On 16/05/2010 at 00:03, jumbo returns said:

You raise some excellent points. Jack probably will kick more goals because he'll spend most of his time in the forward line, but as I see it ATM, you need to get the ball down there. Seriously, West Coast's forward line was full of second stringers yesterday, I only rate Le Cras (if he had kicked straight, it was game over at half time) yet Naitanui gets his own clearances that allow scoring opportunities.

I still contend that this debate will not be answered on this forum, but played out over the season.

I still say this habit of NicNat's of getting his own clearances after the ruck contest is a bad thing. Firstly, it means that he has failed to find a target with the hitout. Secondly, it is symptomatic of his "see the ball, chase the ball" approach to the game. It looks great when he's crashing through opponents to chase the ball, but it's not something that he should be doing. Far better to get a quick effective disposal to one of his midfielders and use his pace to sprint forward and make an option in the 50. Hopefully this will come in time, but his hands will need to get a lot cleaner.

As for his 2 clearances for 2 score assists, JW had 2 contested marks for 2 scoring assists. Which do you rate more highly?

  On 15/05/2010 at 14:35, Akum said:

Look, I have nothing against people criticising Jack for what's there (example: "he's got a strange kicking action off his left foot - will it stand up under pressure?"). But I reserve the right to call those who try to pass off what's in their imagination as holy writ when it's beyond ridiculous. For some reason that I can't fathom, Jack seems to attract these bizarre pronouncements about his psyche in a way that no other player does in living memory. It's the difference between "even when he calls for the ball, he looks uncertain" (which is what can actually be seen, and which I can disagree with but it's a reasonable comment) and "he doesn't want the ball enough" (which says much more about the poster's psyche than it does about Jack's).

Good post. Not limited to Jack Watts either, the projection of what's going on inside the heads of the team/players/coaches is just mind-boggling at times.

For mine, thought he looked very good for first up in a team that got belted. Not a lot of result for his efforts, and in truth, not even all that many efforts, but you can see what all the fuss is about.

As an aside, up the other end, WCE had their own "Jack Watts" in Kennedy. Drafted no. 4 in 2005 and now, 5 years later becoming the focus of their forward line and a "star". Yes, it can take that long.

  On 15/05/2010 at 23:37, jumbo returns said:

Absolute articulation at its best.

great response

does anyone else think the reason NicNat plays so bad against us is because he is sad we didnt pick him?

  On 16/05/2010 at 08:42, bing181 said:

As an aside, up the other end, WCE had their own "Jack Watts" in Kennedy. Drafted no. 4 in 2005 and now, 5 years later becoming the focus of their forward line and a "star". Yes, it can take that long.

Very good point..Josh Kennedy took a few seasons to kick into gear. As tall forwards do.

It's just the Media love instant "add water" champions. Did anybody hear Mark Robinson on saturday morning??? Sounded drunk as to me, the bloke can hardly speak!!!!

  On 16/05/2010 at 10:27, why you little said:

Very good point..Josh Kennedy took a few seasons to kick into gear. As tall forwards do.

It's just the Media love instant "add water" champions. Did anybody hear Mark Robinson on saturday morning??? Sounded drunk as to me, the bloke can hardly speak!!!!

No, but I noticed he wrote another article on Essendon's Dustin Fletcher yesterday.

can anyone please confirm how jack watts did in his 20m sprints at draft camp? he just did not appear to have a second gear in terms of speed but I do recall him being one of the quickest at draft camp. Maybe the extra size has slowed him or its just maybe a case of asthetically looking not that fast when he actually is.

  On 16/05/2010 at 22:21, Strawbsodwyer said:

can anyone please confirm how jack watts did in his 20m sprints at draft camp? he just did not appear to have a second gear in terms of speed but I do recall him being one of the quickest at draft camp. Maybe the extra size has slowed him or its just maybe a case of asthetically looking not that fast when he actually is.

I was thinking about this and wondering if the test was done on a basketball court with sneakers, or on grass with boots.

  On 16/05/2010 at 22:21, Strawbsodwyer said:

can anyone please confirm how jack watts did in his 20m sprints at draft camp? he just did not appear to have a second gear in terms of speed but I do recall him being one of the quickest at draft camp. Maybe the extra size has slowed him or its just maybe a case of asthetically looking not that fast when he actually is.

2.82 seconds - second fastest from that draft.

Interesting article from lethal:

Watts pick could still pay off

Bit of a turnaround for him?

  On 16/05/2010 at 22:21, Strawbsodwyer said:

can anyone please confirm how jack watts did in his 20m sprints at draft camp? he just did not appear to have a second gear in terms of speed but I do recall him being one of the quickest at draft camp. Maybe the extra size has slowed him or its just maybe a case of asthetically looking not that fast when he actually is.

There was a moment in the 1st qtr where he really closed down a WC player (can't remember who) and caused a turnover, closing speed then was great.

Lyon was saying on MMM though that his problem is that he doesn't change his pace a lot, so makes him look a little slower than he actually is, said if he altered the pace of his leads i.e. quick, slow, quick again - those contested marks he took would have been uncontested - which he said is how Roo gets so many uncontested marks on the lead

It was interesting observing the Non battle beween Jack Watts and Nic Natanui at the MCG on Saturday.On one hand Nic Natanui a bigger,stronger,more experienced player from my observation took 2 spectacular marks and got some tap outs but apart from that did absolutely f@#K all.The way the media,especially Bruce McAvaney bangs on about him youd reckon he had the Brownlow sewn up about 3 weeks ago.

On the other hand Jack Watts took a couple of strong contested marks, showed a lot of poise and is a very good kick with both feet.Although he also didn't get a ton of the footy ,I thought he outshone Nic Nat and is the much better option IMO.

Yes,Nic Nat is an outstanding athlete,however Jack Watts is also a good athlete and has class footballer written all over him.

Jack Watts > Nic Natanui.Good choice MFC recruiting department.!

  On 16/05/2010 at 22:51, Tricky said:

Interesting article from lethal:

Watts pick could still pay off

Bit of a turnaround for him?

An almost a positive piece of press, who would have thought !!!

  On 15/05/2010 at 08:02, Godemons said:

Pity he dropped that mark in the last quarter because that will give the pundits something to harp on.

On the contrary it was carp pass which was not placed to his advantage on a 1 on 1. It was kicked over his head.

Very poor disposal and a forward deserves better opportunities. The passer was tied between having a ping or passing and ended up making a confused lousy ping for goal

Just read the one of many news articles about Watts, he had to work his butt off on Saturday and was stuffed. The first thing that goes when you are stuffed is your speed. He would of wasted a lot of energy by running to spots when he didn't need to and will learn from this. It is important for him to play at this level for at least 10 games this year, would love to see him play every game but would be happy with 10.

  On 16/05/2010 at 23:15, Rhino Richards said:

On the contrary it was carp pass which was not placed to his advantage on a 1 on 1. It was kicked over his head.

Very poor disposal and a forward deserves better opportunities. The passer was tied between having a ping or passing and ended up making a confused lousy ping for goal

My word it was. He wasn't happy about it either, glancing at the teammate getting up.

  On 16/05/2010 at 22:51, Tricky said:

Interesting article from lethal:

Watts pick could still pay off

Bit of a turnaround for him?

And yet who is in the picture accompanying the article?

  On 16/05/2010 at 22:51, Tricky said:

Interesting article from lethal:

Watts pick could still pay off

Bit of a turnaround for him?

That was a nothing article.

"Watts is unlikely to shine as a key forward in the immediate future, yet he now looks like he can cope with senior footy, and should be persevered with to learn on the job."

Ground-breaking stuff there from Matthews.

  On 17/05/2010 at 03:18, Clint Bizkit said:

That was a nothing article.

"Watts is unlikely to shine as a key forward in the immediate future, yet he now looks like he can cope with senior footy, and should be persevered with to learn on the job."

Ground-breaking stuff there from Matthews.

The interesting part was the obvious about-face from LM.

I have a feeling this will be trend from all the doubters over time. Can't recall if you are one or not?

  On 17/05/2010 at 03:10, RalphiusMaximus said:

And yet who is in the picture accompanying the article?

Cameron Bruce.

Patrick Smith on SEN this morning likened Jack to a young James Hird, I'd be happy with that.

  On 17/05/2010 at 03:10, RalphiusMaximus said:

And yet who is in the picture accompanying the article?

Just a gentle tip: go to the AFL Photos website and see how many pics of Jack Watts there were from Saturday's game.

  On 15/05/2010 at 23:34, jumbo returns said:

When Dean Cox arrived at WC several years ago there's a story going around that he couldn't even bounce the ball. Five years later, he was favourite for the Brownlow. Nat will learn his craft. Cox and Nic Nat gave it to Jamar yesterday and in the last quarter when the game was there to be won (or lost) in our case, Nic Nat went into the ruck, got 2 clearances that resulted in 2 goals - game over. What I've been trying to say all along is that, IMO, he was a standout for 1st pick, just as Scully and Trengove picked themselves. I'd like to open this debate again at the end of the year and hopefully eat some humble pie, but we can't get away from the fact of what could have been.

Tic Tak gave nothing to Jamar on Saturday !!

  On 15/05/2010 at 11:33, jumbo returns said:

Don't tell me, NOT ONCE! did some of you bemoan the fact the WE didn't pick him 1st.

I did.

Hand on heart - not even close. Naitanui is the most overrated "footballer" I've ever seen.

  On 17/05/2010 at 05:47, RobbieF said:

Patrick Smith on SEN this morning likened Jack to a young James Hird, I'd be happy with that.

Patrick Smith....... very funny RobbieF