On 14/08/2012 at 01:15, H_T said:

Paul Chapman................................................................................................just wow.

There is no way in the world Paul Chapman would contemplate leaving Geelong.

exactly! Dreaming!

  On 14/08/2012 at 01:03, The heart beats true said:

Of the 11 I'd rate them as follows:

Brent Moloney - Gone. For his own future and the clubs he needs to be somewhere else.

Liam Jurrah - Obviously depends on the case. Have some serious doubts over his body now though. Looks like it might not stand up at this level.

Jared Rivers - Offer a one year contract as a back up defender. Deserves to be treated well I think.

Ricky Petterd - Gone. Shown nothing.

Matthew Bate - Gone. TIme is up.

Lynden Dunn - I see him competing with McDonald for a spot. Lynden has more flexibility and can kick the ball long which will become valuable if we get another KPF. One year contract if we don't bring in better players.

Joel Macdonald - Read above. Love his effort but his skills are poor and he's just stopping a younger player from developing.

Jamie Bennell - Gone. I think Nev Jetta showed enough on the weekend to seal Jamie's fate, especially with his injury.

Clint Bartram - Love Barty but his body has given up. Gone

James Sellar - Kills me to say it but I think Neeld likes him. If we get a big FA/experienced player from somewhere else he has to go.

Troy Davis - Gone.

Thats 8 gone with Green's retirement. Bring in 3 jnr midfielders (Viney, Caddy, plus one), 1 gun midfielder (Boak) a couple of project players and a KPF (love to get TIppett) and we look a lot better.

i think thats about 90% on the money. Dunn does seem to have some favour, but so does Joel...as to rest, thats pretty much how I see it, here or there,give or take.

So much will depend on who surfaces in the silly season.

What i do liek is we arent being conned into early signings of contracts. Weve been gouged and bitten big time in the past because of being panicked into signings. Neeld plays a good game of poker I think.

Those who might also think all things will be fic=xed this EOS need to take a deep breath. It will take at least one more year but its will be a healthy start !!

  On 14/08/2012 at 01:03, The heart beats true said:

Of the 11 I'd rate them as follows:

Brent Moloney - Gone. For his own future and the clubs he needs to be somewhere else.

Liam Jurrah - Obviously depends on the case. Have some serious doubts over his body now though. Looks like it might not stand up at this level.

Jared Rivers - Offer a one year contract as a back up defender. Deserves to be treated well I think.

Ricky Petterd - Gone. Shown nothing.

Matthew Bate - Gone. TIme is up.

Lynden Dunn - I see him competing with McDonald for a spot. Lynden has more flexibility and can kick the ball long which will become valuable if we get another KPF. One year contract if we don't bring in better players.

Joel Macdonald - Read above. Love his effort but his skills are poor and he's just stopping a younger player from developing.

Jamie Bennell - Gone. I think Nev Jetta showed enough on the weekend to seal Jamie's fate, especially with his injury.

Clint Bartram - Love Barty but his body has given up. Gone

James Sellar - Kills me to say it but I think Neeld likes him. If we get a big FA/experienced player from somewhere else he has to go.

Troy Davis - Gone.

Thats 8 gone with Green's retirement. Bring in 3 jnr midfielders (Viney, Caddy, plus one), 1 gun midfielder (Boak) a couple of project players and a KPF (love to get TIppett) and we look a lot better.

Nice effort. FWIW, Moloney is an UFA at season's end. I reckon if he gets a 2 year contract elsewhere then he is out of MFC.

I am not sure offering RIvers a 1yr contract is treating him well. On that basis as an UFA and given the way other elder statesman have been treated, I think he could go to.

Jurrah is an interesting one. If was from the mainstream football background in MEL, I reckon you would cut him. Cultural issues aside his off field antics have really hurt the Club when it is down. But given his position, I reckon they will wait for last moment to offer him a contract conditional on legal proceedings. And he would want to be on a straight line off field going forward.

I think all the others you mentioned are gone but I could see us keeping either Dunn/MacD on low $ for a year. I doubt any other Club will take them.

The only thing that I think saves the remainder of the group is if they shift unwanted senior players to the rookie list. IMO Davey is finished in AFL but is contracted next year. Too light, lost pace, no mojo and bad attitude. Mifsud did not help him either earlier in the year. He does not strike me as what Neeld wants. The other is Morton. I hope he has an epiphany over the pre season but I cant see him doing more than playing capably at Casey and only getting a call up at MFC if there are lots of injuries. Only thing in his favour is hi huge tank and an ability to spread and give options. His downsides are well documented.

Given the list you have, i reckon Jetta survives for a further 2 years at modest $. I am not sure he will cut it consistently at AFl. He seems to have some of the attributes Neeld wants.

Rivers would probably get 2 years elsewhere and he and Jamar are the only ones eligible for the VL.

I would give him a couple of years.

  On 15/08/2012 at 00:00, rpfc said:

Rivers would probably get 2 years elsewhere and he and Jamar are the only ones eligible for the VL.

I would give him a couple of years.

I agree, especially if he goes on the VL. We are not burdened with experience and he is also a good clubman and leader. I didn't think his form was too bad either.

Mark my words, Jetta has the capabilities to be an AFL premiership player. We would be foolish to de-list him. Watch how quickly another team jumps on him if we do.

  On 15/08/2012 at 02:26, olisik said:

Mark my words, Jetta has the capabilities to be an AFL premiership player.

What does that mean?

Steven Armstrong was a premiership player.

Shannon Motlop was a premiership player

Teams win premierships, some are lucky to be in the right spot at the right time.

I have been resisting doing a de list summery until the year is over however it is over for the dees I think the FD knows well and truely the quality of our list.

I would suspect they have already marked the cards however here is my list for deletion for waht little it is worth.

Green - retired

Bate - been around for 7 seasons not good enough

Bennell - hopeless

Petterd - played a dozen good games in 6 years

Moloney - poor year and 29 coming up, not going to get better. will probably leave us any way.

Jetta - lots of injuries but I doubt he is AFL standard

Davis- no games in 2 years when we are crap suggests he is not good enough

Then there is Bartram how do you work him out? good player but knee situation means no idea till 2013

Davey and Morton are lucky they have contracts and they probably have little trade value so they stay.

Gysberts and Cook get 1 year contracts to prove they are worth more in 2013, if they don't like that then trade them may not get much.

I think 7 - 8 changes are likely

The trick is to get 7 better players

PS I forgot jurrah I think he is a bust find it difficult to see him surviving the "family Issues" these are and will continue to be more improtant than playing AFL.

So that makes 8 - 9 changes

Gee RR I am not far off your 10 changes

  On 20/08/2012 at 01:44, old dee said:

I have been resisting doing a de list summery until the year is over however it is over for the dees I think the FD knows well and truely the quality of our list.

I would suspect they have already marked the cards however here is my list for deletion for waht little it is worth.

Green - retired

Bate - been around for 7 seasons not good enough

Bennell - hopeless

Petterd - played a dozen good games in 6 years

Moloney - poor year and 29 coming up, not going to get better. will probably leave us any way.

Jetta - lots of injuries but I doubt he is AFL standard

Davis- no games in 2 years when we are crap suggests he is not good enough

Then there is Bartram how do you work him out? good player but knee situation means no idea till 2013

Davey and Morton are lucky they have contracts and they probably have little trade value so they stay.

Gysberts and Cook get 1 year contracts to prove they are worth more in 2013, if they don't like that then trade them may not get much.

I think 7 - 8 changes are likely

The trick is to get 7 better players

PS I forgot jurrah I think he is a bust find it difficult to see him surviving the "family Issues" these are and will continue to be more improtant than playing AFL.

So that makes 8 - 9 changes

Gee RR I am not far off your 10 changes

That is indeed the trick. It's very easy to delist players. It isn't very easy to recruit better ones. As we all know too well from the past 10yrs.

  On 20/08/2012 at 01:44, old dee said:

I have been resisting doing a de list summery until the year is over however it is over for the dees I think the FD knows well and truely the quality of our list.

I would suspect they have already marked the cards however here is my list for deletion for waht little it is worth.

Green - retired

Bate - been around for 7 seasons not good enough

Bennell - hopeless

Petterd - played a dozen good games in 6 years

Moloney - poor year and 29 coming up, not going to get better. will probably leave us any way.

Jetta - lots of injuries but I doubt he is AFL standard

Davis- no games in 2 years when we are crap suggests he is not good enough

Then there is Bartram how do you work him out? good player but knee situation means no idea till 2013

Davey and Morton are lucky they have contracts and they probably have little trade value so they stay.

Gysberts and Cook get 1 year contracts to prove they are worth more in 2013, if they don't like that then trade them may not get much.

I think 7 - 8 changes are likely

The trick is to get 7 better players

PS I forgot jurrah I think he is a bust find it difficult to see him surviving the "family Issues" these are and will continue to be more improtant than playing AFL.

So that makes 8 - 9 changes

Gee RR I am not far off your 10 changes

You're there already as Rivers and Jamar will go onto the Vets List.

  On 20/08/2012 at 01:44, old dee said:

I have been resisting doing a de list summery until the year is over however it is over for the dees I think the FD knows well and truely the quality of our list.

I would suspect they have already marked the cards however here is my list for deletion for waht little it is worth.

Green - retired

Bate - been around for 7 seasons not good enough

Bennell - hopeless

Petterd - played a dozen good games in 6 years

Moloney - poor year and 29 coming up, not going to get better. will probably leave us any way.

Jetta - lots of injuries but I doubt he is AFL standard

Davis- no games in 2 years when we are crap suggests he is not good enough

Then there is Bartram how do you work him out? good player but knee situation means no idea till 2013

Davey and Morton are lucky they have contracts and they probably have little trade value so they stay.

Gysberts and Cook get 1 year contracts to prove they are worth more in 2013, if they don't like that then trade them may not get much.

I think 7 - 8 changes are likely

The trick is to get 7 better players

PS I forgot jurrah I think he is a bust find it difficult to see him surviving the "family Issues" these are and will continue to be more improtant than playing AFL.

So that makes 8 - 9 changes

Gee RR I am not far off your 10 changes

Good work old dee. Well done. I come up with 8 to 10 depending on what you do with Davey and Morton (re the rookie list) as both are contracted in 2013.

  On 20/08/2012 at 01:59, It said:

That is indeed the trick. It's very easy to delist players. It isn't very easy to recruit better ones. As we all know too well from the past 10yrs.

There's no trick to it. We just have to find better players. No matter how hard it is or we make it, there is no sensible reason to keep NQR players.

  On 20/08/2012 at 01:44, old dee said:

Davis- no games in 2 years when we are crap suggests he is not good enough

He came to the club already behind Frawley, Rivers and Garland for the spot down back, and now finds himself behind McDonald and Watts too.

If Rivers goes elsewhere in free agency and they persist with Garland forward/move Watts forward/Frawley gets injured, we'll be lacking in KPD depth. From Casey reports, Davis has been playing pretty well (has been emergency quite a few times) - late last year it was pretty much a coin toss as to whether he or McDonald got given a game first. Unfortunately for Davis, it was McDonald. IMO I would like to see the crap that has had 4+ years shown the door before a player drafted in 2010.

Isn't Beamer RFA?

The Chappy thoughts....wow. Going to admit I doubt it.

As for FA targets, the one I want is Clinton Young. Would be a straight replacement for Moloney, shove Viney and McKenzie in the guts and have them feed to Young and Boak, would be good.

More realistic than Chappy too - Young can't get in the side half the time, he's behind Lewis, Mitchell, Hodge, Whitecross, Suckling and even Savage at times. Not to say he's a bad midfielder at all - he was fantastic yesterday - but he's not a first choice if all are available.

Out:

Green - Retired

Spencer - dont be fooled by some hardworking efforts he's not going to make it, Rookie list for depth if you want

Bate - too slow

Bennell - not hard enough

Petterd - too slow, too inconsistent, unable to make it in the midfield

Bartram - injured, no point keeping

Macdonald - I like him but he isn't up to it, keep for experience if Moloney wont accept a one year deal or if by some miracle we can trade Morton

One year deals: Dunn, Moloney, Gysberts, Cook, Davis, Jetta, Jurrah

Rookie promotion - Nicholson

Retain rookies - Magner, Evans, Sheahan, Williams

Rookie delistings - Couch, Lawrence

Veterans list - ? Jamar ? Davey

Draft picks - 3,4, mid 1st round, 2nd round, 3rd round, 4th round, 5th round

Rookie draft picks - 1st round, 2nd round

  On 20/08/2012 at 05:31, the master said:

One year deals: Dunn, Moloney, Gysberts, Cook, Davis, Jetta, Jurrah

Fair outs.

I doubt whether Moloney will stay. I cant see him taking a one year deal as an UFA.

Gysberts will walk for 2 years elsewhere.

Jurrah should at best be rookied. I have no certainty he will be back in AFL.

I agree that only one of Magner/Couch gets re rookie.

Do you have some obligation to upgrade Evans because he agreed to stay a rookie in 2012? Two years at low $$$.

  On 20/08/2012 at 05:36, Rhino Richards said:

Fair outs.

I doubt whether Moloney will stay. I cant see him taking a one year deal as an UFA.

Gysberts will walk for 2 years elsewhere.

Jurrah should at best be rookied. I have no certainty he will be back in AFL.

I agree that only one of Magner/Couch gets re rookie.

Do you have some obligation to upgrade Evans because he agreed to stay a rookie in 2012? Two years at low $$$.

12 pages already showing how subjective this stuff is for us on the outside. For my money its a keep for Gysberts - reasons - young has shown ability, has spent a fair period injured and may fit Neelds 'learn you craft' a la Collingwood requirement. Ditto for Davis, although whilst hasnt shown ability at AFL level yet but he has been consistent at Casey often having major assignments.His first year was a write off. Blease simply a must retain. Line breaker, goal kicker, beginning to really show the goods.

this is not a good sign

  On 20/08/2012 at 03:41, Rhino Richards said:

what you do with Davey and Morton (re the rookie list) as both are contracted in 2013.

Complicates things.

Out

Green retired

Joel Macdonald hard, tough, tries hard. not good enough.

Bennell some good attributes but NQR basket

Dunn. LC.

Bate. Like him but times up.

Moloney. Papers looked to be stamped.

Petterd. Papers stamped.

Sellar. Tom Mac has got his spot. Troy Davis gets another year.

Sylvia - Trade

Martin - Trade

A few others like Spencer, Jetta are 50/50.

Bartram/Jurrah Unfortunately a wait and see.

Our kids aren't kids any more.

Next year

Jones 25, Bail 25, Frawley 25, Garland 25, Fitzpatrick 22, Blease 22, Watts 22, Gysbert 22, Trengove 22, Tapscott 22, Grimes 23, Strauss 23, Jetta 23, Howe 23, McKenzie 23, Morton 24.

You can't hide behind being young forever. Time to step up or get out.

I'd rookie Jurrah but I'd want to be certain that someone else wont grab him in the mean time. At the end of the day we've invested a lot in him and if there is any chance he'll make it we may as well keep him as his talent is undoubted.

I'd offer Gysberts 2 years if he rocks up in October having put on 5kg and improved his running. If he hasn't I wouldn't be interested in more than 1.

  On 20/08/2012 at 08:26, jacey said:

Complicates things.

Why? If we cant get a trade for either and I doubt we will, then at least Davey should be rookied as I cant see him playing for MFC again unless we get injuries.

They still get their 2013 salary but it frees up a spot or two on the list.

If you trade Martin, you keep Spencer. Gawn is injured, Jamar is fragile and FItz is not there

  On 20/08/2012 at 08:32, the master said:

I'd rookie Jurrah but I'd want to be certain that someone else wont grab him in the mean time. At the end of the day we've invested a lot in him and if there is any chance he'll make it we may as well keep him as his talent is undoubted.

I'd offer Gysberts 2 years if he rocks up in October having put on 5kg and improved his running. If he hasn't I wouldn't be interested in more than 1.

GIven what Jurrah is going through I doubt any club will look at him. Far too much baggage with uncertain returns.

Gysberts would put on 5kgs (of muscle) by October. You may as well sack him now.

  On 20/08/2012 at 01:59, It said:

That is indeed the trick. It's very easy to delist players. It isn't very easy to recruit better ones. As we all know too well from the past 10yrs.

Normally yes, but when your so far behind the standard you'd have to assume you couldnt really go wrong.

Gysberts is going no where. has some improvement to do but he has too much untried potential.

The mail doesnt seem good for Jurrah and from what I read on bigfooty Moloney has already told people he is leaving... Time will tell.