance.

He is not a cancer and he is not cause of our off-field issues (he is only subjected to them and suffering from them).

Agian, we have the bulk of the list we had before Neeld got here and ALL the good young players that are the future. Most are playing without confidence and without a midfield.

Neeld will own their lack of confidence and their effort - but I won't put our midfield at his shoes and that is why we are at where we are at.

Hello Mark Neeld here! I am still here! After 110 pages! BOO!!!!!

Neeld is the coach - for good or bad. having 4 months of caretaker means you take the fear of having a 'lame duck' coach and merely confirm it.

I am intrigued to see how this group goes in the next three months. I know they are not going to win many games but there are about 15 players playing for their careers and I would prefer they do it with a coach that is a chance to be coaching them next year.

Craig, Viney, or Rawlings as caretaker is a waste for 5 games. If we are doing it for 12 games it becomes nuclear waste.

No, I don't think that yesterday will save Neeld, but effort like that for the next 4 months will give him a chance.

He is not a cancer and he is not cause of our off-field issues (he is only subjected to them and suffering from them).

Agian, we have the bulk of the list we had before Neeld got here and ALL the good young players that are the future. Most are playing without confidence and without a midfield.

Neeld will own their lack of confidence and their effort - but I won't put our midfield at his shoes and that is why we are at where we are at.

I think you are probably on the money there 'rpfc', no point putting someone in who is not going to be the next coach anyway....but pressure will come with bad defeats, lets hope it doesn't get to that.

Hello Mark Neeld here! I am still here! After 110 pages! BOO!!!!!

gurday poker face

congrats on 110 pages of dribble thats been written about you with no evidence

btw see you when your our finals coach in 2015

Have we got a new coach yet?

Chris Dawes destroyed him in yesterday's Press Conference.

Chris Dawes went into bat for him at yesterday's Press Conference.

2,750 posts later... going to be a long winter

Neeld is the coach - for good or bad. having 4 months of caretaker means you take the fear of having a 'lame duck' coach and merely confirm it.

I am intrigued to see how this group goes in the next three months. I know they are not going to win many games but there are about 15 players playing for their careers and I would prefer they do it with a coach that is a chance to be coaching them next year.

Craig, Viney, or Rawlings as caretaker is a waste for 5 games. If we are doing it for 12 games it becomes nuclear waste.

No, I don't think that yesterday will save Neeld, but effort like that for the next 4 months will give him a chance.

He is not a cancer and he is not cause of our off-field issues (he is only subjected to them and suffering from them).

Agian, we have the bulk of the list we had before Neeld got here and ALL the good young players that are the future. Most are playing without confidence and without a midfield.

Neeld will own their lack of confidence and their effort - but I won't put our midfield at his shoes and that is why we are at where we are at.

A 6 goal loss is considered a positive because we at least showed effort, surely Craig, Viney or Rawlings couldn't do any worse?

Neeld would be at very long odds to survive mid year let alone long term.