Sorry belzebub59, but what a load of tripe!

You can be sure that each and every week Bailey is hoping his charges will go out and win; in fact I'm sure that is now his expectation. Yes he has been experimenting and trying to give the younger players more experience at the top level, but you will notice that this is happening far less than last year, because now winning is what it's all about. We may have tanked last year to ensure we got the best of the draft picks in what was the last uncompromised draft, but you can be certain there will be no tanking this year to ensure that we don't have to play finals footy.

Do you seriously believe that Checker Hughes, Norm Smith, Ron Barassi et al would have ever considered taking a "tortoise and hare" approach??? Essentially, finals are just more games to be won, and winning is what every player's expectation should be.

Edited August 1, 201014 yr by hardtack

its stupid to not want the boys to get a taste of september action....

hard to beleive you could be so naive as to consequences of a mistimed and conceived tilt .

pfft what a load of crap!

Thread title alone - possible the worst one I have ever seen. We support all year and the players work hard and train hard all year to make finals, for someone to suggest we don't deserve it or to even raise a thread like this is insane. It is as simple as, every game we play we get better, more experience, every final we play we will get better and more experience. In saying this I think we probably needed to win one of our closer games earlier in the year to give us a good chance.

All year I've said finals aren't important this year. It was more important that Bails continued to develop the list towards a premiership tilt than rack up a few extra wins this year.

I think Bailey has done a great job this year. He's continued getting games into kids and the club has continued it's conservative approach to players returning from injury. Still we find ourselves in contention for the 8 this late in the year. I still don't think it's overly important to make the 8 this year but it'd be a fantastic bonus. To get there we'd need to win 6 of our last 8 games. Regardless of what happens week 1 of the finals that would be a great platform to launch next years campaign from.

Well said furious D

Do enlighten as to difference. I've outlined my view .. Explain yours

My view is that finishing 8th and playing in (assuming, of course) one losing final does not magically transform our season from "development year" to "mistimed tilt" - it's just finishing 8th rather than 9th.

I think you and others are reading far, far more in to the negative impacts of making the finals than what really exist.

hard to beleive you could be so naive as to consequences of a mistimed and conceived tilt .

Naive ?!

Consequences ? Burn out ? Please, give me something of substance to argue BB.

Of course '87 was a well managed conceived plan for a "tilt" then. I guess '98 was too ???

BB if Sydney & Carlton happen to fall flat on their face and our team somehow manages the required Premiership points to fall in. It will be a hell of a lot better for members of the team and the club having participated in a final(s?) than finishing outside the eight. ie. It is still about "development"

One good reason is gaining the "belief" in making finals and belief in competing well enough so early in development (there it is again...d-e-v-e-l-o-p-m-e-n-t). The next time might not be so much about 'making the finals'; but perhaps spurring them onto advance further..

Perhaps the last couple of years has had an effect on some.

Stay positive.

Thread title alone - possible the worst one I have ever seen. We support all year and the players work hard and train hard all year to make finals, for someone to suggest we don't deserve it or to even raise a thread like this is insane. It is as simple as, every game we play we get better, more experience, every final we play we will get better and more experience. In saying this I think we probably needed to win one of our closer games earlier in the year to give us a good chance.

In principle I'd be just as happy if we finished 9th or 10th - but I want us to win at least 3 of our 4 games from here on in ..... and if we do that - we'll just about sneak in.

Logically everyone who has criticized this thread is absolutely right.... get some reward for effort and some finals experience to boot.

Just as long as everyone recognizes that the difference between 8th and 12th on the ladder is just the luck of the draw .... and that we will have to work just as hard in the off season to be any sort of contender next year as the 12th team will.Who will push themselves harder in 40 degree heat over the summer.... a team that has just been congratulated for making the finals - or a team carrying the stigma of finishing 12th ? Its not insane to recognize that some of our youngsters might work that fraction harder during the pre-season if we finish in the bottom half of the ladder.

I desperately want us to get an edge over Richmond and North .... and to beat our AAMI Stadium hoodoo. If we do that we'll make the finals. We'll just have to trust that DB will keep everyone's feet on the ground ... and that competition for places will ensure that every individual works like a navvy to improve before next season

If we make the finals, it will be because we win some pretty tough games over the next few weeks, which is a indication that we are ready. A game or two in the finals can be used as a huge motivator to work harder and focus even more on what needs to be done to ensure the next time we make the finals, we are better positioned to go even deeper into September. I echo the sentiments from others that Bailey seems to be more than able to keep the group focused and level headed.

For what its worth, there is a big difference to hanging onto a finals position by the skin of your teeth with a poor record over the last part of a season to finishing a season with a good record and hitting the finals, even if it is the lower part of the 8 with confidence and momentum.

In principle I'd be just as happy if we finished 9th or 10th - but I want us to win at least 3 of our 4 games from here on in ..... and if we do that - we'll just about sneak in.

Logically everyone who has criticized this thread is absolutely right.... get some reward for effort and some finals experience to boot.

Just as long as everyone recognizes that the difference between 8th and 12th on the ladder is just the luck of the draw .... and that we will have to work just as hard in the off season to be any sort of contender next year as the 12th team will.Who will push themselves harder in 40 degree heat over the summer.... a team that has just been congratulated for making the finals - or a team carrying the stigma of finishing 12th ? Its not insane to recognize that some of our youngsters might work that fraction harder during the pre-season if we finish in the bottom half of the ladder.

I desperately want us to get an edge over Richmond and North .... and to beat our AAMI Stadium hoodoo. If we do that we'll make the finals. We'll just have to trust that DB will keep everyone's feet on the ground ... and that competition for places will ensure that every individual works like a navvy to improve before next season

I think this is a worthwhile thread. Finals have never really been on the radar for this year, and it's not unreasonable to express concern about the effect on a young team if we scrape into 8th by default and get absolutely hammered.

On the other hand, if this did happen, the team would be just as fired up over the preseason as if we lost by a point, or if we missed out on the 8 by what could effectively be a single point in two games against the Pies. Or if we finished 12th, as hoopla implies.

The trouble with both Essendon & Carlton is that the FANS got way ahead of themselves and believed that if they made the 8 by default last year, they will definitely improve this year. It's the flaky fans of both clubs that are putting the coach & players under pressure, when this year is a more accurate reflection of where both teams are at.

Similarly, the greatest risk for the Dees is that if we scrape in by default this year, and certain fans start to get ahead of themselves and believe that anything less than top four next year means that Bailey must be sacked.

But that won't happen, will it??

Ridiculous thread - we should be aiming as high as we can - that should be a given

The argument that they are not ready for finals action yet is spurious at best... there is a reason why they say that teams with finals experience generally perform better in the finals, and we all know the best way to get finals experience... don't we?

hard to beleive you could be so naive as to consequences of a mistimed and conceived tilt .

Of course I'd be disappointed if we make the finals this year and underperfom next year as a result. But even if this did happen, my reaction won't be "wow, I wish we hadn't made the finals one year two early". My reaction will be, "wow, it's a bit of a concern that our list is flaky enough to let last years better-than-expected performance get to their heads, and to rest on their laurels".

In a nutshell, if we make the 8 and go backwards, the problem won't be that we made the 8, the problem will be that we're soft in the head.

In a nutshell, if we make the 8 and go backwards, the problem won't be that we made the 8, the problem will be that we're soft in the head.

Well said Arthur

Thee are and there entitled to be more than one viewpoint to all this. Some take the finals at any reason or opportunity type stance and there is a certain romanticism about that...yeahhh!! finals..woohoo we made finals..we made it etc. or the any finals experience is a good one and so on and so on.

There are some, myself included who take a more circumspect position and look to the best won batles of history and note very few were particulalrly opportunistic in the manner of just happening to be there. The most decisive campaigns we planned, to the nth degree, were resourced and time managed. So you have ad hoc, fall over the line versus properly thought out and positioned encounter.

This year was never about finlas...hell it was ..lets see if we cancombine and grow as a team and learn to play footy together and if al goes well lets savour some wins. Use that as a foudation to rasie the bar the following year with more ( and better ) wins resulting in a mechanical approach to the notion of triumph rather than the surprise result.

Were still in second gear...no matte how much you rev you wont get there with any great haste. All you'll do is burn up what you have and fry part of the team in the process. Its not ready yet.

Again, finals are not the destination or prize...they are simply a pathway.

I want to see Melbourne not only take out its next Premiership but to start a dynasty of success reminiscnt of the late fifties early sixties.

No one hit wonders ( if that lucky ) ..rather a solid album of success.

patience... and resolve are required.

Tortoise..and Hare !!

Try and imagine if we make the Finals this year BB and actually WIN in week one. If you can do that you will see your arguement at a mistimed tilt is Futile.

You write as if next year is already written-15 other clubs just might disagree.

What we get this year we take-Do the Best we can.

I repeat Junior McDonald in september-That is good for me.

Win 3 of 4 we probably finish 8th and play Freo. in Perth. Win 4 of 4 we probably finish 7th and play the Hawks on the 'G.

Prospects?

.v. Tigers Good

.v. Hawks Better than most people think

.v. Port Unlikely

.v. North Good

We are a chance!

Try and imagine if we make the Finals this year BB and actually WIN in week one. If you can do that you will see your arguement at a mistimed tilt is Futile.

You write as if next year is already written-15 other clubs just might disagree.

What we get this year we take-Do the Best we can.

I repeat Junior McDonald in september-That is good for me.

Not to mention the flawed idea that any team who makes the eight is automatically making a "tilt," implying that later attempts at the eight might be sacrificed with the aim of doing better now. As long as we don't sway from what we believe will cause our players to play their best in the future, whatever happens, happens. Football players want to win every game. Fans should want their team to win every game. If our team wins every game for the rest of the H&A season, we're in the eight - good for us. If we keep winning each week, hey presto! we'll have won a flag.

Basically, there's no argument that it's a bad thing to make the finals prematurely as a result of planning for the future. Where you get problems is if you sacrifice future greatness in the name of mediocrity in the present.

Edited August 2, 201014 yr by Chook

I hope your signature is on the money

I hope your signature is on the money

Me too. I can't wait to see how we go against the Hawks in a couple of weeks' time. I'm sure the players will have a lot of motivation, given what they dished up in Round 1.

I just saw this thread. Heh.

WTF?

This is a disgrace! This is not the attitude that will ever produce a flag.

This is what makes Melbourne supporters the laughing stock of the competition, no other team would have supporters hoping they don't make the finals. Effectively hoping we lose without reward. You have made me feel sick.

AFL is a pressure sport at all levels. This is not a under 11s girls netball team. Our team will have to man up and defeat the pressures of expectations if they are ever to win the flag. What is the problem with experiencing this pressure early? The players who can't handle it will need to make way for the players that can and the only way to find this out is by putting players into the pressure cooker that is AFL finals football and future media expectations.

Appalling thread, inept supporters. I am ashamed. This thread should be deleted.

This is a disgrace! This is not the attitude that will ever produce a flag.

This is what makes Melbourne supporters the laughing stock of the competition, no other team would have supporters hoping they don't make the finals. Effectively hoping we lose without reward. You have made me feel sick.

AFL is a pressure sport at all levels. This is not a under 11s girls netball team. Our team will have to man up and defeat the pressures of expectations if they are ever to win the flag. What is the problem with experiencing this pressure early? The players who can't handle it will need to make way for the players that can and the only way to find this out is by putting players into the pressure cooker that is AFL finals football and future media expectations.

Appalling thread, inept supporters. I am ashamed. This thread should be deleted.

I think it should be kept up, as a tribute to the stupidity of some footy fans. I mean, really? Yeah, let's finish 9th. As if that would somehow make our players better at dealing with the pressure of finals than actually playing in one. Absolutely ridiculous!

This is a disgrace! This is not the attitude that will ever produce a flag.

This is what makes Melbourne supporters the laughing stock of the competition, no other team would have supporters hoping they don't make the finals. Effectively hoping we lose without reward. You have made me feel sick.

AFL is a pressure sport at all levels. This is not a under 11s girls netball team. Our team will have to man up and defeat the pressures of expectations if they are ever to win the flag. What is the problem with experiencing this pressure early? The players who can't handle it will need to make way for the players that can and the only way to find this out is by putting players into the pressure cooker that is AFL finals football and future media expectations.

Appalling thread, inept supporters. I am ashamed. This thread should be deleted.

Go hard GNF! I think you'll find the majority agreeing with you, maybe not in those words!!

I hope that this thread is never seen by an opposition supporter