The Compensation

[Striker475 696]

Not sure if anyone’s pointed this out yet, but the compensation pick to be taken after the club’s first pick is potential deal breaker. It may not mean as much to a team that finishes high or mid table, but if you’re a team in the bottom 4 it could be absolute gold in a strong draft.

Have we been underestimating how valuable this pick could be on the trade table? Surely GWS aren’t expecting to finish above the bottom two spots on the table next year. If they finish last, our pick could guarantee them the first two picks in 2012, meaning we potentially beat out GC’s offer of pick 4 in this year’s draft. I hate to think that we could be party to giving them such a leg up, but it’s a massive opportunity to secure a top 5 rated player, which (short of a absolutely horrible season next year) we wouldn’t otherwise have access to.

Doesn't work like that - it remains linked to the original club's finishing position i.e. even if GWS had the pick, it would be the pick after Melbourne's first-round pick

[Dee Fan 3,247]

Gee Robbief you are being very negative.

Of course we need another skinny Forward who will take 4 -5 years to develop?

Good grief man keep things in perspective.

You're right of course I must stop this negativity we need all the tall skinny kids we can get it will give us another excuse for a poor year in 2012. It will also give RPFC a new category for is measurement of success and reasons why we are behind other clubs all be it temporarily. We shall call this one the Skinometer and we can work out how many Skinng kids we have compered to other clubs and where we fit in the Skinometer scale. I'm sure he will be able to work out how many quarters we have our Skinny kids out there compared to other clubs Skinny kids and what scale we reach each game on the Skinometer and where we were at the same time last year.

A whole new World awaits.

[ChaserJ 4,712]

Doesn't work like that - it remains linked to the original club's finishing position i.e. even if GWS had the pick, it would be the pick after Melbourne's first-round pick

What if we trade the pick this year and they use it 2014? Does the picks value depreciate if we finish 5th that year?

[Sir Why You Little 36,668]

You're right of course I must stop this negativity we need all the tall skinny kids we can get it will give us another excuse for a poor year in 2012. It will also give RPFC a new category for is measurement of success and reasons why we are behind other clubs all be it temporarily. We shall call this one the Skinometer and we can work out how many Skinng kids we have compered to other clubs and where we fit in the Skinometer scale. I'm sure he will be able to work out how many quarters we have our Skinny kids out there compared to other clubs Skinny kids and what scale we reach each game on the Skinometer and where we were at the same time last year.

A whole new World awaits.

Pay that one RF HaHaHa!!! rpfc and skinometer GOLD!!!

[old dee 23,503]

Pay that one RF HaHaHa!!! rpfc and skinometer GOLD!!!

A little humour is needed this week I think WYL.

We all seem to be at each others throats this week.

Cheer up guys it is only a game ha ha !

[s-t-i-n-g-a 439]

I understand compo pick are not included in F/S bidding...

If we did have a bad year next year...and finished in the bottom 5 or so...low enough that another club did not want to bid for Viney with their pick...we could potentially have say pick 5, 6 (compo after our 1st pick), 9 (mid first round compo) and use our second round on Viney. Wowee...

Not that I want this to happen...I want a winning culture and to see us play finals...but was an interesting thought I had...

[daisycutter 29,341]

What if we trade the pick this year and they use it 2014? Does the picks value depreciate if we finish 5th that year?

It is determined by MFCs ladder place in the year it is activated (by whoever)

[Dockett 32 1,237]

I understand compo pick are not included in F/S bidding...

If we did have a bad year next year...and finished in the bottom 5 or so...low enough that another club did not want to bid for Viney with their pick...we could potentially have say pick 5, 6 (compo after our 1st pick), 9 (mid first round compo) and use our second round on Viney. Wowee...

Not that I want this to happen...I want a winning culture and to see us play finals...but was an interesting thought I had...

Not a bad hedge though. Either we improve, which we hope and that would be good, or we don't and are very well rewarded for it.

[Striker475 696]

What if we trade the pick this year and they use it 2014? Does the picks value depreciate if we finish 5th that year?

Yup. Would still be the pick after MFC's pick.

[Macca 16,643]

Seeing as this thread has got onto drafting does anyone have a idea on how many players we need to move on?

My understanding is that we must take three players in the draft as a mininium.

So we now have one spot available.

Who else gets moved on?

Any player who isn't contracted yet is probably in danger - I don't know who they all are but no doubt somebody on this site will know - These players will probably come under the catagory of he's "Alright" or he's "O.k" . I reckon at least 5 will be delisted all things considered .

[Curry & Beer 5,444]

well geez I feel a little bit better afer reading this from the HUn

"Melbourne's two first-round selections consist of a pick halfway through the opening round of draft, and a pick after its own selection in the year they activate the pick.

So if the Demons used them next year and finished ninth, they would use the mid-round pick at selection 10, then get their normal pick at 11, then use their second compensation pick at 12.

It is major victory for Melbourne, which now has strong options to replace Scully."

and then this:

LEADING sports medico Dr Peter Larkins has warned Greater Western Sydney's $6 million investment in Tom Scully is an "enormous gamble".

Larkins is adamant Scully's knee issue will significantly affect his chances of playing a full season in any of the next six years.

"I'd be really surprised if he was able to put out 20 games a season for six seasons in a row for that club," Larkins said. "I can't see 120 games over six years, based on the fact he played 10 out of 22 this year."

"It's turned out the original injury, which has resulted in some bone being removed from his kneecap, has changed the shape of his knee," Larkins said.

"He now has an issue ... as he gets stronger and bigger he can only put more stress on the knee.

"As you get older, knee injuries only get worse ... they don't get better."

"We're not talking about a bloke who's had a medial ligament in a knee or an AC joint in the shoulder ... we're talking about a cartilage-related, stress loading problem."

[Sir Why You Little 36,668]

well geez I feel a little bit better afer reading this from the HU

LEADING sports medico Dr Peter Larkins has warned Greater Western Sydney's $6 million investment in Tom Scully is an "enormous gamble".

Larkins is adamant Scully's knee issue will significantly affect his chances of playing a full season in any of the next six years.

"I'd be really surprised if he was able to put out 20 games a season for six seasons in a row for that club," Larkins said. "I can't see 120 games over six years, based on the fact he played 10 out of 22 this year."

"It's turned out the original injury, which has resulted in some bone being removed from his kneecap, has changed the shape of his knee," Larkins said.

"He now has an issue ... as he gets stronger and bigger he can only put more stress on the knee.

"As you get older, knee injuries only get worse ... they don't get better."

"We're not talking about a bloke who's had a medial ligament in a knee or an AC joint in the shoulder ... we're talking about a cartilage-related, stress loading problem."

I don't blame Tom at all...He knows it, I despise the AFL.

The MFC was very lucky

[Macca 16,643]

We had 6 picks in the National draft in 2010 . 7 in 2009 , 7 in 2008 , 6 in 2007 and 4 in 2006 - got these from wiki so not sure how accurate - We have traded picks over the years as well . Obviously circumstances change depending on the quality of lists but we underachieved this year and you'd have to have a big question mark over some players who couldn't get a regular game - esp at the end of the year .

As well as delisting a few , we should be trade for a few inside players and 1 or 2 big blokes who can take a grab up forward - A BIG ask I know but you've gotta have a go - and there's always 1 or 2 shock delistings - esp at our club !

[Tatu 416]

1 compo pick + Green + Spencer for O'Meara

[trout 385]

One thing that strikes me odd about the AFL's compensation announcement (aside from the timing being the day after Scully leaves, giving more credence to the stage-management aspect of the whole saga) is the fact that, as Kevin Sheedy has alluded to, there are still more GWS signings likely to take place in the coming weeks.

Their press release last night stated "...there was a significant differential in the contract offer to Scully, to those of Ward and Davis, and it was therefore determined that the compensation package for Melbourne should be in the highest band", which says to me that the MFC's level of compensation (as well as the Dogs, Freo and Crows) have been judged against one another's circumstances.

Hypothetically, what would happen if next week GWS announce they have landed say someone like a Dale Thomas (just an example, I know he's already signed)? The point I'm making is that surely the AFL would have been better off waiting until all signings have been announced before announcing the compensation for each affected club.

How funny is it that the AFL come out the day after Tom signs up with compo for all four players they have signed. Why had they not done that as each player was signed by GWS. Certainly makes the whole thing look very stage managed by the AFL / GWS.

[Macca 16,643]

How funny is it that the AFL come out the day after Tom signs up with compo for all four players they have signed. Why had they not done that as each player was signed by GWS. Certainly makes the whole thing look very stage managed by the AFL / GWS.

Really good point there trout - rather quick wasn't it - of course the AFL is a Fascist regime so even if we could prove they were complicit ..........

[Jesse Christ 2,884]

Its called a totalitarian regime. That is why the youtube clip portraying the fat Greek as Hitler is so apt.

[Curry & Beer 5,444]

How funny is it that the AFL come out the day after Tom signs up with compo for all four players they have signed. Why had they not done that as each player was signed by GWS. Certainly makes the whole thing look very stage managed by the AFL / GWS.

also the fact we were paid over the odds was clear to me that the AFL knows they shafted us, and are making up for it..partially... even if nobody really expected it to turn out that way when the rules were made

i'll take a couple of picks around 10 for our underwhelming, injury-prone number 1

[Jordie_tackles 354]

Agree with Robbie F and Others, We are lacking Quality mids, of the Ablett, Bartel and Kelly mould, simply we just dont have enough developing imo,

Moloney Jones and Jordie are so one dimensional and dont hurt the opposition as much as the real A graders do, i dont see how these 3 can all fit into a premiership model team at the one time

So we have Gysberts and Trengove and maybe Blease, then 2 of the 3 above and Bail as a tagger so 6 decent mids

[Dee Fan 3,247]

Well here it is from the AFL Website.

Melbourne - Round One selection (Tom Scully)

The selection for Tom Scully may be activated by Melbourne after its round one selection in any one of the 2012, 2013, 2014, 2015 NAB AFL Draft Selection Meetings. The selection will be immediately placed behind the Round One selection of Melbourne in that particular season. (I.e, should Melbourne earn the right for selection 12, the compensation selection would be number 13, if Melbourne earn the right for selection four, the compensation selection would be number five etc.).

Should Melbourne wish to activate the selection in the 2011 NAB AFL Draft, during the expansion-period Drafts, the selection would be placed at the end of Round One.

For the selection to be activated for the 2011 NAB AFL Draft, Melbourne will be required to notify the AFL of its intention to use the selection by Friday November 11, 2011.

For the selection to be activated for any of the years 2012-2015 in the NAB AFL Draft of that particular year, Melbourne will be required to notify the AFL of its intention to use the selection by the last Tuesday of that particular year, prior to the start of the Toyota AFL Premiership Season.

The club has the right to on-trade its compensation selection to another club.

If the club on-trades its compensation selection to another club, the selection may be used in that year's NAB AFL Draft Selection meeting, or in any other year up to the 2015 NAB AFL Draft.

Melbourne - Mid-Round One selection (Tom Scully)

The selection for Tom Scully may be activated by Melbourne at the middle of round one, after the round one selections for those clubs that have missed qualification for the finals in that year and before the round one selections of those clubs that have qualified for the finals in that year, in any one of the 2012, 2013, 2014 or 2015 NAB AFL Draft Selection Meetings.

Should Melbourne wish to activate the selection in the 2011 NAB AFL Draft, during the expansion-period Drafts, the selection would be placed at the end of Round One.

For the selection to be activated for the 2011 NAB AFL Draft, Melbourne will be required to notify the AFL of its intention to use the selection by Friday November 11, 2011.

For the selection to be activated for any of the years 2012-2015 in the NAB AFL Draft of that particular year, Melbourne will be required to notify the AFL of its intention to use the selection by the last Tuesday of that particular year, prior to the start of the Toyota AFL Premiership Season.

The club has the right to on-trade its compensation selection to another club.

If the club on-trades its compensation selection to another club, the selection may be used in that year's NAB AFL Draft Selection meeting, or in any other year up to the 2015 NAB AFL Draft.

The lodgement of the contract offer to Scully by the GWS Giants FC means the club cannot automatically select another uncontracted player from Melbourne.

Interestingly our mid round pick could come before our first round pick if we finish in the finals.

Finish 8th our first pick would be (forgetting all other priority picks etc) 11 and our Round one compensation pick would be the next pick 12.

If that were so our second pick the mid round pick would come after all the sides that missed the 8 had had a selection (which would be 10) our compensation pick would be 11 which would mean that our draft pick would go to 12 and our first round compensation pick would then be 13 so we would get the following

Mid Round Selection 11, First draft pick 12 and first round compensation pick 13 = 11 - 12 - 13

Edited September 14, 2011 by RobbieF

[Guest fitness]

How funny is it that the AFL come out the day after Tom signs up with compo for all four players they have signed. Why had they not done that as each player was signed by GWS. Certainly makes the whole thing look very stage managed by the AFL / GWS.

It also makes me wonder whether or not the MFC have been complicit in it. How's this for a conspiracy theory... What if, as many suggest, Scully decided a long time ago, and the AFL, GWS, the MFC all knew this? But what if Scully, being the decent young kid that he is, ensured that the MFC would not get totally shafted by his departure, and thus orchestrated his GWS contract to be front-loaded sufficiently enough for the AFL to then deem his value so far superior to Ward, Davis etc, and therefore providing the justification for the AFL allowing maximum compensation to the MFC.

If so, well done to the club for making the most of an unfortunate situation.

Edited September 15, 2011 by fitness

[Gooner 9]

For all the talk that $cully is a liability because of his knee, I think that's just Melbourne supporters trying to cope with the loss. Yes, he did miss a lot of games with his knee this year, but we don't know how many of those games missed were due to his knee and if others were missed because he wasn't right in the head to be on the park.

The fact is that $cully is an amazing talent. He may turn out to be the best player in the league, or he may turn out just to be a good player, but Melbourne have lost a lot.

The problem with our compensation is that he are a team (hopefully?) on the up, and as a result, if we make finals or go close to finals for the next four years, we won't receive adequate value for $cully.

At the very least it'll be a small compensation knowing that if we have a poor season next year, then the picks that we get will be better than if we had a good season.

Unfortunately, we're in a position that we need to use the picks quicker than other clubs who are starting their rebuilding, like the Dogs, or who are in the middle of rebuilding, like the Crows as we've almost finished our rebuilding and will spend the next few years consolidating and trading for better players.

[mdemonski2 403]

For all the talk that $cully is a liability because of his knee, I think that's just Melbourne supporters trying to cope with the loss. Yes, he did miss a lot of games with his knee this year, but we don't know how many of those games missed were due to his knee and if others were missed because he wasn't right in the head to be on the park.

The fact is that $cully is an amazing talent. He may turn out to be the best player in the league, or he may turn out just to be a good player, but Melbourne have lost a lot.

The problem with our compensation is that he are a team (hopefully?) on the up, and as a result, if we make finals or go close to finals for the next four years, we won't receive adequate value for $cully.

At the very least it'll be a small compensation knowing that if we have a poor season next year, then the picks that we get will be better than if we had a good season.

Unfortunately, we're in a position that we need to use the picks quicker than other clubs who are starting their rebuilding, like the Dogs, or who are in the middle of rebuilding, like the Crows as we've almost finished our rebuilding and will spend the next few years consolidating and trading for better players.

The timing as to when we use our compo picks could be really interesting for the reason you outline above. I would think that we will use our compo pick post our first round pick definitely next year (or even this year as part of a 17 y o trade)as it will most likely be most valuable in 2012 when we arr still working our way up the ladder. The other pick does not matter where we finish as it is post non finalist first round picks.

I wonder whether we might keep this second pick up our sleeve and use it a few years down the track to trade for a top ready made player when the real gaps in our list become apparant and we start to push towarfs the higher echelons of the ladder. It could be really valuable at this stage to a club just embarking on a re-build.

What u reckon?

[cooko 124]

1 compo pick + Green + Spencer for O'Meara

yeah lets unload our current captain because that will help our club culture.. especially all of the crap we have taken for losing JMac, Bruce, Miller, etc and giving no loyalty to our long serving players..

it amazes me when people are so content to trade out players like green or davey because they have had 1 bad year..

[Gooner 9]

The timing as to when we use our compo picks could be really interesting for the reason you outline above. I would think that we will use our compo pick post our first round pick definitely next year (or even this year as part of a 17 y o trade)as it will most likely be most valuable in 2012 when we arr still working our way up the ladder. The other pick does not matter where we finish as it is post non finalist first round picks.

I wonder whether we might keep this second pick up our sleeve and use it a few years down the track to trade for a top ready made player when the real gaps in our list become apparant and we start to push towarfs the higher echelons of the ladder. It could be really valuable at this stage to a club just embarking on a re-build.

What u reckon?

I think that's a good strategy. In fact, holding off with the pick 11 may be the better option. There are likely to be a few clubs that want to use their priority pick next year, which may dilute our mid draft pick. However, on the other hand if we're building a list, it'd be nice to have the pick available to use on a player who we could develop for a few years before we reach finals.

Using the priority pick on a 17 year old is a little risky, as we're drafting a player a year out from when their draft position could be more accurately determined. Consider Luke Shuey and John Butcher were considered to be much higher picks that when they were picked when they were 17.