Jack Watts

[Ron Burgundy 8,584]

It'd be interesting to know what the football department really thinks about Watts.

It's likely that Watts will become a very good player, but for pick number one in a reasonable draft, the signs aren't fantastic.

Everyone talks about NikNat, but I keep wondering whether we actually should've picked Hurley.

[The Jack of Grimes 0]

The reality is, he needs game time and that can only happen with the selection panel choosing him. With Martin playing like shite and Ricky out injured, it's time to take a gamble with Watts and Wona (when fit). Both these two need serious game time if we are to 'win' a flag in 2-3 years time. Theres no point bringing in Miller or PJ or Newton. How many chances do those three need? Our future forward line lies with LiamJ, JWatts, AussieW, RickyP, MBate and CSylvia.

[Keyser Söze 0]

...

Don't take this the wrong way, but I'll back the club's judgement before yours.

I expect him to be pretty ordinary at this stage.

He is a lightly-built spindly young KPF in what is virtually his first year in the AFL system, coming from an injury-interrupted preseason, and playing against more mature bodied players, whether it is a second-tier competition or not.

He wasn't drafted to be good from the get-go; he was drafted to be tearing games apart in a couple of years' time.

I think you can agree, given his skill level, awareness and athleticism, there should be nothing stopping Watts from doing just that, once he matures.

I've said it before, but the problem is not with Watts; it is with supporters' expectations.

Merge threads.

[Felix 92]

The reality is, he needs game time and that can only happen with the selection panel choosing him. With Martin playing like shite and Ricky out injured, it's time to take a gamble with Watts and Wona (when fit). Both these two need serious game time if we are to 'win' a flag in 2-3 years time. Theres no point bringing in Miller or PJ or Newton. How many chances do those three need? Our future forward line lies with LiamJ, JWatts, AussieW, RickyP, MBate and CSylvia.

NO, the clubs is looking after his development, sooo, we need to wait until he stops growing in 2 years, then we need to make sure his weight is right, then we need to slowly remove the cotton wool, then we need to make sure he has air bags in his car (otherwise he can not drive to the games), and importantly he need to play 3-4 GOOD games at Casey, which entails a minimum of 6 goals a game, 48 touches, & 15 marks, all this must happen before he is considered for a senior spot.

[jabberwocky 2,301]

NO, the clubs is looking after his development, sooo, we need to wait until he stops growing in 2 years, then we need to make sure his weight is right, then we need to slowly remove the cotton wool, then we need to make sure he has air bags in his car (otherwise he can not drive to the games), and importantly he need to play 3-4 GOOD games at Casey, which entails a minimum of 6 goals a game, 48 touches, & 15 marks, all this must happen before he is considered for a senior spot.

He is not ready and the reasons are partly physical.................

[Keyser Söze 0]

He is not ready and the reasons are partly physical.................

and partly mental.

But for a kid in effectively his first season, is that necessarily an issue?

Only because of our own unrealistic impatience.

[drdrake 3,163]

He is not ready and the reasons are partly physical.................

Watts is not ready, rubbish, the only way we can get him fully ready is by playing him. He will learn more by playing at AFL level and will be a better player with the more games he plays. You take care of him, he doesn't play Full Forward put him on the HFF let him run around, I watch Stephen Hill play last year, his body wasn't ready for AFL footy, he got smashed in the first half of the year, then showed something in the back half. This year he is exciting to watch and has benefited from learning how to play by playing at AFL level. Hill is one example I'm sure there are many of players that are better player due to the experience they have gained by playing at that highest level.

[Ho Chi Dee 0]

Those critics that are now celebrating how the team is playing and coming along (despite yesterday) need to understand that the same group of coaches and management team are delighted with the way Jack is coming along with the odd injury slowing him down.

CHF take 5 years of AFL to develop into good players and become champions at 28 years+. The odd exception J.Brown are basically born men.

Think of the top CHF today and trace back their trajectory from their draft age (not years in AFL) and you will see Jack is on the same path.

Which elite level CHFs of recent times have waited until they were over 28 to become 'champions'? Most of them are nearing the end of their peak by that time.

As has been noted numerous times here, all truly good KPFs have shown promise early on, and become champions well before 28. Brown, Riewoldt, Franklin, Llyod, Carey etc. were all recognised as being amongst the very best of the competition by the erly 20s. Schwarz, as a Melbourne comparison, was ready to join such ranks at 22. 'Good' KPFs might take until their late 20s to make the most of their talents, but elite ones do it early.

Your note about where Jack's AFL output is compared to other top level KPFs is true, and your call for paitence is sensible. However the idea that we shouldn't expect much from Jack in the near future is off the mark. If he's to become A grade, and we need him to and expect him to, he should be showing signs of what he is capable of towards the end of this year and in 2011. If he's to become what we want, he should be amongst the competition's best by 2013.

From what I've seen of him, I'm confident he will do that, but if we are waiting until his late 20s, he will not have been the player we needed.

Given this is essentially his first year, it's not too much of a worry yet - but if he is still only producing similar performances in the VFL by the end of the year it will be concerning.

Edited May 2, 2010 by Ho Chi Dee

[MadAsHell 4,212]

Hello all,

I watched Casey Scorpions the other day on the Gold Coast and one person stood out to me.....Jack Watts. Now i have been a massive fan until i saw him play the other day.

1st. He didn't look like he wanted to be playing for Casey.

2nd. For all those people saying "he's so good with the football" "so good with his decision making" the reality is he was terrible, both miller and newton were a mile ahead of this kid. And before everyone jumps down my throat i agree that miller and newton have failed at the elite level, however it is extremely worrying when our #1 draft pick is no where near these two.

3rd. Apart from the fact his first shot at goal went into the man on the mark or his second almost went out on the full it was his efforts around the ground when he pulled out of contests as if he didnt want to get hurt was the most distressing. There were plenty of melbourne fans shaking their heads.

4th. And before everyone jumps on the "he's young" crap the reality is he is a #1 draft pick playing in the 2nd tear competion struggling to get a kick, we are too soft on him. He needs to start showing us results. I hope i am proven wrong.

No offence Davey36 but with that being your first post it will raise a lot of peoples eye brows, we'll see what Brad Gotch has to say about his game.

I was at the Casey-v-Geelong match round 1 of the VFL and I was very impressed with the way he played. His second efforst and recovery in particular was very impressive I found. He's still some time off, but if what you say is true I'd suspect he either just had a very dirty day or might have been carrying something.

Also I'm sure the FD couldn't of been so wrong in giving him the no 1 pick if his attitude is that bad, they do all sorts of psych tests and interviews and research before drafting players these days.

[Inner Demon 1]

You want to know the real truth about Jack Watts??

He's 19 and has no senior football experience.

Show me a 196cm+ modern player of the same age and experience doing more than Jack.

[Spaghetti 264]

You want to know the real truth about Jack Watts??

He's 19 and has no senior football experience.

Show me a 196cm+ modern player of the same age and experience doing more than Jack.

Michael Hurly. Although not 196cm, but he is a KP player. 3cm is irrelevant.

Thanks for your post davey36. I have no hesitation in taking your word on the game as Bailey has hardly jumped to Jack's defence these past few weeks.

[Keyser Söze 0]

Michael Hurly. Although not 196cm, but he is a KP player. 3cm is irrelevant.

Thanks for your post davey36. I have no hesitation in taking your word on the game as Bailey has hardly jumped to Jack's defence these past few weeks.

Hurley was drafted as a player who had the body to compete from day one.

He's also older.

Quite a bit of difference in my opinion.

That's not even mentioning that he himself has done very little besides kick a goal from 50 on his wrong foot.

Jack didn't have the luxury of coming in playing second fiddle to Lloyd (or 3rd fiddle with Lucas) and having a man's body.

[Whispering_Jack 30,036]

I must add that a few close friends of mine play for Gold Coat football club and they were all having a good laugh about Jack Watts and his attitude towards the game.

If that's the case then the laugh's on them!

[Demon Stalwart 255]

Well first up Congratulation to the Team

I thought we were going to have another Blow out like against Hawthorn but to their credit they fought back so it was a Managable loss

We will improve on that and I know the Melbournes younger players will be better for it.

Next week against the Dogs is a Game that we have to be competitive in and we need to pull out what ever we can do, to be just that.

The dogs will be looking to atone for their loss to StKilda especially after having them on toast then loosing it.

So therefore to my original Question, where is Watt at?? I havent heard how he played for Casey and I havent had a update on his back injury

In saying that I believe that Watts should play this week expecially in light of Petard's Injury, if of course, young Watts is up to it.

I believe that having Watts on the ground will causes the Bulldogs a few headaches with their gameplan.

In saying that, I do not expect us to win, but I do want to see the Team perform to the best level they can.

What's do others think?

[Real Demon 232]

I think if he deserves a game, he should play, but if he hasn't done what's been asked by the coaches, or they believe he's not ready, then he shouldn't.

Simple as that.

[Hannabal 4]

Don't take this the wrong way, but I'll back the club's judgement before yours.

I expect him to be pretty ordinary at this stage.

He is a lightly-built spindly young KPF in what is virtually his first year in the AFL system, coming from an injury-interrupted preseason, and playing against more mature bodied players, whether it is a second-tier competition or not.

He wasn't drafted to be good from the get-go; he was drafted to be tearing games apart in a couple of years' time.

I think you can agree, given his skill level, awareness and athleticism, there should be nothing stopping Watts from doing just that, once he matures.

I've said it before, but the problem is not with Watts; it is with supporters' expectations.

Merge threads.

That's all well and good, but that's not to say that there can't be worrying signs early on. There seems to be only two schools of thought on this forum. It's either the 'sky is falling' brigade, or the 'I'll back the club 100%' brigade. I'd be very surprised if the club doesn't share some of the concerns on Watts progress.

And I don't think anyone expects him to be an AFL star at this early stage, but at the same time I hardly expect him to be an "ordinary player", as you put it. I'm not suggesting he is, btw.

My only concerns at present is his complete lack of any physicality. I'm not concerned by a kick into the man on the mark, or the odd skill error, as I know he has skill in bucketloads, but I am concerned by his complete lack of physical presence on the footy field - at least when I've seen him.

[Neita3000 37]

My only concerns at present is his complete lack of any physicality. I'm not concerned by a kick into the man on the mark, or the odd skill error, as I know he has skill in bucketloads, but I am concerned by his complete lack of physical presence on the footy field - at least when I've seen him.

Agreed. That and a lack of intensity.

Phil Davis for Adelaide was drafted as a skinny kpp who came out of the private school system in Adelaide. He's now playing off a half back flank/wing and doing quite well.

[stranga 328]

Im interested to know how much footy the recruiting staff saw him play outside of the National Championships. Is it right that he only played a handful of games for Sandringham in his draft year, did he perform well there?

Highlights of his under 18s Vic games show him go at marking contests pretty strongly.

[deeflog 679]

I went to the Melb vs Nth Melb game yesterday, and a few Melbourne fans sitting near me were speculating that a possible reason for Watts not getting an AFL game so far this year, is that he has been poached by the Gold Coast. These guys were not in-the-know or had any evidence to back it up, just hearsay and rumour.

Personally I think that's false, Petterd would be the most likely candidate to head to GC in my mind. Even though Watts has had no impact at AFL, it would be a real disappointment to see him go after all the time and effort MFC has put into developing him.

Jack said back when he was being drafted, if we passed on him and went for NikNat he would not nominate because he did not want to move interstate. I would not have thought that thought would have changed

[Keyser Söze 0]

Agreed. That and a lack of intensity.

Phil Davis for Adelaide was drafted as a skinny kpp who came out of the private school system in Adelaide. He's now playing off a half back flank/wing and doing quite well.

Phil Davis was playing SANFL footy and not as skinny or young as Watts when drafted.

[Vipercrunch 2,827]

I like some who have posted here are concerned about his intensity and attitude (what we see on the field), all of which has nothing to do with age and body maturity. The post from Davey36 concerns me.

Calls to play him in the seniors also concerns me because it is not on merit. Nothing from the reports from the Casey game on the weekend suggests he played any where near well enough to get selected for Melbourne. Why on earth should he get a game on potential or hopes? It will do nothing for him and will do nothing for his team mates busting their guts out for a game in the seniors.

For all those who stand firm in confidence that Watts will be as good as we have been told he will be, when (if ever) will you start to question or worry about Watts?

[Akum 2,660]

...

My only concerns at present is his complete lack of any physicality. I'm not concerned by a kick into the man on the mark, or the odd skill error, as I know he has skill in bucketloads, but I am concerned by his complete lack of physical presence on the footy field - at least when I've seen him.

I take your point H, but he's being played mainly as a wingman, occasionally as HFF next to Miller at CHF. For someone who's played probably every game since he first kicked a footy at CHF, wing would have to be just about the most unfamiliar position on the ground. If he looks lost in some games, it wouldn't be surprising.

And playing HFF he'd be expected to be second fiddle to Miller, whose future AFL career depends to a large degree on showing a physical presence. I'd expect he's been instructed to leave all the "lead-up" stuff to Miller and not to get in his way.

In other words, I don't know that being played on the wing or HFF for Casey is a good guide for how he'd play if he were CHF. And to push this point further, I'm finding it harder to understand the wisdom of selecting him on the wing for Casey as the best preparation for a future KPF.

Perhaps he needs a few games as KPF at Casey, but to do this he'd have to displace both Miller and Newton and probably Hughes, all of whom have their careers on the line at the end of 2010 season.

Edited May 3, 2010 by Akum

[Arthur Dent 2]

I like some who have posted here are concerned about his intensity and attitude (what we see on the field), all of which has nothing to do with age and body maturity. The post from Davey36 concerns me.

Calls to play him in the seniors also concerns me because it is not on merit. Nothing from the reports from the Casey game on the weekend suggests he played any where near well enough to get selected for Melbourne. Why on earth should he get a game on potential or hopes? It will do nothing for him and will do nothing for his team mates busting their guts out for a game in the seniors.

For all those who stand firm in confidence that Watts will be as good as we have been told he will be, when (if ever) will you start to question or worry about Watts?

In about 2-3 years time when he is a mature footballer. Jeez can we all just give the KID a break. Not everyone matures at the same rate. He was playing against kids at school last year.

[loges 6,767]

I like some who have posted here are concerned about his intensity and attitude (what we see on the field), all of which has nothing to do with age and body maturity. The post from Davey36 concerns me.

Calls to play him in the seniors also concerns me because it is not on merit. Nothing from the reports from the Casey game on the weekend suggests he played any where near well enough to get selected for Melbourne. Why on earth should he get a game on potential or hopes? It will do nothing for him and will do nothing for his team mates busting their guts out for a game in the seniors.

For all those who stand firm in confidence that Watts will be as good as we have been told he will be, when (if ever) will you start to question or worry about Watts?

Strongly agree here. Would be very interested in Whispering Jack's take on some of these comments re intensity, physicallity etc.

[Tricky 341]

Jack said back when he was being drafted, if we passed on him and went for NikNat he would not nominate because he did not want to move interstate. I would not have thought that thought would have changed

I heard somewhere (on SEN I think) that players had to have been with their club for a minimum of 3 years before being eligible for poaching?