Maldonboy38

6. Rivers 5. Grimes (mid-filed leadership at last) 4. Watts 3. Garland 2. Jones 1. Nicholson apologies to Jeremy Howe.

AS much as I hate the Pies and Carlton, ever since the 2000 Grand Final I HATE Essendon. That felt really good tonight. Skillful? - not particularly. Great forward spread? - ummm no. But great gut-wrenching, hard at it, never-give up, mongrel footy and the free flowing Essendon crumbled.

Judd, Ablett, Lenny Hayes are all guns, but Bartel by a mile for mine. He is so deceiving: he looks slow, small, has a friendly face, and most of his kicks barely reavel 40m. But whenever the game needs to be won there he is outmarking bigger blokes, crunching packs, tacling, kicking goals from outside 50 etc... Absolute match winner and rarely plays poorly.

Out: Sellar, Green (inj), Moloney IN: Bartram, Martin, ... I can't do this tonight, too annoyed.

I am definitely not saying trade Watts, or that there is no hope for him. After three years of watching him I am left with an important question - how can we add intensity and aggression into his game? With them he could be a superstar: without them another also-ran.

Before I give my votes, I have to mention that I would love to give Bail and Nicho votes but they absolutely butchered the ball on too many occasions. 6 - T. McDonald 5 - McKenzie 4 - Clark 3 - Jones 2 - Rivers 1 - Blease

I don't accept it is fitness. I went to 9 - 10 pre-season training sessions and saw them struggling early on, but after the Christmas break they seemed to be coping OK with it all. And if a player gets really tired, go back and kick long near the boundary. ll playerw are tired in the last quarter - the sub system sees to that. It seems that we execute poorly under no pressure.

I am such a Watts fan and really want him to make it, but some of his efforts today were... limp is the best word I can think of. He is playing limp footy. But it is getting frustrating. In the last quarter he went back into the play, took a mark and got 50 metres from Betts. This showed good courage and good reading of the play. In the same quarter he chose not to go for a mark about 30 metres out for goal when he had a perfect run at it and would have jumped over the other people pushing and shoving. And that lazy, limp kick out that led to a goal summed up the attitude he displays too often. He has got every skill, unique peripheral vision, can rack up possessions because of his reading of the play and can run as quick as any other bigger forward but lacks urgency and intensity. This was on full display today. Do we make him learn at AFL level or make him discover these traits in the VFL?

I cannot accurately communicate how furious I am after being 16 points down at 3/4 time and equalling the Blues for most of the first three quarters, only to be beathen by 10 goals. I refuse to accept it is fitness and I refuse to accept it is game plan. How many chest marks did we drop without any pressure? The players run and spread into the right position, and people like Bail, McKenzie and Watts do pathetic, dinky little short passes that miss the mark by 5 metrres and we get burned on the turnover. This is not fitness, game plan, coaching or any other of these kind of of factors. It is concentration and maintaining skills. In the last quarter, we dropped chest marks, got outmarked by smaller opponents, and rediscovered the wonderful gtift of handballing behind players who were running andfree. I am #$%&@# furious over this loss. We were in it with a good chance of winning it!!! And don't get me started on Watts decision not to fly for the mark in the last quarter. He CHOSE not to go and they ran it out two versus one.

Agree that it is not the most inspiring list of players - no one in there that Carlton have to plan for or fear. Sellar - sorry, but he is not worth a spot. Very lucky Martin is still recovering. Davis - great to see him included. He has looked really good at Casey and will be good on the small frowards (I hope) J MacDonald - has got some get up and go, but he inspires little confidence. Bail - I really like this bloke but he has lost the fire in the belly that produced gut-running bursts in 2011. I hope he can ignite Dunn - Sorry, I have had enough of this bloke Tapscott - leave him in the side for the remainder of 2012. Stop the in-out, in-out. Allow him to play into form. Nicholson - has got some serious hunger but is the worst kick in our squad, with the exception of Jake Spencer. His unforced errors for Casey are getting mentions from ABC commentators. Feel a bit sorry for Morton. I agree with another poster who reckons he has probably broken one of the non-negotiable values, because he has been good over the previous 4 weeks (Sydney aside) I have no idea what to expect this week - at least I can't get my hopes dashed!!

Barty and Rivers have both improved by foot this year, or at least it seems that way. Can anyone provide efficiency stats from 2011 and compare 2012 to verify whether we are clutching at straws or seeing genuine improvement?

I have just finished watching the press conference with Jack Grimes. Very impressed. He stood there and took all questions - easy, tough and stupid (and yes, some of the questions by the journos were sooo dumb). He might be young but his character strength is the steadiest, most upfront leadership I have seen since Junior was pushed aside. Maybe we got the right man for the job?!?

Clinton Young - definite yes. Outside pace and great footskills Brad Sewell - even though I really rate him, I would rather invest in Viney and poor ever-injured Gysberts.

Good call. I am not too sure about Couch who is in the same mould as Magner, Jones and Moloney but Gysberts and Strauss should be in our best 22. Although I recognise that our midfield lacks class at times, and we also need one player with super pace, our problem is not in the players on the park. Look at Sydney's 22 and man-by-man we match them. It is the team football we play. Our forward spread and teamwork around stoppages is sub-par. If and when we start to get this right we will beat sides like Sydney, Richmond, Bulldogs etc... I am a bit surprised to Bennell holding his place but maybe the coach saw something I didn't, or was looking for different things.

Get him if he's available - simple as that. He has the three key ingredients: great skills, great work ethic, discipline. Also he seems articulte enough to communicate to the players. Agree with the above post that our midfield development went downhill after Ratten left.

I wouldn't say I am confident, or buoyant, or overly hopeful but I also reckon we do have a genuine chance here. Goodes out is huge in our favour and I reckon player by player we are equal to them. It is the team-work where we struggle. I feel better about this game than I have about most of the games this year so at least I will be able to watch it without knowing we will get done beforehand.

Watching Casey on TV: Get Jurrah to the Dees ASAP. He is excitement and intensity in everything he does It is a mistake playing Watts, Green, Tapscott, Blease, Jurrah in the twos. They might not be in great AFL form but they are all far too good for the VFL. They are all a class above. Just leave them in the Dees and let them grow, playing multiple games together. Lucas Cook is interesting. I don't reckon his fitness is great, but could he do any worse than Martin, Fitzpatrick have offered?

Generally speaking the first instinct of our players over the past 6 weeks has been to tackle and defend. On a number of occasions last night players stood back and waited to respond to the plays Hawthorn initiated. And this is really boring footy. Our initiative is mostly non-existent. Our creativity is mostly non-existent. Our forward spread is embarassing.

6. Bartram 5. Clark 4. Magner 3. Jones 2. McKenzie 1. Jamar

Great point made twice now by Tom Harley. It is those players and setups 3 - 7 metres away from the stoppages. Hawthorn continually have 3 players free in a group just off the play and our players are - again - drawn to the contest leaving free opposition players. Are our players not playing to the game plan or is the stoppage instructions poor?

I am so sick of journalists, commentators, special comments people and every other football opinionater in the country talking about Melbourne's 1-percenters, intentsity, structures, defensive efforts. It is gut wrenching to watch the game at the moment because 1) we just can't get the ball. 2) If and when we do get it we cannot kick. I will force myself to watch the remainder of the game, and who knows what could happen, but it is sheer agony.

Two things needed against the Hawks: Big bodies and brains. Small bodies get pushed off the ball, and dumb footballers get confused. IN: Bennell, Fitzpatrick (he might not be too smart but Sellar has been awful) OUT: Sellar, Dunn Can't believe people calling for Bail, Trengove, Tapscott, Magner and Moloney to be dropped.

6 - Clark 5 - Frawley 4 - Jones 3 - Moloney 2 - Morton 1 - McDonald

Dear Dr Who, It appears you are another person who believes your generation (whichever one it is) has a monopoly on understanding the current day correctly. You are probaly under 30 and think "if only all those old people would stop stuffing up the world - look at the mistakes they made..." You are no more right in your views than the next person but seem to have taken some sort of intelligence high ground because of some preconcieved opinion about your own intelligence. Oscar Wilde once wrote "the problem with youth is it is wasted on the young". All these "old people" and "Brighton people" you so quickly dismiss, along with what you consider their opinions to be, demonstrates your narrow-minded bigotry toward your fellow Dees supporters. Youth, or new thinking, or new methods are never THE answer but can often be part of AN answer. BTW - I still have no idea what your first post had to do with Dangerfield!!

I hate Americanisms also but if you hate it so much, why did you spell Americanise with a "z"? Language is never static and changes all the time. We are at a high point of American language influence that began post WW2, and you just watch Chinese language nuances start to meld in with English now that China is fast becoming the most influential nation in the world, especially in terms of finance. We could use regions, zones, divisions... whatever word you like, but I reckon the bacis idea is right on the money. One of the AFL's main focus is on the finances within the game to support and grow it so they are not looking for a fair draw or a level playing field. They are looking for exposure and the $ that comes from it. The idea has merit and should at the very least be explored.