Giving you plenty of warning to find some!

I think Collingwood will humiliate us QB game, may even be twice this year by them.

I'm going to wash my mouth out now.

No you are safe we only play them once however we have to front up to the Hawks again!

Giving you plenty of warning to find some!

I think Collingwood will humiliate us QB game, may even be twice this year by them.

I'm going to wash my mouth out now.

We usually play our best footy against them as tradition dictates. This time they may humiliate us by 2 points.

We usually play our best footy against them as tradition dictates. This time they may humiliate us by 2 points.

Ok, last year we had a draw and lost by 1 point.

In 2009 we lost by 53 points and 66 points.

I agree with these comments, spot on i reckon. Bailey's lack of a tactical response to the opposition having the momentum has been a theme in his tenure thus far, as has having no so called plan b, or simply an effective secondary model that works against sides that bottle it up well when our standard spread and run approach isn't working.

On Sunday the older players didn't step up in the 3rd quarter but Bailey has to take some responsibility as well. Where were his moves to counter their run on (eg as one poster noted what about Dunn into the centre to get some hardness there), where was his tactical response? Team development is all well and good but tactical nouse in this day and age is crucial.

I thought it was really intersting that Davey called for a slow down at 23rd min mark of the second, which may or amy not have been the right thing to do, but did not do so (& nor did any other senior player) in the 3rd when the game was being ripped away from us. Surely that was the time to stop the momentum, hold the ball, chip it around, rebalance. Green acknowledged exactly this point in his press conference on Monday. Now here's my point about this - Bailey was down on the ground during the 3rd so could communicate directly with the players. Why didn't he direct a player to go out and slow things up? Why didn't he take charge tacticaly. He's the senior coach after all and the buck stops with him

Also tacticaly it was a huge risk having Maric as the sub as he can only play up forward, when we needed some mid field grunt and run in the last q not a goal sneak. He should have statred on the ground with Jetta sub as at least Jetta can play in a variety of spots and generally tackles well (though not on Sunday)

Saw the same thing last year against Carlton in the first quater. We fold like cards when the going gets tough - only because we have no defensive plan.

President Jim Stynes said what needed to be said.

We must improve...God Help any player that doesn't give 100% over the next 2 weeks (and Beyond)

These Bottom Teams must be smashed.

Occasionally I wish we would get on here and, rather than eat Bailey alive, chow down on Green, Moloney, Jones, Rivers, Sylvia, Jamar, and Davey and their 'leadership skills.'

20 scoring shots in a qtr isn't a badly coached team - it's a team that is lazy and isn't led well on he field.

Mate I suggest he changes tack because he is loosing the masses who hold the membership tickets.

And down the track that has an effect like it or not.

What you are seeing from Sheahan is a view held by quite a lot of Mebourne members that I know.

Understand your frustrations but how will a more "emotional" response to a loss change the result?

I assure you that the team and the coaching staff are all hurting this week as are us supporters.

Ranting and raving after a loss is not a positive character trait. A significant amount of heat has been placed on Bailey by the media during his career and he has not flinched, rest assured more will come.

The most important thing is how we respond this week. In rd 1 last year we were absolutely hammered by the Hawks and we came out and drew with the pies.

I dont give a toss about the lack of emotion Bailey displays in post match press conferences, I care how the team responds.

Occasionally I wish we would get on here and, rather than eat Bailey alive, chow down on Green, Moloney, Jones, Rivers, Sylvia, Jamar, and Davey and their 'leadership skills.'

20 scoring shots in a qtr isn't a badly coached team - it's a team that is lazy and isn't led well on he field.

bang on fella

A post match press conference is not the place for that to happen. Stynes did very well passing appropriate comments to reflect the internal and external frustrarion and disappointment of the performance. Stynes and McLardy may well have spoken to the group/individuals about how appalling and unacceptable performance was. And good on them if they have.

If the players have not grasp the necessary requirements without contrived statements at a media circus after the game then they never will and should be moved on.

So it is the right thing that Stynes has had to come out & manage the media? I know who should be answering questions on performance & it isn't Jim Stynes. Stynes has very little to do with the FD.

Maybe he's taking more than a casual interest in us.

He also thinks that the tried and failed Brad Miller is a player we are missing at Centre Half Forward. For mine we don't need a Centre Half Forward who can't mark or kick no matter how many times he presents.

They asked his opinion on the game and he gave it. He didn't give a "media spun" response like a politician, he gave his frank and honest opinion. An opinion in which 90% of us agree with.

It's not the fact that we lost, it's the way we lost.

Occasionally I wish we would get on here and, rather than eat Bailey alive, chow down on Green, Moloney, Jones, Rivers, Sylvia, Jamar, and Davey and their 'leadership skills.'

20 scoring shots in a qtr isn't a badly coached team - it's a team that is lazy and isn't led well on he field.

The team needs leading off field. You only have to look at Knights/Hird. Same players, two different results. The coach is the leader, if he can't get the players to follow his plans on the field, than he obviously isn't doing his job.

I am not sure the players are lazey, I think their just isn't enough structure and the basics are missing. I pretty confident the players do not really know what Bailey wants them to do. Secondly, the rapid change from possession through the middle (Geelong) to playing the boundary line (collingwood) makes me think the plan chanes every year.

Then comes the zones. We don't employ any but every other team does. Is that the senior players fault.

As far as I can see, you need to develop a suitable game plan arround the players you have.

Bailey needs to work out what he stands for.

So it is the right thing that Stynes has had to come out & manage the media? I know who should be answering questions on performance & it isn't Jim Stynes. Stynes has very little to do with the FD.

I don't mind Stynes coming out. One thing our club has lacked in recent times is an identity, someone who represents our club in all areas. McGuire did it for a while until he got Malthouse, Kennett is it for the Hawks, Sheedy was it for Essendon, elliott for Carlotn way back when, and so on. It's the person that when they talk about their club, people stop and listen. It can be a coach, player or president, doesn't matter, as long as we've got one.

Ok, some of the stuff that he said, yeah, maybe Bailey should be saying it at a press conference, but until proven otherwise, I'm 100% sure it gets said with passion behind the scenes.

We finally have an identity in Stynes, and he played his part with the press release this morning.

He also thinks that the tried and failed Brad Miller is a player we are missing at Centre Half Forward. For mine we don't need a Centre Half Forward who can't mark or kick no matter how many times he presents.

He could when Daniher was coach. Was better at the crash and bash. Direct football is what wins games. Unless you are likel Collingwood who can use skill to kick it around the boundary, better of just going straight down the middle.

The team needs leading off field. You only have to look at Knights/Hird. Same players, two different results. The coach is the leader, if he can't get the players to follow his plans on the field, than he obviously isn't doing his job.

I am not sure the players are lazey, I think their just isn't enough structure and the basics are missing. I pretty confident the players do not really know what Bailey wants them to do. Secondly, the rapid change from possession through the middle (Geelong) to playing the boundary line (collingwood) makes me think the plan chanes every year.

Then comes the zones. We don't employ any but every other team does. Is that the senior players fault.

As far as I can see, you need to develop a suitable game plan arround the players you have.

Bailey needs to work out what he stands for.

I strongly believe that Hawthorn forced us to play to the boundary line, and even Green said that we went back to the way we used to play. The 2nd quarter showed what happends when the players play to the game plan that Bailey wants them to play to.

What Bailey stands for is what he believes in. He believes his game plan will win us a premiership. when it is executed perfectly, not many can challenge it. when it is not executed perfectly, we look terrible. I admire Bailey's guts not to change becuase of external pressures. Geelong in the powerful years never changed their game plan, it's just that their players got to the stage where they mastered it on a regular basis, and it was dominant. If we can do what we did against Sydney last year, Brisbane last year, or even Hawthorn in that 2nd quarter last week, when a majority of players have the bodies that have experienced 3 or 4 tough AFL preseasons and seasons, I, like Bailey, have no doubt we will be a force.

I realise the frustration that Sunday brought, I hurt as much as the next supporter, but guys, can you not see these points that a select few of us are raising? We can clearly see yours, and agree to some degree.

There are horses for courses. We need a coach to help develop and mentor youth as they come on. We also need a Wiley game day strategist, lucid of events and quick to act/react. I don't know if Bailey is both, though certainly the former.

Even if it wasnt meant as a public announcement Stynes would be aware of the weight his words would carry. Everyone is now left with no vagaries as to what needs to happen next.

There is to be no apportioning failure to the supposed better opposition there ought to be ownership of failure and the ackowledgement of such.

Now Dean repeat after me: "we played crappy football" , then do something about it, after all you're in the drivers seat.

So it is the right thing that Stynes has had to come out & manage the media? I know who should be answering questions on performance & it isn't Jim Stynes. Stynes has very little to do with the FD.

In situations like that the Chairman/President should be prepared to send a message at all stakeholders. In addition, Stynes is also a very capable media performer (as opposed to a Kennett or Colless) Ok should we get the whole coaching panel and 22 players at the post match conference and say "We're very sorry and it wont happen again?" When you lose like that it is not one individual that has failed in either the FD or the playing group, its both.

And you are kidding that Stynes as the Club President of the Board has very little to do with a department he oversights and is responsible for their appointment. Given the coach is in his last year of his contract I would have thought he would have a very deep interest in what the FD was doing. Might have been your choice of words....

Somewhere between the two RR's lies the truth.

His team have played 2 games together.

Utter crap - no coach gets a clean sheet - he has has an input into four drafts now - this team has his fingerprints all over it

20 scoring shots in a qtr isn't a badly coached team - it's a team that is lazy and isn't led well on he field.

A few things:

Well coached teams don't have 19 scores kicked against them in a quarter and nor do they have 63 points kicked in succession.

Senior players have been lambasted for their performance.

If it's reasonable to suggest that a coach is lauded for his team's good performances then it goes without saying that he partly carries the can for inept ones. Do ya follow ?

Everyone calm down and don`t panic, it is only round 2!

If we`re still playing like this in about 6 weeks time then it`s time to worry!

I know almost every game is hard to win these days, but to me we don`t play another team that is a genuine flag chance till about round 9 (St Kilda) and even they are struggling, so we should know by then if we`re capable of matching it with another top four rated side!

A few things:

Well coached teams don't have 19 scores kicked against them in a quarter and nor do they have 63 points kicked in succession.

Senior players have been lambasted for their performance.

If it's reasonable to suggest that a coach is lauded for his team's good performances then it goes without saying that he partly carries the can for inept ones. Do ya follow ?

That's reasonable to suggest H. But it doesn't excuse the capitulation that took place on field in 20 mins of play. That's when player(s) or leaders can have an influence and halt a roll on. Or make a statement. Or fight. A coach could bark the instructions to the runner to flood or change positions, but it's the leaders who should lead by example in that situation to alter the play; be creative. All shoulders dropped, no one stepped up and gave a yelp.

A few things:

Well coached teams don't have 19 scores kicked against them in a quarter and nor do they have 63 points kicked in succession.

Senior players have been lambasted for their performance.

If it's reasonable to suggest that a coach is lauded for his team's good performances then it goes without saying that he partly carries the can for inept ones. Do ya follow ?

Honestly, when has that ever happened..?

Mike there was nothing about the Hawks game that you could hang a hat on and think we're actually advancing as a team. It reminded me of a thrashing they handed out ar seasons start a few years back. Have we come nowhere since ? Old habits and mindsets were all on display Sunday. It's not the loss it was it's manner that concerns many. It concerned Jim, it concerns me but he's able to do something directly.

I would take, in a heartbeat, a [censored] of a coach that showed he had some idea on how to slow down the breach in the wall, that we had AGAIN on the w/e.

Even the great Jimma has stated in no uncertain term, that the Hawks game was totally unacceptable.

Have Lyon, Barassi, Stynes etc been quiet about where we seem to be at? These guys don't accept non performers anymore and nor should we. These guys have also been at the coalface and I fully respect their opinions.

Jayzuz it's time we gave up with the excuses and started becoming ruthless. Players are looking for and needing guidance and for 4 years now we have been seriously underwhelming in this area.

Right now we need EVERYONE to come out and say this is [censored], we are not that bad, we need a massive change of attitude and a sense of urgency. Enough of the "give us time" crap. It has to happen now, not next week, month, or year.

I don't give a s*$t that we have a young inexperienced side, I expect effort, chasing, imrovement and ruthlessness.

Nice people rarely win such contests. Get tough, get arrogant, get fit, get a 2nd and 3rd gameplan, plus get wussy people out of the club.

Bailey is a dead set worry to me. Some of the players are in a similar place.

It's simply not acceptable that we have performances like that dished up like last w/e. Anyone that says otherwise is not living in the real world. Defending crap like that just shows what sort of character some people have.

I pretty much agree with most of what you've said there except I don't think we have a game plan at all let alone a second and third one.

The form (?) we displayed on Sunday was a continuation of the shyte we served up in the NAB challenge against Essendon and Brisbane, when I stated my concern then I was howled down by the very ones that are defending the team now. Get your head out of the clouds guys we are nowhere near as good as we think we are and some of the recruits we have picked up are simply not up to it.

We've had an era of softness with the likes of Bruce and Yze etc and now all we've done is replace them with new softies like Bennell, Morton and sorry to say it Watts, the problem is there are too many there in self preservation mode and not enough willing to do whatever to win the ball and the game.

The Coach has to take the blame for the lack of an apparent game plan and the FD has to take the blame for recruiting nice boys instead of tough hard win at all costs footballers. We have had the opportunity to pick the best players available and we have stuffed it up, we have picked up three beanpoles as our first pick in the last four drafts, Morton, Watts and now Cook. It would appear that Morton will always be skinny Watts has and will put on more weight and the jury is out on Cook. We need midfielders not more shinny potential KPP’s. I was happier with our Rookie selections than our National Draft picks.

The capitulation by the players on Sunday was compounded by the lack of initiative shown by the coach; we did the same thing over and over and repeated the same mistakes again and again. We kept kicking the ball out to a pack on the MCC wing and it kept coming straight back in because we only had Jamar out there to mark it. We didn’t try to break it up by doing something different; they played like robots without any football nouse at all. Bailey said he didn’t see it coming well he must have been down on the boundary just prior to the end of the second quarter because with 5 minutes to go in the quarter Flash held up the ball and signaled tempo football because it appeared to me the players were stuffed, not fit. Hawthorn were happy to play that game they wanted to get in for the half time break and limit our lead so they just kicked it to themselves as well.

As I said before the start of the season I am having flashbacks to 2007 where we had hopes of doing well before the season but it all came crashing down around our ears in the first quarter of the first game, this year it’s taken until the seventh quarter.